FT info

[Romah]

Gentlemen..

a question...

is FT accessible to a wheelchair user?

I currently shoot Air weapons and hold a FAC with 22lr and full-bore slots for target use.

I'd love to try FT but there seems to be a lack of clubs in the northern wastelands of Durham, I've tried contacting my nearest club but so far a response hasn't been forthcoming.

Basically I'd like to know if there are other people in the same situation as myself shooting FT and if there are any major problems that I'd need to consider.

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Rgds....Robb

ps I'm looking for info not sympathy.

[Shaggy]

HI Rob,
I have Mobility problems & am affraid to say that although they say they cater to Disableded Peoples needs in real terms this IS NOT THE CASE

in fact I have found having mobility, causes problems & the attituide towards me was complete ****ee, I got no help at all, which is another factor that made me stop compeating at GP's

granted there were event's where there wasn't a problem, but sadly it isn't the case with most places.

I have trouble going round a lot of the courses, becasue of uneven ground under foot, it's natural cover & not much can be changed about it, I find it ****** hard going & I am not in a chair. Sorry, mate you just ain't gonna get cluck all, to help you shoot GP's They really do need to readdress the ballance, but I bet nothing is done, there's always a way to stop it dead in it's tracks.

if anyone dissagrees I am more then willing to give venue's where I had majour problems, both with access to the courses & firing positions not to mention walking a ****** marathion which makes my health worse for a bit after.

people tend to behave funny around chairs, at Ottmore last year there was a classic example, poor bloke must have died a million times, especially is looks could kill. people were looking down on him, the poeople around were OK but no one else made a big effort.
I know there are some that are disabled that shoot & just get on with it, but now I see it as a none friendly/disabled friendly enviroments, take from someone who has been there, done it & got worse as a result of it.

Darren

[Rich]

If ever you're on holiday in Devon, look us up. Our ground is unusual in that it's on an almost flat and almost level field, whereas most courses are woodland based.

The only obstacle for a wheelchair user at our club is - sadly - the steps up to the club hut, and the width of the door. We have a second hand 24ft portakabin.

We have one member with mobility problems and we provide chairs at the shooting positions.

rgds

Rich

[Shaggy]

At Theydon Bois there are probably more Rarsburry ripples then able body people there but it's all on 1 level & not a problem.

The same goes for Lea Valley, they are probably a better set up for disabled people, how ever the club house is up come steps, but I reocn if they did get a member who needed access to the club house, who was chair bound, I honestly think they will between them all, find a way so that the indervidual can have a sence that belong to a good club who help cater for all there memebers.

Darren

[Road Runner]

Robb - As mentioned, the main problem is the nature of probably most grounds. I have seen people in wheel chairs shooting FT but can only think of three. One was (possibly) a one-off because I never saw him again on the national circuit. The second was a regular at events in the Midlands (I think). The third is very much a regular in the south, and helps to set national courses at Curridge (by doing the sighting job from the firing positions). A fourth is my sister, but she doesn't shoot a lot, plus she isn't confined to her chair.

The second person had a fairly lightweight chair and managed a lot of the courses unaided. I and others used to help him at difficult parts of the grounds. Similarly with the third - he used to be carried upstairs in the chair to BFTA committee meetings in a Midlands venue. It took four of us but it worked! He uses an electric chair in the wood.

It may be possible to find a club near you, if only to have access to a part of their ground so that you can at least try it. My own ground has been used by a wheelchair but now the access is down steps, although the landlord was willing to put in a chair ramp (but I reckon it would need a winch system for control though). The user has not been for quite a long time now, plus she can walk fairly well although she has a stair lift at home.

FT is supposed to be an equal opportunities sport in that it does cater for disabilities at national committee and rules level. The problem however may literally be at ground level. There are allowances made, by agreement, for those less able but there are sometimes physical limitations where grounds are simply not appropriate for chairs or it would be impossibly expensive for a club to provide the required access.

Good luck with your search, FT can be a good sport if people around you are willing. It comes back sometimes to human nature and the willingness of people to help. If you are ever in the Plymouth/S. Devon area, email me at F.T.Hunter@btinternet.com - I'm sure we could sort something out! It may mean scrambling around an artic lorry in the park, or a bit of man-handling down into the wood, but many things are possible.

Keith

[dwb]

As Keith has already said the main problem is the terrain we have had people in wheelchairs shooting Grand Prix courses this depends on the wheelchair and having someone to help them
as far has attitude toward people in wheelchairs ,all I have seen is people trying to help and the helpful, we have a man in wheelchair at REDFEARN that has gone around the courses that has been sent out, i would not say that it was easily to get around but he did it
if you get no joy at one club then tried a different one , keep trying

DWBaines

[Romah]

Thanks guys for the replies.

Seems like a mixed bag, but the overall message is that access would be the main problem. Would an electric 4 wheel scooter type vehicle help in this direction?

Darren, I'm sorry to hear you've come across a bit of negativity mate though I must say that so far I've not met with any myself within my own club and whilst shooting at open matches.
I hear what you're saying about peoples attitude to 'chairs, but I honestly feel that it's very much a case of them just not knowing how to handle the situation. Personally I find that it's my attitude toward others that tends to loosen people up, I don't have any 'why me' hang ups about my situation and when people realise this I become 'normal' to them and they stop worrying about being PC.

