Original 45 info required

[stagmanv835]

Just having read an artical in novembers comic about the original 45 possed a question in my tiny mind

I acuired one in the late 80`s its in .22 with open target sights fitted

Its is also very easy to cock, i ahve necer chronoed so no idea of power i asume very low

question would this be a normal conversion for this rifle target sight and detune ? if so what sort of cometition would it be used for

would it take a lot to put it back up to full power spec for ratting with or should i hang it on the wall

[jonnyone]

There are members on here far better qualified than myself to give advice on the '45 so I bow to their better knowledge, but as far as I was aware- there wasnt any commercially available "target" version as such of this rifle. I wonder if a previous owner simply adapted a standard rifle for this use?

As far as power is concerned, the '45 is no slouch in this department. I have 2 of the RWS variants (same action juts a difference in the stocks) and have had both converted over to ptfe piston heads from leather and this has released further power and with an improvement in shot to shot consistency. I have then decreased spring input to lower ME but some would advocate packing the head out to reduce the lock time which in itself can bring accuracy benefits.

The '45 is a cracking rifle and as the mag article says a classic sporting air rifle- well worth keeping hold of and improving if you are able to.

The German Diana website still advertises the '45 so I think it may still be available to special order (though I am not 100% sure).

Good luck with the rifle.

Dave

Just having read an artical in novembers comic about the original 45 possed a question in my tiny mind

I acuired one in the late 80`s its in .22 with open target sights fitted

Its is also very easy to cock, i ahve necer chronoed so no idea of power i asume very low

question would this be a normal conversion for this rifle target sight and detune ? if so what sort of cometition would it be used for

would it take a lot to put it back up to full power spec for ratting with or should i hang it on the wall

[I. J.]

would it take a lot to put it back up to full power spec for ratting with or should i hang it on the wall

I would suspect a new main spring (NOT an Ox ) a piston washer (new or refurbish the old) and a re lube should bring it back to full power. A session over the chrono would be advisable after the event.

ATB
Ian

p.s. If you look on the l/h side of the action you should see, in very small numbers, the month and year of manufacture. This may help when ordering spares.

[stagmanv835]

thanks for info guys

can not find me crono lights at the mo so will test tommorow

date on the side is 02 81 (guess feb 1981)

adding a few pics, the for sight seeam to be a sleave fit the rear straight to the dove tail mount



http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i6...3112008063.jpg

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i6...3112008064.jpg

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i6...3112008065.jpg

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i6...3112008066.jpg

[Oddbob08]

If I remember right, there were a lot of rumours of grey imports of German air rifles in the 1980's. Germany actually had a lower power limit than we did, somewhere around 9ft/lbs I think, no idea how the power was reduced but it's one possibility.

[MrGreengrass]

The Original 45 was built to beat the Hw35
The hw 80 was built to beat the 45.
The 48/52 ..built to beat the 80.
German power struggle/arms race.
Hw100 vs Rws 500...it still goes on...sort of.
Agree,no ox;s,supersport size titan ok,silicone oil leather washers.mind the power though.. they limit easily especially .22 .
better built than most of today's offerings,look what an icon it took to beat it.

[BTDT]

question would this be a normal conversion for this rifle target sight and detune ? if so what sort of cometition would it be used for

would it take a lot to put it back up to full power spec for ratting with or should i hang it on the wall

Diopter rear sights were normally fitted to air rifles only for indoor paper target shooting, but then only in .177". I don't know of a paper target shooting discipline for .22".

However, people who shot .177" indoor paper target disciplines will have been used to shooting with diopter rear sights, and it's not unheard of for them to fit a diopter on their field or hunting air rifle. In any case, it's highly unlikely they'd go to the trouble of reducing the power.

I'd say chrono it and, if the power is acceptable, don't do anything to it. You may need to run 100 to 200 pellets through it to clear lubricants from the compression chamber and stop it dieselling before testing it if it's been unused for a long time.

I'd be very wary of fitting an uprated mainspring. The '45 was designed to exceed our legal limit (for the American market) and as jonnyone rightly points out, it's all too easy to inadvertently exceed the limit. When I had a dealer's ticket, I fitted PTFE heads to Original 45s and had to pack the heads to reduce the stroke to get the power within 12fpe.

Unless you know what you're doing, I'd suggest you consider seeing whether Sandwell Field Sports or V-Mach will tune the rifle for you.

If I remember right, there were a lot of rumours of grey imports of German air rifles in the 1980's. Germany actually had a lower power limit than we did, somewhere around 9ft/lbs I think, no idea how the power was reduced but it's one possibility.

