HFT Quiz

[mattinlondon]

A few things came to light at the Woofters over the weekend when I was chatting with some fellow competitors.

Now this is not a dig at any competitor, competition, organiser or organisation, its just a bit of fun and hopefully may educate some of us!


What do you think the result from the following situations are;


Situation 1

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, when attempting to lay down, "bang", accidentally fires pellet 3 feet over the firing line (rifle not shouldered)

Situation 2

Shooter cocks rifle, forgets to load pellet or pellet falls out, closes bolt, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang"

Situation 3

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, leaves bolt open, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang", pellet discharges 10 feet over firing line

Situation 4

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, shoulders rifle but doesn't look through scope, knocks rifle against a tree (its a stander) "bang", pellet goes into bushes 50 yards away

Situation 5

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, fires, "bang", kills target, looks up to see a "Kneeling Only" sign above him. (Sorry Chris:D, in this one none of his shooting partners had noticed the sign either as they were "in the groove", they would have told him had they noticed)

So what is the outcome of the 5 situations, lets say in the strictest form of the rules, say the 2020 Olympics, I know we would all interpret the above a little differently if it was a friendly sunday morning shoot with your mates

And as I said above, this is only a bit of fun...:D

[Gold]

1) Disqualification for ND
2) Zero score and much ribbing
3) As 2
4) As 1
5) Free specsavers vouchers all round

Atb
Cliff :D

[Weevie]

A few things came to light at the Woofters over the weekend when I was chatting with some fellow competitors.

Now this is not a dig at any competitor, competition, organiser or organisation, its just a bit of fun and hopefully may educate some of us!


What do you think the result from the following situations are;


Situation 1

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, when attempting to lay down, "bang", accidentally fires pellet 3 feet over the firing line (rifle not shouldered)

Situation 2

Shooter cocks rifle, forgets to load pellet or pellet falls out, closes bolt, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang"

Situation 3

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, leaves bolt open, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang", pellet discharges 10 feet over firing line

Situation 4

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, shoulders rifle but doesn't look through scope, knocks rifle against a tree (its a stander) "bang", pellet goes into bushes 50 yards away

Situation 5

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, fires, "bang", kills target, looks up to see a "Kneeling Only" sign above him. (Sorry Chris:D, in this one none of his shooting partners had noticed the sign either as they were "in the groove", they would have told him had they noticed)

So what is the outcome of the 5 situations, lets say in the strictest form of the rules, say the 2020 Olympics, I know we would all interpret the above a little differently if it was a friendly sunday morning shoot with your mates

And as I said above, this is only a bit of fun...:D

A not-so-fun zero for every situation I'd have said.

Unless the shooter states they are going to discharge the shot deliberately it's a miss.

[Steve L]

Situation 1

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, when attempting to lay down, "bang", accidentally fires pellet 3 feet over the firing line (rifle not shouldered)

I would like to say take it again, but the rules say you get a 0 i believe.
Situation 2

Shooter cocks rifle, forgets to load pellet or pellet falls out, closes bolt, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang"

Doughnut i'm afraid
Situation 3

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, leaves bolt open, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang", pellet discharges 10 feet over firing line
Doughnut again
Situation 4

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, shoulders rifle but doesn't look through scope, knocks rifle against a tree (its a stander) "bang", pellet goes into bushes 50 yards away
Same as answer 1
Situation 5

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, fires, "bang", kills target, looks up to see a "Kneeling Only" sign above him. (Sorry Chris, in this one none of his shooting partners had noticed the sign either as they were "in the groove", they would have told him had they noticed)
Same as answer 1 again

In the rules i'm pretty sure they are all doughnuts, if it was a non-badge/trophy comp i'd prob let them slide though, UKAHFT/SHS/SIHFT then they are 0, young Beth forgot to load a pellet at the Oaks for the SIHFT, that cost her a doughnut :(

[snapcapblue]

A few things came to light at the Woofters over the weekend when I was chatting with some fellow competitors.

Now this is not a dig at any competitor, competition, organiser or organisation, its just a bit of fun and hopefully may educate some of us!


