1906 BSA Bayonet under-lever Model ‘H’ Rifle Valuation Please?

[Gareth W-B]

Rifle As Detailed Now SOLD to Good Guy mjohno. Thanks For Looking.

Notwithstanding my Webley MkI, BSA Light Pattern, and BSA Breakdown, my main air gun collecting area is British made guns of the last half of the last century. Therefore, when it comes to the above detailed rifle, I am a little out of my depth hence my call for help.

A good friend has asked me to investigate the rifle in question and get a value on so as to sell for him to an appreciative collector. The rifle was actually in regular use up until two years ago by the Grandfather of the current owner, and aparently shoots very nicely indeed (although I'll bet it could do with a re-lube). I have seen this rifle, and must say that because it has been in regular use for the past 101 years it is far from mint, but at the same time is no where near so bad as to even contemplate breaking for spares. As I say, it is a used shooter, and does exactly as it says on the tin.

No original blue remains (which is hardly surprising after 100 years service), and all the metal has turned patina (brown hew) but there is no rust. One of the bayonet under-lever link pins has been replaced within the last few years though, and where this link pin has been filed flush, there are the few unavoidable smooth silver file marks on the surrounding metal. There is also an inch long split in the wooden stock to the left side of the butt where it joins the action, but this has obviously been like it for a good thirty or so years, as the slim area exposed by this crack has naturally aged to be in keeping with the rest of the dark wooden butt which also features a chequered pistol and palm grip, and a fashioned steel butt plate.

The over all length of this historic piece is exactly 43.5” and it has the famous BSA Piled Arms logo just in front of the loading port on the barrel. The chap who once owned and used this rifle on his small holding to keep the pigeons and bunnies at bay is sadly no longer with us, but his Grandson who has asked me to assist in finding it a new home (as he personally has no interest in shooting) seems to think he (his Grandad) inherited it from his own Grandfather just before WWII? This we will never know for sure, but it does kind of stack up, and it is such a nice story I choose to believe it to be true.

The current owner also swears blind that his Grandfather used to refer to this rifle as his BSA ‘H’ but the only similar looking bayonet under lever rifle of 1906 that was called an ‘H’ that I can locate in any of my books was badged Lincoln Jefferies, and the ‘H’ stood for ‘Heavy’. As stated however this rifle has the Piled Arms logo stamped into it. This is where I need help from those more knowledgeable than me (which ain’t hard) then: identifying which model BSA this might be? The serial number which is clearly visible on the left hand side of this rifle just above the trigger reads 4113 which my book(s) confirm is from 1906.

I know BSA made the component parts for Lincoln Jefferies rifles, but did they also produce their own version of the ‘H’ or was it just the simply titled ‘BSA Air Rifle’ (1906 to 1908) that they made around that time, which for some reason was referred to by this rifle’s previous owner as his BSA ‘H’? As a foot note here, I have been all over the rifle and can not find an ‘H’ monogram anywhere. Also, am unable to take photos to post unfortunately due to the resurgent problem of a faulty camera, but the rifle in question is exactly as described, and fitted with exactly the same style of woodwork as on the Lincoln Jefferies Heavy Model as featured at the top of page 16 in Dennis Hiller’s big green (4th edition) book.

Right then, that’s quite enough waffle from me for one Bank Holiday weekend, all/any help with model identification and/or sensible values (remember it is not mint, but fair to average for its age) posted below will be greatly appreciated. This isn’t an advert thread however, so no offers to buy yet please, as first I wish to gather as much info as possible.

ATB : Gareth W-B.

[Gareth W-B]

Where's Lakey when you need him . Bump back ttt to catch the eyes of the wise ones . Atb: Gareth W-B.

[benchstop]

I expect he's counting his 'national collection' of bsa underlevers

[Gareth W-B]

I expect he's counting his 'national collection' of bsa underlevers.

Ha ha ha, and as we all know, that may take him some considerable time . Therefore bump back ttt for the attention of the numerous other old sages who like me haunt this section . Anyone? Anything? Atb: Gareth.

[Lakey]

Hello Gareth, did someone call .....

BSA, made Lincoln Jeffries do have the piled arms logo near the loading tap. That is standard and confirms that the rifle was made by BSA.
However if the rifle is an 'H' The Lincoln model by Lincoln Jeffries, then it should have that info impressed into the cylinder.
The legend you would see on the cylinder should be

"H THE LINCOLN AIR RIFLE PATENT"
Manufactured by the BSA Co. Ltd., Birmingham

I have looked up the serial number you gave and it falls within the range of numbers 4030 to 4529. These were manufactured by BSA between March and April 1906 and dispatched from the factory between March to September 1906.
This batch of rifles forms the "Second Batch" of BSA Rifles. These should have the impressed legend on the cylinder as follows

"The BSA Air Rifle (Lincoln Jeffries' Patent)"
Made by the Birmingham Small Arms Company Ltd"

If the rifle was an H the Lincoln, it should also have a bowler hatted man shooting stamped on the right hand side of the stock.

I would think that the Grandfathers description of the rifle being his BSA 'H' probably shows a bit of confusion on his part, Both BSA Air Rifles, and 'H' The Lincoln Rifles, were more or less identical in size and shape, with only minor trade marks to tell them apart. I think that it likely that The rifle you are trying to sell is specimen from the secon batch of BSA Rifles.