6fpe for the home market, and the rifles were stamped (I think with the letter 'F' inside a pentagon). I personally have never known of a German market Original 45 being imported.

[I. J.]

the rifles were stamped (I think with the letter 'F' inside a pentagon). I personally have never known of a German market Original 45 being imported.

You are, of course, as to be expected, correct. The famous 'effin pentagon' symbol.

Dave DM80 is good with these too, though I can only describe my v mach'd one as superb

I decided to keep the leather rather than convert to synthetic, the gunsmith at Dykes(the Original importers) is a big fan of leather seals for longevity.

Two statements with which I totally agree.

ATB
Ian

[paulh1966]

sorry to hijack the thread, but i've just tuned up my Original 50 & have the option of a leaher or a PTFE washer, in your opinions would you stick with the Leather opition, I'm not power obsessed, just looking for accuracy & about 10-11ftlbs, is this realistic?

[I. J.]

Personally - I would stick with originality. If it should have a leather washer I would stay with that.
I once changed a leather washered HW55 to a nylon one and lost part of its character.

ATB
Ian

[Original 45]

Gents

I would like to give my standard 0.177 45 another lease of life & I’m going to try to get it repaired very shortly (possible broken sear ? )

Would you also leave the 45 on the standard leather washer or a synthetic version ? (I would like to reuse it for a bit of HFT) If so where could I obtain one from / have one made (synthetic), are leather ones still available from the importers ?

Sorry not yet done all my homework but I thought I`d ask whilst all you knowledgeable folks are on here at present !.

PS Apologies for the slight hijack

[DM80]

i would use the original leather piston head they last more or less forever if the seal in your 45 is not damaged give it a good clean with a brush and white spirits let it dry then use light oil on the leather let it soak in for an hour or two and it will be as good as new,
in the past i've tried all types of piston heads made from various materials but its not worth the effort as they never gave a great improvement over the standard leather seal.

dave.

[jonnyone]

I have been hesitant to add my three pence to this as I can see it wll be contrary to what has already been said about staying with leather, and I dont really want to confuse matters. BUT,- here goes!

If you are keeping the rifle in its original factory form for collecting and value purposes, then I would stick with leather. If you are keeping the rifle for the same purposes that I am ie a "practical classic" one that is useable and a keeper, then I would consider going the route of synthetic.

I have heard tell of ptfe heads that have expanded after some use and become very tight in the compression tube. I have no doubt that this is possible, and yet I would say two things. Firstly it has never happened to me and I have now converted a HW35, a Original 50, an Original 50T01, Anschutz 335 x2, RWS 45's x 2. Secondly, I have in the past stripped a couple of leather washered rifles and have found the leather has soaked up lube and siezed solid in the compression tube. I have equally found the dried up and almost missing (with the remnants flattened at the cylinder end and in the port. I have another .22 Anschutz to do soon and this will also be converted to ptfe.

Out of the above rifles, all bar the '35 have resulted in power increase and markedly better consistency. I think for performance, leather has really had its day. That said, it is dependable on the whole and is generally available from spares suppliers. The reason I first went the direction of ptfe was due to the fact that one of the RWS rifles above that I bought s/h had obviously been tinkered with and someone had managed to destroy the leather head and had off loaded it onto an unsuspecting s/h shop. The leather heads on '45's are riveted on by the way and though another one can be made up by the more clever amongst us, to replace the existing head on a '45 with whichever material will mean the destruction of the existing head anyway.

I think leather heads require a little more care and attention, and are more sensitive to lubrication issues and therefore ongoing maintenance- especially on rifles used very regularly.

As you can guess, I am an advocate of ptfe- or other synthetic materials. But then air rifles are simply minature engines to my way of thinking and you wouldnt think it sacrilege to improve the engine of a classic car (internally I mean) by better lubricants and seals and parts to prolong it's life? Other than keeping a rifle "Original" (no pun intended on that one), why should it be sacrilege here?

I'll step down off my soap box now, and restore my 4' 5'' proportions

One last word on the matter. Whichever way members go with improving their rifles (I am thinking on the present subject anyway), its always really interesting to read here how you got on? So post back whichever way you decide?

Cheers,
Dave

[joffy]

you could always try dave welham of airmasters 88 they used to make them work in the 80's

[Original 45]

Thank you to you all for your excellent advice .

I hope to find out if its repairable / viable in the next week or two so will let you know how I get on.

Thanks again
ATB Simon