What do you think the result from the following situations are;


Situation 1

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, when attempting to lay down, "bang", accidentally fires pellet 3 feet over the firing line (rifle not shouldered)

Situation 2

Shooter cocks rifle, forgets to load pellet or pellet falls out, closes bolt, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang"

Situation 3

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, leaves bolt open, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang", pellet discharges 10 feet over firing line

Situation 4

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, shoulders rifle but doesn't look through scope, knocks rifle against a tree (its a stander) "bang", pellet goes into bushes 50 yards away

Situation 5

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, fires, "bang", kills target, looks up to see a "Kneeling Only" sign above him. (Sorry Chris:D, in this one none of his shooting partners had noticed the sign either as they were "in the groove", they would have told him had they noticed)

So what is the outcome of the 5 situations, lets say in the strictest form of the rules, say the 2020 Olympics, I know we would all interpret the above a little differently if it was a friendly sunday morning shoot with your mates

And as I said above, this is only a bit of fun...:D Hi you've been spying on me; come on admit it. :D Zeroes all round is my bet:) Tony

[never too old]

:DTotal ban for life, that way i might win something:D

[Scooby]

It's the same result for all five.......you get a zero

There's no interpretation at all, it goes back to the same rule.....if the rifle goes bang then the shot has been taken & the target will be scored appropriately.

The only exception is if you wish to fire a shot into the ground & this should only ever be done after informing your partner.

Any other outcome in an event being run to UKAHFT rules is going against the rules & I'm afraid would have to be classed as cheating.

This may seem harsh but many of these situations can easily be used to benefit some shooters, I could miss a target completely & then claim there was no pellet in the rifle or I could go prone on a kneeler to see where to aim then take the shot again kneeling. The rules are there to ensure that everyone is competing on a level playing field, if people start interpreting the rules as they seem fit then it becomes unfair as people will interpret them differently & some will use it to their advantage.

[mattinlondon]

It's the same result for all five.......you get a zero

There's no interpretation at all, it goes back to the same rule.....if the rifle goes bang then the shot has been taken & the target will be scored appropriately.

The only exception is if you wish to fire a shot into the ground & this should only ever be done after informing your partner.

Any other outcome in an event being run to UKAHFT rules is going against the rules & I'm afraid would have to be classed as cheating.

This may seem harsh but many of these situations can easily be used to benefit some shooters, I could miss a target completely & then claim there was no pellet in the rifle or I could go prone on a kneeler to see where to aim then take the shot again kneeling. The rules are there to ensure that everyone is competing on a level playing field, if people start interpreting the rules as they seem fit then it becomes unfair as people will interpret them differently & some will use it to their advantage.


I hope everyone taking part in HFT comps past and future reads this Pete!!!

No names...............bla..bla:D

[Mog]

2 points for each situation, possibly 3 if you're having a bad day :D

Matt, why do you bother posting in other parts of the forum? you should realise by now that they'll all get moved to the 'Naughty Boys Corner' :D:eek::p

[Kingplinker]

Atlast something that wasn't my fault , I wasn't there and I have an alibi ! :D

In my opinion Matt it's the same for all of the above mate , a big fat zero ;)

atvb

Dave

[Alegazmoz]

It's the same result for all five.......you get a zero

There's no interpretation at all, it goes back to the same rule.....if the rifle goes bang then the shot has been taken & the target will be scored appropriately.

The only exception is if you wish to fire a shot into the ground & this should only ever be done after informing your partner.

Any other outcome in an event being run to UKAHFT rules is going against the rules & I'm afraid would have to be classed as cheating.

This may seem harsh but many of these situations can easily be used to benefit some shooters, I could miss a target completely & then claim there was no pellet in the rifle or I could go prone on a kneeler to see where to aim then take the shot again kneeling. The rules are there to ensure that everyone is competing on a level playing field, if people start interpreting the rules as they seem fit then it becomes unfair as people will interpret them differently & some will use it to their advantage.

Big Game Temprament
Some have it, some haven't, some think they have and take it hard when they find out they haven't. ...................... innit Mr Smiff?

arf!
:D

[Simple]

doughnut's mmmmmmm

[averageplinker]

Hang head in shame, stop wearing anything camouflaged, sell all shooting gear and take up Golf!:eek::D;):p
ATB Rich.
PS If you get a nought for firing without a pellet when you have no chance of hitting the target surely you should get minus one for missing when a pellet is fired and at least has a chance of hitting home:confused::D

[CoolId]

Please excuse my interjection as a mere FT shooter, but I do think you should all give consideration to Gold's interpretation of Situation 1

1) Disqualification for ND

Range safety is something you can never have too much of

Regards

Dave

[Scooby]

Please excuse my interjection as a mere FT shooter, but I do think you should all give consideration to Gold's interpretation of Situation 1

1) Disqualification for ND

Range safety is something you can never have too much of

Regards

Dave

I've seen the same thing happen in FT Dave a few times, never seen them DQ'd though:rolleyes:;)

[mattinlondon]

Hang head in shame, stop wearing anything camouflaged, sell all shooting gear and take up Golf!:eek::D;):p
ATB Rich.
PS If you get a nought for firing without a pellet when you have no chance of hitting the target surely you should get minus one for missing when a pellet is fired and at least has a chance of hitting home:confused::D

Gave up golf to take up shooting................:(

Knitting anyone?

