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throdgrain
05-10-2004, 09:10 PM
Sorry, more info needed :)
Just what is the difference between a Walther cp88 and CP99 ? I would have imagined the '99 to be the newer one, but it seems cheaper than the 88. Anyone out there know ?
Cheers :)

SWAT Strachan
05-10-2004, 09:17 PM
The CP88 is a copy of the Walther P88, the CP99 is a copy of the Walther P99, it doesn't get much more simple than that :D. Both guns are still in production but they do have differences.

The CP99 can be bought in either all plastic (the CP99 Sport) or metal slide version. The Sport can only be fired double-action though, as there's no cocking mechanism and the hammer is internal. The metal slide version though can be cocked and fired single-action. However both models suffer from low power, partly because they use a revolver action for feeding pellets (8 shot rotary mag) but also because the CP99s have removeable valve assemblies (in the CO2 clip).

The CP88 is also a rotary mag, but as the CO2 valve is fixed, it has slightly higher power. But the CP88 is a double or single action pistol with an external hammer. In my opinion, the CP99 is the better looking pistol, but the CP88 is the better to shoot. You can also get a barrel extension for the CP88 from 4" to 6".

throdgrain
05-10-2004, 09:51 PM
Is there anything else that looks as good , and is multi-shot, ie co2 ? The only other gun im considering is the Anics Skif, but Im still not sure, I dont know wether that long barrel is removable on the Skif.
Sorry to be a pain in the ass !

SWAT Strachan
05-10-2004, 10:05 PM
If you want a good alternative multishot CO2 pistol, then the only realy (affordable) choice is the Smith & Wesson 6" or 8" revolver. It's accuracy is well proven and it has a 10 shot mag instead of the 8 shot found in most of the Umarex clones.

The barrels on the S&W are interchangeable, so you can find which suits you best (mine's the 8" nickel version). The standard sights are fully adjustable for windage and elevation and the sight blade is replaceable with different size units. However you can easily replace the open sights with either an 11mm rail or a Weaver one, then mount the red-dot sight of your choice. Hell you can even get silencers and shoulder stocks for them! (note: shoulder stock not allowed in comps). Personally I wouldn't go for the Skiff (I do have one though ;) ), although it's a 28 shot pistol, that trigger pull is just WAY too heavy to make it practical for competitions, good for informal plinking though. Pellet jams can be a right pain in the %&$ as well.

Most members of this BBS will attest to the quality of the S&W pistols. There are other pistols you could consider, such as the Rohm Twinmaster / Trainer range, but they're less adaptable and more expensive. The Steyr LP5 is a fun little semi-auto pistol that can rattle off 5 shots in the blink of an eye, but you'll need a second mortgage to buy one :D.

Hope that's of some help.

fullmetaljacket
06-10-2004, 03:52 AM
Externally the Skif is quite similar to the CP99, particularly around the grip area. The Brocock version with the longer barrel is not removable, and it's not a silencer either.

DJP
06-10-2004, 04:56 AM
The CP88 and 99 are frustrating little pistols: Look good, shoot cr@p. I agree with SWAT - if you wanna hit what you aim at then get a S&W. They're leagues ahead of most other CO2 pistols.

franktheferret
06-10-2004, 05:17 AM
For me the S&W is the best CO2 pistol I've ever had, and I've had lots of them. It is accurate and reliable . I like the sights, the balance, and the simple fact that if you need to take a more precise and studied shot, you can simply cock the hammer without losing aim. I also find the trigger to be one of the best.

Darren Petts
06-10-2004, 07:03 AM
S&W IS the best of the modern pistols but still pales next to a 40+ year old Crosman 600.

throdgrain
06-10-2004, 07:15 AM
Well, Im not really interested in competative shooting, its just plinking really.Ive seen the S&W, it looks so huge though.
Im still undecided ,but Im still leaning towards a CP99... I assume the Gamo pistols arn't up to much?

Saton
06-10-2004, 07:37 AM
Iv got a berreta 92Fs it shoots great easy to use and is all metal with wooden grips.

Darren Petts
06-10-2004, 07:38 AM
If you try a CP99 and a S&W side by side the Cp99 won't be picked up twice.

barnesr
06-10-2004, 08:23 AM
I've got a CP99 and its great fun for plinking with, you just keep squeezing that trigger and watching the tin cans fly. As its CO2 its easier to load than a springer, enabling children to use it (under supervision of course).

If its just for back garden plinking at tin cans and the such, then you won't be disapointed with a CP99. If you want to do some target shooting then go for something else.

broony
06-10-2004, 08:50 AM
Has anybody got any info on the "remanufactured" Crosman CO2 pistols at JSR.at 30quid they seem a bargain.Or is it that they're only worth 30 quid?

throdgrain
06-10-2004, 09:39 AM
'Tis only for plinking really. Bugger it, its getting closer :(

Streff
06-10-2004, 12:11 PM
I have a S&W (6"), a Skiff and a Beretta 92fs - my personal favorite is the Smith.
I never use the other two for any competitive shooting, but i do plink in the back garden range with them, their fine for 10m work, but dont have the accuracy/power for distance stuff. The 92fs is the looker of the bunch though. :p

broony
06-10-2004, 01:52 PM
Amen to that.

