Long range airgun shooting

[Davey K]

Interesting discussion this - I think, if you pick the bones out of the sceptics argument, you will find that they are not denying that sub inch 100 yard groups (or 1.5" 150 yards FAC) are technically achievable. Stands to sense if you put enough pellets down range in five shot groups on a perfect day, eventually (after a few days) you'll get some to group under the magic inch. I expect this is what the long-shooting weekend will show.

BUT the real deal with this is that you are simply shooting a small number of shots at a fixed point and then landing the pellets in a group on a sheet of paper. It demonstrates the ability of your equipment more than anything else. What is in considerable doubt is the ability to consistently land pellets on a specific target at these ranges i.e. reading the wind over this distance and making an individual adjustment to each shot to land it in a bullseye in a group under one inch. As the original poster indicated, he needed 150 shots to land 10 in a group on his paper. Sniper Wolf did some brilliant shooting but as stated by Buddy Boy, his group was nearly 2".

Is it possible to achieve sub 1 inch groups consistently whilst also landing your shots on a specific target area with a sub 12ft lb rifle? I don't think so.

I'd love to be wrong, but I've got to agree with Terry, Gary and Ben, wind is the factor, and not just wind, breeze, light breeze and even the slightest shift in the air. It will take your pellets left and right or up and down and, while they may still group, they will not land consistently on the target.

This is why Harry ruffled so many feathers, he claimed to be able to combine grouping at range with pin-point accuracy on a target area and then use this skill to take down live prey. I'm not dismissing his claims because I am not able to make a judgement on the weather conditions in an elevated location in Australia but I very much doubt he would be able to demonstrate his findings in this country.

Looking forward to seeing where this one goes!

[Terry D]

... i dont shoot above 80 yds with an air rifle, and i dont have a FAC rated one to try, but if a sub 12ft/lb rifle can consistantly and humanly drop quarry at 80 yds and below then i dont disbelieve that a weapon with almost X3 the power cant do it!

Erm...can we clarify this point before it all kicks off, Kenny?

Are you saying you shoot live quarry out to 80 yards with a sub-12 rifle?

Sorry if I've misconstrued, I've been up since 5 am.

All the best.

[Born Again]

Erm...can we clarify this point before it all kicks off, Kenny?

Are you saying you shoot live quarry out to 80 yards with a sub-12 rifle?

Sorry if I've misconstrued, I've been up since 5 am.

All the best.

A valid point, but are you highlighting it to deflect attention from the subject of Harry ?

Just asking, like.

[Terry D]

A valid point, but are you highlighting it to deflect attention from the subject of Harry ?

Just asking, like.

Why would I do that, Brian?

I'm highlighting it to avoid confusion. Clarification helps on that front, surely?

[Born Again]

Why would I do that, Brian?

Why indeed, I'm at a loss as to why there has been such vilification of Harry.

Why not restore the thread with the abusive bits cut out and lock it, then we can put an end to all the misquotes and misunderstandings.

[Gary C]

Why indeed, I'm at a loss as to why there has been such vilification of Harry.

Why not restore the thread with the abusive bits cut out and lock it, then we can put an end to all the misquotes and misunderstandings.

What's the point Brian? there will then be accusations of thread doctoring to put him in a bad light.

Ask yourself this.

Why would I, or anybody else, seek to villify another shooter?. Envy? I don't think so. For the record, and the last time, I had doubts about the old fantasist when he started rambling.
I cut in when he started making claims that ultimately could damage our sport. Specifically that he is capable of punching a 1" target at 150 yards. Not grouping, not having a few sighters, but straight off the bat.
His second was the claim about never missing a rabbit over 100 yards. Totally risible and an encouragement to the gullible (and boy do we have a few) to start dropping pellets into live targets, completely against the work we all do to promote responsible hunting.

I will comment no more.

[JohnBam]

Hey Gary nice to see some more reasoned argument from ya, rather than the stuff on the Harry thread....was suspecting you were pre menstral during that period


My 2 bobs, I cant recall him saying that he could hit a 1 inch target at 150... was it not a 1.25 inch group at 124yds that he did once? Cannae mind exactlly and without the original thread, no way of checking.

The second comment you stated re the 100 yd bunnys, was nigh pretty late on in the discussion, just before he got banned, and did this not original say the 'f'word and was edited. Not saying this kind of thing was right, just trying to go with the accuracy of what was said.