[mattinlondon]

Big Game Temprament
Some have it, some haven't, some think they have and take it hard when they find out they haven't. ...................... innit Mr Smiff?

arf!
:D

Must a northern thing, certainly doesnt travel outside Sussex does it?

[Feral]

Gave up golf to take up shooting................:(

Knitting anyone?

Fishing on Sunday instead Maffew? :eek:

[Prone Shooter]

Similar answers to Steve and my answers are not based on UKAHFT rules but on the rule that we (supposedly) do this for fun;)


What do you think the result from the following situations are;


Situation 1

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, when attempting to lay down, "bang", accidentally fires pellet 3 feet over the firing line (rifle not shouldered)

I'd allow another chance.

Situation 2

Shooter cocks rifle, forgets to load pellet or pellet falls out, closes bolt, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang"

Zero - it's not an accident, it's not being careful.


Situation 3

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, leaves bolt open, shoulders rifle, takes aim, fires, "bang", pellet discharges 10 feet over firing line


Zero - it's not an accident, it's not being careful.

Situation 4

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, shoulders rifle but doesn't look through scope, knocks rifle against a tree (its a stander) "bang", pellet goes into bushes 50 yards away

I'd allow another chance.


Situation 5

Shooter cocks rifle, loads pellet, closes bolt, fires, "bang", kills target, looks up to see a "Kneeling Only" sign above him. (Sorry Chris:D, in this one none of his shooting partners had noticed the sign either as they were "in the groove", they would have told him had they noticed)

Another zero as you should have taken more care. Exactly the same scenario as shooting the wrong target.

So what is the outcome of the 5 situations, lets say in the strictest form of the rules, say the 2020 Olympics, I know we would all interpret the above a little differently if it was a friendly sunday morning shoot with your mates

And as I said above, this is only a bit of fun...:D

1 and 4 are accidental discharges, the others muppetry:D

Bob

[jagxkrs]

Lots and lots of luvly donuts and swearing:D

[Gold]

Similar answers to Steve and my answers are not based on UKAHFT rules but on the rule that we (supposedly) do this for fun;)



1 and 4 are accidental discharges, the others muppetry:D

Bob

So an accidental discharge is not muppetry :confused: Negligent discharge, not accidental and completely irresponsible, disqualification for failing to adhere to basic gun safety guidelines,
Atb
Cliff

[skygrowler]

how about the shooter forgets to release the safety , as far as he/she is concerned the shot was taken or not ?

[Steve L]

So an accidental discharge is not muppetry :confused: Negligent discharge, not accidental and completely irresponsible, disqualification for failing to adhere to basic gun safety guidelines,
Atb
Cliff

Very true Cliff & i have had the situation happen to me at a shoot, i was prone & another shooter was slightly behind me on the next peg, loads a pellet & it accidently went off, don't know what happened but it went about 3 feet in front of me :eek: Of course I just carried on, knocked down the target & then asked my shooting partner WT F happened.. he didn't know but it was bleedy close enough for me to watch my back on the next few shots :D

[Steve L]

how about the shooter forgets to release the safety , as far as he/she is concerned the shot was taken or not ?


If no shot has been taken as the saftey is still engaged, flick saftey off & contnue as if you do it all the time :D

[mattinlondon]

OK as Scooby said earlier, if the gun goes "bang" its a shot, end off, no more goes, no retakes, no excuses, all score ZERO........in any comp we should all adhere to these rules, it just isnt fair if you dont! Why should some guy get another go, kill the target and get 2 more points and end up higher on the results?

I know it has happened before (recently) and will happen again Im sure, but I hope not as often in comps as Steve says "that are badge winners"

I love my badgers..................:D

[Prone Shooter]

So an accidental discharge is not muppetry :confused: Negligent discharge, not accidental and completely irresponsible, disqualification for failing to adhere to basic gun safety guidelines,
Atb
Cliff

In both scenarios, the gun is over the firing line and therefore considered safe and has not been sighted. Discharge in any other circumstance would be considered a breach of safety. If its a genuine accidental discharge i'd allow a reload.

