20yd/25yd benchrest

[simmmo]

Andy I think that part of the vairablity that you see in the scores for Air gun classes in the UKBR22 is that quite a lot of clubs are actually shooting outdoor. If you compare the scores for the equivalent classes but with the .22LR at 50m the scores are reasonably comparable. Shooting Air at 25 outdoors is as challenging as rim at 50 when you have a breeze to contend with in my opinion.

Al

Al

I shoot air rifle outside at 45yds and over all the time with a low mag scope and no parrallax adjustment so I know what the wind can do and it is doubtless challenging as I'm sure any FT shooter will testify to.

The comparison however is based on air rifle and rimfire competeing in the same competition/class/distance. The UKBR22 stats for last season clearly show a disparity whether outside or indoors and I put that down to the repeatability of the ammunition. If you look at the rimfire unlimited it was seperated on 10xs between six people who returned maximums. The top air rifle Unlimited competitor would have finished 40th in that league as it was he placed 24th using his rimfire.

I am saying in my opinion that the two launching systems are not comparable and should for fairness not compete against each other as we do in the UKBR22.

Andy

[simmmo]

Hi Andy, working on this one mate. As said above, world rules are in the proccess of being draughted, when this is completed and agreed the UKBR22 rulebook will be updated.
Cheers,
Robb H

Thanks for the update Robb

ATVB

Andy

[Falcon25]

Hi, John

Sutton Coldfield R&PC would definitely be interested. We could field at least one team and possibly two. Please keep us updated and let me know when you will need confirmation of the teams. Many thanks.

Hi there, I shoot with Rocky at Sutton, and wil definatley give it a go!!!!!

[pennineway.fswo]

I think it is a great idea to get some sort of Benchrest League going within the UK however in previous posts it is obvious that there are too many different rules going about.

At Buxted we shoot UKBR22 and find them accommodating towards air rifle shooting.

As the first World Championships took place last year using these rules and the new World rules are currently being drafted (based largely on these) so as to standardise it in the World arena don't you think it would be sensible in an effort to get the sport to grow that the country as a whole adopt the same set of rules. This years nationals will be using these rules.

I appreciate that there are current regional leagues in existence using their own rules. I would love to enter another competition other than the UKBR22 ones that I currently do each month but I would suggest a different target would be the best way to go with a standardising of the rules across the country.

If you want to do benchrest seriously then you can spend a lot of money and time sorting your kit. Front rests can be as cheap or as expensive as you want. If you are shooting different classes you need different bags unless you have an adjustable top. This part of the rules could be a major stumbling block nationally. You must I feel go for the most liberal view so as to encompass most people because what we want is competition. The most competitive shooter at Buxted at the moment is using a bipod.

Equally classes and divisions let like shoot against like equipment and ability wise, so don’t be afraid to have air competing against air and live fire against live fire. I think if you study the UKBR22 scores section you will see that the rimfire scores are on their targets predominantly more consistent. Don’t read this as more accurate because I don’t think there is much in it. But what they have is an advantage in their propulsion at the standard of Tennex and the like is much more easier to control than in an airgun with power curves and fill pressures etc..

Even UKBR22 has daft rules like .177 and .22 competing against each other plugged with calibre specific gauges, still cannot get my head around that one.

I'm sure we could put 3 or 4 teams into such a competition.

Good luck with whatever you achieve.

Andy

hi Andy

Many thanks for your very constructive views

I think you and i are thinking along the same lines and thanks for your proposal to put 3 or 4 teams into this competition

For an open shoot, it would be easy to shoot different classes such as in the UK22BR postals .

However for the postal league some of the Midland clubs have just a handful of members, some use air and some .22 rimfire. So seeding into divisions would probably be based on a team average (as we do for our 11 LSR Divisions) and the team members can use either air or rimfire

Shooting a good air rifle at 25 yards indoors i recorded an average of 99.1 ex 100 using the standard NSRA 25 yd targets over the winter months which is only slightly less than my rimfire 25 yard benchrest average on these cards. However when using the air rifle each pellet had to be selected/treated with care and examined just prior to use,whereas on the rimfire rifle i used just mid-priced club ammo.
I have occasionally shot 100's with even the cheapest 'Club' .22 rounds however putting cheaper pellets in the AA400 would be a complete waste of time and end in tears and frustration.
I have also found to my cost that even slight damage to a pellet can cost you 10 points. Not so with the rimfire bullet.

