View Full Version : Police, Brococks & FACs
We had a talk at work today from a DC FLO from the Mets South London Firearms Enquiry Team.
A very interesting talk - he discussed the process of applying for a FAC and commented that FAC holders were the most law abiding group of people in the community.
He also talked about the Brocock ban and mentioned that due to the poor publicity thousands of people are unaware of the change in the law (apparently the Met has received just 400 Brocock FAC applications and only a handful of pistols handed in). He said that even RFDs only received a poorly photocopied sheet summarising the change in the law and suggested, in light of that, that we apply discretion when considering arrest for possession of a Brocock without a FAC - something which I fully intend should I come across a Brocock in otherwise innocent circumstances.
He also went on to say that every piece of anti-gun legislation has been followed by a rise in gun crime and that the Met have pointed this out to HM Govt at every consultative meeting.
It would appear that the Met as an organisation is far from anti - shooting (in fact quite pro) but the Non Listening Govt don't apparently listen to us, either.
19-05-2004, 08:29 PM
Intersting post Dave, I guess it's (somewhat) good news in terms of the MET's take on things.
Pity about the government which we all know has no interest in reality, just perception, spin and self fulfilment :(
19-05-2004, 08:55 PM
THERE IS A VERY REAL DANGER HERE if you are relying upon the generosity of the police not to prosecute for holding a non licenced weapon.
A basic principle of the application of the law of the land is ignorance of the law is NO DEFENSE should you be prosectuted.
I am really angry that Tacs were banned in the first place especially as NO ONE can tell me EXACTLY how many brocock revolvers were illegally converted into firearms AND the fact that such a conversion was ALREADY ILLEGAL under existing firearms legislation. Nor could understand why CO2 was an FAC weapon if it produced an energy level below the UK legal limit. Ok they banned hand guns and gave us co2 but who is the loser on that deal eh !
I am even more ANNOYED that HMGvt has done practically Sweet FA to inform all holders of these weapons that they are now potentially facing a 5 year stretch and a criminal conviction to boot which will have MAJOR implications on your day to day life. This will range from having to declare a crim conviction to get insurances (all types) to getting jobs, credit, passport, visa's.........get my drift. All because of an uprated spud gun (Ok I know thats an exaggeration but FFS...
I agree it would be very hard indeed if such action is taken against anyone especially if the are on the fringes of the shooting community or have acquired a tac as a present or similar and it is sitting in a sock drawer waiting for the police to find it.
The point is that the individual feelings of police officers, FLO's or whoever is COMPLETLY IRRELEVANT as their opinion will not stop the final decision to proceed and apply the to its full effect.
Someone is going to get there fingers seriously burnt here and all due to the Govt's unbelievable and gross negligence.
(Gets off soap box and heads for cold shower and a pint of horlicks).....
I agree wholeheartedly with everything Steyr says - I'm simply reporting what I was told today.
My advice to anyone still in possession of an unregistered Brocock is to get rid of it.
19-05-2004, 10:04 PM
until the first unlucky sod gets caught with one!
because the new law states that regardless he/ she gets 5 yrs!
no if's or but's , ITS IN BLACK AND WHITE 5YRS!
no small print, or leniancy shown, but however!
ill gaurantee the defence lawyer is goint to argue the fact that it was not adequately advetised!
then the whole thing is going to end up in the european courts!
i just had the local FLO round tonight, nearly passed out when he saw the lee enfield mk iv
then he was totally gob smacked that the fact TACS came in different sizes!
hed never seen the larger (.303 for the lee enfield)
and as for the micro tacs, he was enlightened to put it lightly!
anyway rant over, keep up the fight!
19-05-2004, 10:30 PM
It's also in black and white in section 5(2) of the commencement order, that people still applying or appealing on or after 1st May will still be able to keep their SCAC guns.
But both the Mets & Hampshire police have confiscated guns during application and prior to appeal.
At present there are two section 5/1/AF dealers in the country (Brococks plus one other), so if they try to snatch yours, you'll have to get your guns to one of these dealers before they get to you. Once lodged there, you will not be allowed access to them without the correct FAC, but you will be allowed to get them exported. But the main thing is that the police will then need a court order to get them destroyed.
There are several existing section 5 dealers who have applied for SCAC to be added to their tickets but most won't get it untill the end of the month when their licences are renewed.
Good luck to everyone applying for FAC's.
20-05-2004, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by DJP
"My advice to anyone ....... is to get rid of it.
Quite. And how will they do this?
1. Hand it over to local police - at risk/concern of being locked up for 5 years.
2. Drop in local canal/river/Beachy Head - where there remains risk that it will fall in to wrong hands or, worse, be found by kids who'll then (waving it around in street) be on receiving end of Armed Response Unit!
3. Mention it down the local pub and have it 'bought' - maybe get £50 for it - by a far more undesirable customer ...... who WILL use it (converted to live fire or not) to raid the post office/bank.
Any of above will increase incidents of RECORDED GUN CRIME and reinforce Blair's reason for banning them in the 1st place.
Can't win, won't win. :mad: :mad:
'nother rant over
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