As I've said in my first reply, we're supposed to take part in these events for fun. If you've just driven 200 miles to be disquailified or had a chance of a win in those circumstances thwarted for whats effectively an accident then I think you'd have a right to be pissed off.

IMO there's far to many rules being introduced for the sake of introducing rules.

When Hunter FT started you could use any rifle as long as it was legal, you couldn't adjust the gun or any part of it, you had to be touching a peg, not sitting and not resting rifle on bean bag and targets were placed anywhere between 7-45 yards (or thereabouts;)) with a minimum of a 25mm kill. If you sighted the gun and it discharged, the target either fell for a 2, you plated for a 1 or you missed. Simple

I make that 7 rules. It was simple and didn't cause controversy. Everyone knew where they stood and no one pushed the rules that where in place (that I recall anyway:D)

It was more fun in my mind, you turned up to shoot with like minded folk who just wanted to knock over some targets and if they got a good score then great. Clearing a course was unheard of and people didn't expect to get 59 or 60 ex 60.

Rose tinted specs maybe or I'm just getting old and dissolusioned but it did seem less stressful back in the early to mid '90s.

Bob

[Kes]

Please excuse my interjection as a mere FT shooter, but I do think you should all give consideration to Gold's interpretation of Situation 1

1) Disqualification for ND

Range safety is something you can never have too much of

Regards

Dave

I personally think that that would be mean spirited and unnecessary. The safety issue here is that the rifle is pointing down the range at the time and not at anyone. On more than one occasion whilst doing HFT and on aim, I've taken up the first stage and decided to adjust my position/move a tiny bit whilst forgetting to release the pressure on the trigger and ended up squeezing off before I meant to. On one occasion it earned me a zero and the other a 1 pointer. Do you consider that to be an ND as well? It's still an unintentional shot. :cool:

[Weevie]

and ended up squeezing off before I meant to.

I've heard that said about you...:cool:


:D:p:D

[CoolId]

I think there's a subtle distinction here. If the shooter is behaving in a controlled manner, and has the rifle under control and pointing down range, but happens to pull the trigger when they are not quite ready then I'm happy with a doughnut

If the shooter is making a major change in position i.e. in the act of lying down (or sitting in FT) and a loaded non-safe rifle is being waved around and then discharged it's a very different issue

It's much better not to load until you are in position ...

Regards

Dave

[Gold]

In both scenarios, the gun is over the firing line and therefore considered safe and has not been sighted. Discharge in any other circumstance would be considered a breach of safety. If its a genuine accidental discharge i'd allow a reload.

As I've said in my first reply, we're supposed to take part in these events for fun. If you've just driven 200 miles to be disquailified or had a chance of a win in those circumstances thwarted for whats effectively an accident then I think you'd have a right to be pissed off.

IMO there's far to many rules being introduced for the sake of introducing rules.

When Hunter FT started you could use any rifle as long as it was legal, you couldn't adjust the gun or any part of it, you had to be touching a peg, not sitting and not resting rifle on bean bag and targets were placed anywhere between 7-45 yards (or thereabouts;)) with a minimum of a 25mm kill. If you sighted the gun and it discharged, the target either fell for a 2, you plated for a 1 or you missed. Simple

I make that 7 rules. It was simple and didn't cause controversy. Everyone knew where they stood and no one pushed the rules that where in place (that I recall anyway:D)

It was more fun in my mind, you turned up to shoot with like minded folk who just wanted to knock over some targets and if they got a good score then great. Clearing a course was unheard of and people didn't expect to get 59 or 60 ex 60.

Rose tinted specs maybe or I'm just getting old and dissolusioned but it did seem less stressful back in the early to mid '90s.

Bob

In one case yes but in the other as you are lying down i doubt its over the line, having said that it should be pointing downrange anyway.