I'll keep plugging away and see if I can find somewhere to give it a try.

Rgds....Robb.

[Gary C]

Slightly different sport

I had a long chat with Pete Sparkes a couple of months ago re. disabled shooters (a club member of mine wanted to compete at the Welsh) and clearly at club level there is a problem caused by the terrain. A good HFT club will usually have access to rough and broken country. This poses a problem for disabled access which when coupled with low membership and tight funds may make adequate and safe provision impossible.

HOWEVER.

The UKHFT committee felt that the importance of making the sport accessible to ALL shooters is a top priority and as such all efforts would be made to accomodate disabled shooters at club and competition level. For intance if only 15 targets of a 30 target course were accessable to a disabled shooter then the rules could be made flexible so he or she could shoot these 15 twice.
The key was flexibility, with limited resources and terrain difficulties best efforts were all that could be guaranteed, but with these best efforts it was felt that a disabled shooter would be able to enjoy the spirit of HFT and competition.

If you are thinking of competing at HFT you should drop Sparky a line

[stevo]

later on this year ALL clubs , shops , any bisuness has got to make provisions for disabled people , it becomes law , and anyone who decide other wise will be heavly fined .

[Samantha]

At Ford in Sussex where one of the HFT competitions is going to be held, we have facilities for disabled shooters including a proper toilet and we do have disabled visitors in wheelchairs attending. It is helped by the fact that the site is on an old disused airfield so is very flat and there is plenty of concrete. It must be said though that most of the disabled shooters are just target and the possibility of HFT has not occured to us.

The HFT target course could be a problem but we could look into this as some of the targets could be shot from the concrete anyway and it might well be worth thinking aboutfor the future.

[Rich]

An electric buggy would be ideal at our ground, for travelling from the entrance to the start of the shoot, and from lane to lane. An ordinary wheelchair would also be fine but would probably need someone to push it, on grass.

We have plenty of car parking space albeit on grass. If the ground is really wet and in danger of being cut up we can park in the school car park about 200 yards down the road, so no problem. It just means the buggy would have to travel 200 yards along the highway which I presume is permitted.

rgds

Rich

[stevew71]

Originally posted by stevo
later on this year ALL clubs , shops , any bisuness has got to make provisions for disabled people , it becomes law , and anyone who decide other wise will be heavly fined .

Unfortunately this is appears to be another well intentioned but ill thought out piece of legislation. Many field sport clubs are carried out on land that does not belong to them, but is leased or they have been given access permission from the owner, this means that concrete ramps and pathways cannot be put in to satisfy the new legislation. As far as I'm aware (and I have to check this more in depth) the new rules make no concessions for practicality or reality. How are sea angling clubs to provide safe access to mud flats or estuaries ? The steps at my rifle club are extremely steep and narrow, and the building is situated right at the bottom of them (gradient is well in excess of 40deg). Yes we could convert the steps to a slope but would need some sort of powered pully system to get chairs up and down (which the club would be liable for in the event of an accident) and everybody else would struggle for access (there is no room for a slope and steps). We have managed to get chairs into the range before, but it took 4 people and was undignified and dangerous for all involved. We are fortunate in Coventry that there is a Sports Centre that caters for people of all physical and mental capabilities and they cater for 10m pistol, air rifle and archery. There is no FT there although it could be catered for on the land out back. My own thoughts on the matter are that where ever possible clubs should cater for everybody. If there is no facility that can, then rather than close or fine clubs the local council should look to see where the sport could be catered for within it's own facilities (let's face it an FT course could be set out on a car park or a football pitch, uninspiring to look at but the challenge would still be there).

[Romah]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by stevew71
[B]Unfortunately this is appears to be another well intentioned but ill thought out piece of legislation.

Absolutely agree with the above, I hadn't intended this thread to be a discussion on the DDA but it's interesting to read your views.

I like the idea of local councils finding room within their own facilities but this seems to be at odds with current policy in Durham where an excuse was found last year to end shooting in the basement of one of the areas sports centres.

It's noticeable that most of the replies are from the southern reaches of the country, is it lack of interest up here or lack of facilities?

Rgds......Robb

[I. J.]

RIVINGTON RIFLEMENs Indoor range has access for wheelchairs and one of its 6 rifle firing points is specifically for the 'physically challenged' members/visitors.

[Paul Hudson]

Originally posted by Romah
...noticeable that most of the replies are from the southern reaches of the country, is it lack of interest up here or lack of facilities?

Rgds......Robb

It's probably the lack of facilities Robb. At Pontefract ARC we're chipping away at the accessibility issue where and when we can.

We have a number of disabled shooters and, while physical access to the FT course is limited by the actual terrain, the shooters themselves don't have any problem with "attitudes". They're valued members of the club, same as all the other shooters we have.

What we do have is an excellent, flat, covered-position zero range. As one of the earlier posts has mentioned, FT can be set up in a car park. After all, it's about range-finding and accuracy. It's just unfortunate that most courses around us here are situated in woods, on the sides of hills, or both.

I can see no reason why, with a little ingenuity and co-operation, an FT course suitable for all shooters can't be set up. The layout for the NEFTA Winter League match at LNER springs to mind... Of course, this depends absolutely on the club having suitable space to make the facilities accessible.

At which point I'm going to stop because I'm talking myself round in a circle .

ATB,

Paul.