As said above, it is outdoors where the poor air rifle really struggles against the rimfire rifle even at 25 yards.

I also, like you, am confused by the UK22BR rule of guaging to calibre
and I look forward to any review and revision of the current rules

ATB
John

[Powderfinger]

Hi there, I shoot with Rocky at Sutton, and wil definatley give it a go!!!!!

Good man! I'll put a scope on my Annie 54 and pop along for Tuesday practice. See you there.

[Iain D]

Here at Perth City & County Small-Bore Rifle Club we would be interested if you were to open the comp to those outside the midlands

Iain D

[Falcon25]

Good man! I'll put a scope on my Annie 54 and pop along for Tuesday practice. See you there.

It wil be interesting to compare to my Anschutz 2002 FT

[oly2b]

I am new to bench rest, been researching on the internet i.e. UKBR22 and other sites and went ahead and bought front and rear sand bags only to be told that you can't use them Yorkshire League rules. Only some form of simple front rest allowed.
Does anybody have the rules for allowable front rest designs before I spend any more money.

[pennineway.fswo]

As I posted above, there are a number of issues with the Yorkshire rules that handicap the air rifle ie. wadcutters only(not good enough at 25 yards) and a simple hard front rest (no good for the recoiling air rifle)
So the rules that I have proposed for the Midland league clubs will allow an adjustable front rest and a rear rest (same as allowed in UK22BR competition)and of course round nose lead pellets for air guns

NSRA rules do not allow a rear rest. However I shoot in NSRA competitions and in a league that uses UK22BR rules and find no problem in adapting to the 'no rear rest' rule. Scores come down naturally without the rear rest but by only a fraction of a point ex 100 for both rimfire and airgun

[Powderfinger]

If you are organising it, John then implement whatever rules you feel are best. We'll see how the first season goes then any changes can be implemented for the next season. TBH, I will probably shoot with my 54 draped over my range bag using the cheapest ammo from Bates and a bargain Hawke scope.

[pennineway.fswo]

If you are organising it, John then implement whatever rules you feel are best. We'll see how the first season goes then any changes can be implemented for the next season. TBH, I will probably shoot with my 54 draped over my range bag using the cheapest ammo from Bates and a bargain Hawke scope.

Thats the spirit.

In Midland League 20 yard light weight sport rifle we have 11 divisions that cater for the top guys in div. 1 who shoot 96+/card to old Joe who is 89 years old, shakes like a rattle and celebrates if he hits the black.

It's all about enjoying the sport and in the case of benchrest, it prolongs shooting for some of the rimfire old timers who struggle with the diopter sight and getting up from the prone position

ATB
John

[pennineway.fswo]

I have just had a discussion with the Secretary of the Yorkshire Smallbore League during which we discussed the rule for wadcutter only pellets for air rifles
He informed me that the Yorkshire League will now allow round headed pellets to be used in benchrest competitions. The rulebook will (I would think)be updated accordingly.
This brings their rules into line with NSRA rules other than their targets are very similar to the UKBR22 targets and are scored to give a possibility of 11 points/shot.

[Powderfinger]

it prolongs shooting for some of the rimfire old timers who struggle with the diopter sight and getting up from the prone position

Already a problem for me at the age of 39!

[pennineway.fswo]

I have had quite a bit of feedback from the midland clubs and I now have about 20 teams of 3 that wish to enter.
I also see no reason why clubs from outside the midlands should not enter teams

Rule wise, it is being left up to me to decide on whether we go down the NSRA route, ie a simple flat front rest and no rear rest, or the UK22BR route of an adjustable front rest topped with a sandbag plus a small sand bag rear rest.
The UKBR set up makes more sense to me and allows sporting type rimfire and air rifles with a rounded fore-end to be used (many shooters wishing to take part are from LSR leagues and only have the 1 rifle which is of lighter weight and rounded fore-end ) Anyone wishing to use a purpose made match benchrest rifle can do so of course.

Teams will be seeded into divisions based on averages and a team can consist of shooters using different types of rifle. Divisions will be formed based on the team averages after the first 2 rounds.

Targets are likely to be based on UKBR - 25 yard target with the 2 mm bull and a slightly scaled down version for those teams that only have a 20 yard range

I will update this thread as necessary to keep those interested informed and when the time comes, I will send out the entry forms
John

[simmmo]

Looking good John, Buxted will certainly be interested if you are going to allow clubs from out of the region.

Andy