I understand if the rifle is pointing downrange but i dont care if you have driven 500 miles and are 10 points clear, if you show a blatent disregard for gun safety, not accidental, careless, then you should be disqualified. Try to get the person 3 pegs down with one eye to sympathise that you have driven 200 miles :rolleyes:

I personally think that that would be mean spirited and unnecessary. The safety issue here is that the rifle is pointing down the range at the time and not at anyone. On more than one occasion whilst doing HFT and on aim, I've taken up the first stage and decided to adjust my position/move a tiny bit whilst forgetting to release the pressure on the trigger and ended up squeezing off before I meant to. On one occasion it earned me a zero and the other a 1 pointer. Do you consider that to be an ND as well? It's still an unintentional shot. :cool:

Good point well made Kes, my safety comes off when i am in position and have sighted the shot, its the last thing i do before pulling the trigger, admittedly, not all rifles have safetys,
Atvb
Cliff

[Kes]

I've heard that said about you...:cool:
:D:p:D

The circles you must move in....:rolleyes:

[Prone Shooter]

In one case yes but in the other as you are lying down i doubt its over the line, having said that it should be pointing downrange anyway.

I understand if the rifle is pointing downrange but i dont care if you have driven 500 miles and are 10 points clear, if you show a blatent disregard for gun safety, not accidental, careless, then you should be disqualified. Try to get the person 3 pegs down with one eye to sympathise that you have driven 200 miles :rolleyes:



Cliff


We're getting off track here I think Cliff.

First things first, if I see someone behaving in a dangerous way with no range disipline then they get there marching orders, period!

The original post as I understood it was not directly questioning safety but whether or not they should be allowed to retake the shot and thats how I've answered.

I deliberately didn't bring up the fact that the gun shouldn't have been loaded in the first place because I considered it irrelevent to the question posed. The scenario as I veiwed it would be that the gun would have been loaded when in a kneeling position with the gun pointing down range, no cease fire in place and the shooter in the process of getting into position with the gun still pointing down range, it discharges. No big deal.

Incidentially, have you considered (i'm sure you have;)) whether a springer shooter of slight build or possibly with a minor disability would find it easy or safe to load from a prone position?

Bob

[Prone Shooter]

The circles you must move in....:rolleyes:

Kes, don't:eek:

Just the thought of it:eek::eek::eek::D

Bob

[Gold]

We're getting off track here I think Cliff.

First things first, if I see someone behaving in a dangerous way with no range disipline then they get there marching orders, period!

The original post as I understood it was not directly questioning safety but whether or not they should be allowed to retake the shot and thats how I've answered.

I deliberately didn't bring up the fact that the gun shouldn't have been loaded in the first place because I considered it irrelevent to the question posed. The scenario as I veiwed it would be that the gun would have been loaded when in a kneeling position with the gun pointing down range, no cease fire in place and the shooter in the process of getting into position with the gun still pointing down range, it discharges. No big deal.

Incidentially, have you considered (i'm sure you have;)) whether a springer shooter of slight build or possibly with a minor disability would find it easy or safe to load from a prone position?

Bob

Point taken Bob ;)
Atb
Cliff

[levidog]

Why are you even discussing this :confused:

Rules is rules, just stick to them or don't enter. Easy :cool:

[Gold]

Why are you even discussing this :confused:

Rules is rules, just stick to them or don't enter. Easy :cool:

Because we can :p Rules ARE rules and i dont mind, 2 doughnuts = a pair of binos, i know :D OO
Atb
Cliff

[Alegazmoz]

Why are you even discussing this :confused:

Rules is rules, just stick to them or don't enter. Easy :cool:

Rule 7.

You may not whinge, nor whine, or moan,
For if you must, then stay at home.

soon to be adopted nationally, next the world.

arf!
:D

[Mog]

Rule 7.




You may not whinge, nor whine, or moan,
For if you must, then stay at home.

soon to be adopted nationally, next the world.

arf!

:D


Silly boy! UK & Worldwide is the next section down ;)

[Alegazmoz]

Silly boy! UK & Worldwide is the next section down ;)

I'm feddappadis ................ I thought this was a safe haven, like Smiffy's wallet.

arf!
:D

[Mog]

You going to Rock Lane today?

[Alegazmoz]

You going to Rock Lane today?

I was, .......... just got a call in Eastbourne, post off some parts, collect some gas and pellets for IPAS from Mojo in Polegate, ........... may not have time.

:mad:

[blackscale]

I'm feddappadis ................ I thought this was a safe haven, like Smiffy's wallet.

arf!
:D

:rolleyes:...Now THAT WAS Funny!!:D:D

XX

[chink]

doughnuts the lot of em:p

[Alegazmoz]

doughnuts the lot of em:p

We'll 'ave anything wiv an 'ole mate ...........

arf!
:D

[steve prime]

ANSWERS:
Bang your head against the nearest hard object,use the word S**t and ensure the card marker has entered the donuts correctly:rolleyes::D:D:D