Skimmer
06-10-2004, 05:42 PM
I have the CP88, and also the Beretta92F and the Walther PPK and Makarov 654k.

The CP88 is the best of the bunch for accuracy, but the Beretta feels much better in the hand. The PPK is great fun - but not accurate at all. The Makarov is more accurate than the PPK because it doesnt blow back, but it does have a pretty ropey trigger.

My favourite - is the CP88

Only problems I know of are CP88 slide release catch sometimes rotates to far and sticks. The PPK return spring bends easily and does need replacing now and again. The Makarov would probably work if you filled it full of treacle! Very substantial! The Beretta has seen no problems.

Streff
06-10-2004, 10:44 PM
I've seen a few problems with some of the CP88's during fast reloading, the magazine not indexing correctly, and causing a jam. easily fixed, but annoying. I've never had that problem with the Beretta, even though its a similar setup... not sure if its exactly the same though.

Never had a reload problem with the Smith & Wesson or the Skiff, though the Skiff has a delicate metal plate on the magazine that could be prone to bending...

Mike Pearce
07-10-2004, 12:27 PM
If you can wait there's another pistol about to appear on the scene.

Its the Anics A9000 & is a Beretta look-alike with a new 22 shot mag.

Aparently it's trigger is much better than the original Anics & you can get 3 mags to the CO2 capsule. If it's as good as promised, it should be a very good little pistol.

throdgrain
07-10-2004, 03:03 PM
Any idea how long before that comes out ? It could be ideal :)

abbo
07-10-2004, 06:37 PM
If you can wait there's another pistol about to appear on the scene.
Its the Anics A9000 & is a Beretta look-alike with a new 22 shot mag.

Hmmm, must remember that. I recall reading something about a new model when they moved factories last year.


Well, Im not really interested in competative shooting, its just plinking really.Ive seen the S&W, it looks so huge though.
Im still undecided ,but Im still leaning towards a CP99... I assume the Gamo pistols arn't up to much?
Plinking is more fun if you can actually hit what you are aiming at occasionally. Yes, the S&W is huge. I guess that the folks in Texas, who the original model was made for, must have very big right hands for some reason. :confused: But the gun is well balanced and very accurate, you get used to the feel of it after a while.

Streff
07-10-2004, 08:36 PM
I think the trick with the S&W is to hold it far higher up than you would expect, lining up your hand with the top end of the grip, rather than holding it where it would "seem" logical, as the front end is hella heavy, and will droop faster than the proverbial brewer.

It is a big gun, but the weight and general size really help make it a steady, accurate and reliable shooting iron.

(and no, i'm not getting sales commision. :( )

Skimmer
07-10-2004, 11:56 PM
JUST AN OPINION - As what you are asking really is a bit subjective.

The P88 is a copy of the handgun Walther created with the target market of the USAforces handgun competition - later won by Beretta. The P88 was Walthers first ever gun that moved away from their own barrel locking system and adopted the more standard Browning blowback system.

Much to Walthers dismay - the US decided it would have prefered Walther to offer one of its previous system!

The P99 was fairly rushed in - as an alternative, offering more modern technology, including polymer frame options, accessory rail, streamlined latches and safety for ease of holstering etc. It also offered a positive "cocked" indicator, not present on the Umarex copy.

The P99 has not proved a popular style for most - apparently because it may appear more "Toy" in appearance, and not meeting most peoples Idea of what a gun looks like. Its fair to say both models have not had "booming" commercial sales successes as real firearms - which limits the appeal for those seeking a replica.

Both Umarex versions use the same rotary mag, the CP88 delivers a bit more power - not much. The advantages of the P99 would be the CO2 bulb being housed in a drop magazine, and the mag release catches at the rear of the trigger guard.

Walther have now dropped the P88, but are still offering a variety of P99's including .22, sport, DA only and various other flavours.

One point of interest is that Umarex are launching (already available in the USA), a custom laser unit for the CP99, which actually uses the forward accessory rail, and styles in nicely with the shape of the gun. It will be in the UK by Xmas apparently and would make a nice add-on. They also do the Nighthawk "tactical abominations with all sorts of stuff bolted on.

Pays ya money - takes your choice. I chose the CP88 - and have enjoyed it a lot, but the CP99 is tempting again with the new laser coming along.

clubshot
08-10-2004, 08:49 AM
You get what you pay for these day's especially with Gamo :(

CP99 looks great , but valving makes it good for a couple of magazines then you will have trouble as power drops until gas warms up

CP88 is a much better valving and better constancy

But the 8 shot magazines often wear and loose teeth resulting in bad pellet engement.

My Favourite and most peaople I have up on the Range is the 6in Smith

I have a Anics Skiff , great in competitions , but end up with sore fingers after competitions.

The F1 is a longer barrel to give more power , still same trigger , heavy.

And Yes I do have Licensed Brocock Pistols ;)

www.practicalpistoluk.com

For pistols Shooters that want to do more than plink ;)

But recently got into Shooting .44 Underlever Rifle , Gallery Style so it's another world ;)

BOB/R

barnesr
08-10-2004, 11:59 AM
A question for all you Smith & Wesson owners out there. Is the S&W 6 " powerful enough to knock over the metal boar knockdown target that is widely available. I ask because my Webley Hurricane can knock it over at a reasonable range but my CO2 powered CP99 doesn't have the power to knock the metal target over.