Now onto value. In the condition you describe I would think anywhere between 100 and 140 pounds would be about right.

Hope that info is of Help. All the best and good luck with the sale

Andy

[Gareth W-B]

Hello Andy, can't thank you enough. A second batch BSA Air Rifle manufactured between March and April 1906 (and distributed between March and September 1906) it is then. Also, thank you for your advise on price in its condition too (which I may've painted to be blacker than it actually is ). Based on these as above, I have advised my mate to pitch it between the two prices recommended @ £125 (plus post), and hold out for his asking price because he will get it. After all, show me anything else that's over one hundred years old and still works at that price . Proper advert for the above will be posted once I get the go ahead. Thanks to all: Gareth W-B.

[Gareth W-B]

With Chris finally agreeing for me to sell this 1906 BSA Air Rifle for him @ £125 plus post, I didn't want to advertise it for him until it was in my mitts. This is because although selling for a friend is honourable, unless I am in complete control of the sale I wouldn't be prepared to risk my BBS reputation on someone else's integrity. Therefore, I have just had him run it round so I can hold it at my house while any deal is being done. I am glad I did .

Firstly, now that I have looked at it with fresh eyes thanks to the information imparted to me by our Andy as above, I can categorically state that this is not a Lincoln Heavy, but a second batch BSA Air Rifle (as they were called), as the only stamping still visible is the Piled Arms logo of BSA just in front of the loading port, and nothing on the stock.

Have also taken the liberty of taking said rifle into the back garden to crack a few through it just to make sure that it does all still work etc (which it does, and very smoothly too ) but I could only do this after a reality check, as guess what? My .22 pellets wouldn't fit. Why? Because this rifle is a .177 . Now I know my pre-war Light Pattern and Breakdown are in .177, but I thought that all the 43.5" long pre-war BSA rifles produced were in .22?

This in mind, the sale is on hold again (sorry), as I think I now need to double-check the value ... Lakey, where are you . Ha ha ha. Watch this space for further information . Atb: Gareth W-B.

[mjohno]

Gareth
If no one else has asked can you give me first refusal once you have a value established.

[Lakey]

Hi Gareth,

AS far as I can see you made no reference to the fact that the rifle was in .22 , when you started this thread, so I valued the rifle as a .177.

So my valuation would stand, as the rifle proved to be a .177 after all.

.22 would be more valuble, however BSA only started making .22 versions in 1908 ish I believe.

ATB

Lakey

[Gareth W-B]

I valued the rifle as a .177. So my valuation would stand, as the rifle proved to be a .177 after all ... BSA only started making .22 versions in 1908 ish I believe.

... Thank you Andy, will now try and get it sold so ...

If no one else has asked can you give me first refusal once you have a value established.

Hi Mark, the price seems set at £125 then, so if you would like to take it at £125 plus post and save me the hassle of advertising it, it is yours my friend, and now that this rifle seems to be spoken for (on hold), I can get back to looking after my heavily pregnant Mrs (baby now two days overdue ). YHPM . Atb: Gareth W-B.

Ps/ the Light Pattern you sold me (as mentioned in the opening sentence of this thread) is still doing well and going strong : Gareth.

[Gareth W-B]

Gareth
If no one else has asked can you give me first refusal once you have a value established.

Hi Mark, I've still got it on hold for you as requested (and as stated above ), but could do with knowing if you do defo want it or not please (at the moment I am assuming you do), as I've another guy keen on it and don't want to run the risk of loosing him if its not for you . Up-date when you can please: Gareth W-B.

[Gareth W-B]

Hi Mark, am posting this here as your p-m box is full. Just phoned Chris and told him about our communications of half an hour ago, and told him you hadn't fully made your mind up yet. I told him you are a good bloke that I have dealt with before, and that after tomorrow I wouldn't be able to sell it for him as with a new baby around (its just got to come tomorrow ), advertising his BSA would take a very low priority for at least two weeks. He then said get it agreed tonight then, and I said I could at £110 as I'd have it. He said yes okay, so technically it is now mine and I'll weigh him off tomorrow. So now I've un-complicated it, if you want it, you will be buying it from me, and for the reduced price of £110 plus post! Howz That . Thoughts please (phew, I'm out of breath after all that ). If you do buy it and fancy adding the price of a little drink however, it would be greatly appreciated : Gareth W-B.

[mjohno]

Hi Mark, am posting this here as your p-m box is full. Just phoned Chris and told him about our communications of half an hour ago, and told him you hadn't fully made your mind up yet. I told him you are a good bloke that I have dealt with before, and that after tomorrow I wouldn't be able to sell it for him as with a new baby around (its just got to come tomorrow ), advertising his BSA would take a very low priority for at least two weeks. He then said get it agreed tonight then, and I said I could at £110 as I'd have it. He said yes okay, so technically it is now mine and I'll weigh him off tomorrow. So now un-complicated, if you want it, you will be buying it from me not him, and for the reduced price of £110 plus post! Howz That . Thoughts please via p-m (phew, I'm out of breath after all that ). If you do buy it and fancy adding on the price of a little drink however, it would be greatly appreciated : Gareth W-B.

P.M. Sent.

[Gareth W-B]

Above detailed BSA now SOLD to Good Guy mjohno. Thanks to all -- especially Lakey -- with this thread .