Also, I don't think Harry is any kind of new age messiah, but he has opened up the sport a little into new areas, pushing the rifles to the limit re target shooting. And peeps are starting to show some decent results on not absoltelly ideal conditions.

Although hunting at these ranges may be a different matter, as right enough the thing we are all pretty much agreed on is wind/air variance which can cause significant shift. However another country, and different attitudes to there quarry, perhaps he should have heeded the warning and steered away from that subject, as this is UK based and he probably doesnt understand the reasoning behind why we can't shed what we do, in any kind of bad light.



PS Gary like the new sig, better than the old one.... but what is a Dinlo?

[Born Again]

What's the point Brian? there will then be accusations of thread doctoring to put him in a bad light.

Ask yourself this.

Why would I, or anybody else, seek to villify another shooter?. Envy? I don't think so. For the record, and the last time, I had doubts about the old fantasist when he started rambling.
I cut in when he started making claims that ultimately could damage our sport. Specifically that he is capable of punching a 1" target at 150 yards. Not grouping, not having a few sighters, but straight off the bat.
His second was the claim about never missing a rabbit over 100 yards. Totally risible and an encouragement to the gullible (and boy do we have a few) to start dropping pellets into live targets, completely against the work we all do to promote responsible hunting.

I will comment no more.

I would never suggest that you were envious of Harry, I know what you have achieved. When the original threads raged watching you and Harry arguing was like watching two people arguing about the plot of different films. You were taking little notice of his explanations and him little of yours. The only reference I saw of 100yd hunting was when he said that he was completing a 100yd group and a mixied rabbit stepped out from behind a log next to his target. The "never missed" quote was, I believe, caused by the clumsy mod editing I mentioned earlier.

Restoring the thread would end this now, we could see what had actually been said. I for one trust the mods to restore the thread correctly and will not be accusing anyone of editing the threads to show Harry in a bad light.

I stated in a previous thread, which may or may not be deleted, that I believed your original reaction was driven by the need to discourage the "differently intelligent" from attempting to hunt at these ranges, I have also recently posted that I very rarely hunt at more than 35yds myself, but this is paper punching fun and should be seen as such.

Harry should not be a victim of our need to educate our idiots, maybe he could have been asked to remove the hunting references but his work remains interesting and supported by evidence from other members. Baz claims to have hit a 12 bore cartridge 5 from 5 at 100yds and others I can't recall claimed similar results.

I'm going to try again as soon as decent weather allows, I hope others will too because it is an interesting diversion and maybe it will improve my technique at shorter ranges too. I doubt I will ever extend my hunting ranges but that's a different matter, that's hitting a target area not putting together a good group, vital difference.

[Terry D]

Why indeed, I'm at a loss as to why there has been such vilification of Harry.

First, there has never been any 'vilification of Harry' from me, not once, never.

Secondly, the Mods took a decision for what they believed to be valid reasons. You may not agree with that decision but the Mods have a job to do and decision-making is a part of that.

[Woodie]

Terry,

when you tried this, what results were you getting with 60 ft.lbs?

[Born Again]

First, there has never been any 'vilification of Harry' from me, not once, never.

Secondly, the Mods took a decision for what they believed to be valid reasons. You may not agree with that decision but the Mods have a job to do and decision-making is a part of that.

I didn't say there had been any from you, I can't remember all the names but yours wasn't there.

Regarding the mods decision, I have given this some more thought and I think I can see your reasons now, I'll drop it.

[Terry D]

...BUT HOW THE HELL YOU LADS CAN EVEN SEE A ONE AND A HALF INCH TARGET AT 150 YARDS SUPRISES ME...

A 35X SCOPE HELPS, MATE.

[JohnBam]

TO BE HONEST GENTS ALL THIS LONG RANGE SHOOTING IS WELL OVER MY HEAD BUT HOW THE HELL YOU LADS CAN EVEN SEE A ONE AND A HALF INCH TARGET AT 150 YARDS SUPRISES ME.I THINK YOUR DREAMING MYSELF

I was using a 1 inch dot at about 94 yds and could see it no probs with 10x mag. Could even see the pellet holes as well.

[Born Again]

TO BE HONEST GENTS ALL THIS LONG RANGE SHOOTING IS WELL OVER MY HEAD BUT HOW THE HELL YOU LADS CAN EVEN SEE A ONE AND A HALF INCH TARGET AT 150 YARDS SUPRISES ME.I THINK YOUR DREAMING MYSELF

TIME TO GET RID OF THAT 4x40 MARK