AR15, co2, steel bb's

[Nickpan]

Blimey me, I've had fun with this. Limited edition, 100 made. It was sold to me as an M16, and although my military weapon knowledge is poor, I'm pretty sure it's an AR15, and it has AR11 printed on it. Full size, metal and weighty, takes 2 co2 bulbs, semi auto, 45 BB's, .177.
AR15
AR15
AR15 serial number 0047 (of 100)
It has weaver rails at the front, either side of barrel grip area. I've already put a laser on. I've also added a scope, but I'm not sure if that adds to its looks...
To gas it up, unclip the stock, by pressing a button behind the pistol grip. The stock slides off, to reveal the gas compartment. This is a standalone unit that can be screwed in once charged. Put 2 gas bulbs in, then tighten up the nut that is closest to the cylinders. This seals it. Now tighten up the secondary nut, which punctures the 2 bulbs. This means there is no loss of gas, as it is sealed before punctured.
Now to load. The magazine release button, er, releases the magazine. n It takes 45 BB's, and I heard from the gunsmith that copper coated, or steel BB's are best. Don't try the lead ones. There is a quick loading stick, which is a tube with a plunger inside. Pull the plunger/ram rod out, tip 50 BB's in (and thirty on the floor), then carefully insert the end into mouth of magazine, push the ramrod and BB's straight into mag. Put mag into rifle, switch from safety to fire, and pull the trigger as many times as you like, as quickly as you can. I haven't chrono'd it, but was told it's 10ft lb! Lets assume it's nearer 9ft/lb, still very good.

Lovely bits:

• The dummy cocking lever is pullable (like a T-bar just above where the co2 screws in), and this flips open the dummy cartridge eject port cover.
• There's another button that is depressable, but in the real world, I don't know what its function would be.
• The safety switch has a 'safe' and two 'fire' settings, although regardless of where you set it, you won't get full auto!
• Attention to detail is very good.
• Only 100 have been made, mine is individually marked as 47 of 100.

Unfortunately, you only get about 60 shots for two gas cylinders. And I don't care. Buy a box of 100 gas cylinders, and go crazy. Could it have been done with 88gm airsource cylinders?

If you fire 40 shots on the trot, due to the nature of co2, everything will go cold. When gas is getting low, as you pull the trigger, you can hear the gas going from the cylinders in the stock, into the 'gas chamber'. If pressure is down, or temperature is down, it won't be enough gas pressure to fire the bb. In this scenario, you will hear a slight gadump noise, but not the crack of the BB being fired. BEWARE! If you now put the rifle down, things may warm up, which means the pressure may go up, which means the rifle may now go off! If pressure is too low to fire, keep pointing down range and put the safety on. This will release any co2 that has left the cylinders, and has gone into the danger area.

Accuracy isn't really an issue, as this is a BB gun. But what a BB gun it is! Another super plinker, along the lines of a Beretta CX4. But this is proper collectable...

[Pad. E]

Hi Nick.

Replied to your PM

Now I do like that air-gun

Good rewiew by the way

Regards
Paddy.

[PHOBUS]

Hello Nickpan ,

I really like your AR 15 / M16 and I have never seen another one like it nor heard of the existence of these before, and this is the sort of thing that interests me , or rather it was before the VCR anyway !!

In some ways it is a lot like my RAM M4 paintball gun in that the controls are similar also Brocock are the importers of the RAMS I understand . The bolt at the rear opens the ejection port on the paintball guns too , and the button you refer to is most likely the forward assist as found on real steel and is used to move the bolt " forward " in the event of feed jams etc. Also , the gas bottle at the back is identical to the charging method of the RAM paintball guns . The mag however is more akin to an airsoft item .

The paintball guns are full auto too . Wheras I take it your BBguns semi only ? albeit without having to turn a magazine or withdraw a hammer a very fast and lightweight trigger pull correct ? I would be interested to know where you bought your gun originally and if these are still available ? At 9 ft lbs they are pokey enough alright ??

The only similar thing I can think of was the AK CO2 s you could buy which made about 3 ft lbs and fired steel bbs from a pistol mag with shocking accuracy . Do you know the year of manufacture and if these are still being made , and if so UK or elsewhere ?

Thanks CARL

[RichardH]

Now we like that

[Munst]

Nice review Nickpan! Lots of detail

the button you refer to is most likely the forward assist as found on real steel and is used to move the bolt " forward " in the event of feed jams etc.

Correct! It was requested for the military design I think, when the US originally took on the stoner pattern rifle.

[Hsing-ee]

Nice review Nickpan! Lots of detail



Correct! It was requested for the military design I think, when the US originally took on the stoner pattern rifle.

The Stoner assault rifle was never adopted by the US military, although obviously Eugene Stoner's AR15 design was. The forward-assist was fitted in the later models of the M16 as the early ones jammed alot. The cocking bolt cannot be used to push the bolt home, only pull it back.

The jamming of the early issue may have been because the powder used in the 5.56 mm ammo was different in the military issue to the faster-burning stuff used in the prototypes or it may have been because the rifle was rumoured to be 'self-cleaning' so it gummed up with cr@p very quickly when the soldiers did not clean it.

I'm sure the answer is on Wikipedia somewhere. The AR15 as originally devised is not exactly the same as the M16, but I think they are all called AR15 designs now. There is some mention that the ammo was incorrectly sourced for some political reason (maybe trying to keep a failing munitions company afloat), and that the original AR15 with the correct ammo was a superior weapon. All the things have been sorted out with it now it seems.

[Nickpan]

Hello Nickpan ,
I would be interested to know where you bought your gun originally and if these are still available ? At 9 ft lbs they are pokey enough alright ??

The only similar thing I can think of was the AK CO2 s you could buy which made about 3 ft lbs and fired steel bbs from a pistol mag with shocking accuracy . Do you know the year of manufacture and if these are still being made , and if so UK or elsewhere ?

Thanks CARL

Hi Carl,
AR15 BB's are possibly still available (I might be able to get one), but as only 100 were made, people are snaffling them up! I got mine at source from Brocock. They are certainly pokey enough for long range fun plinking.
The AK co2 is no longer in production, but they crop up every now and then on BBS.
All the best, Nick

[clayton]

Could I ask the price of these, I've got a bit of a thing for AR's

[t1mm]

had a play with one today. i may buy it on friday but it was more than yours £425

[Ranyhyn]

Good review! Have you a photo of the right hand side?
Will these take lead bbs?

[Nickpan]

Will take lead BB's, but the gunsmith (used to be on the Venom team) recommends steel/copper.
Might be worth a go, if you have fifty thousand lead ones!


Will take a pic of right hand side, with mag release button.

[gedfinn 2]

Blimey me, I've had fun with this. Limited edition, 100 made. It was sold to me as an M16, and although my military weapon knowledge is poor, I'm pretty sure it's an AR15, and it has AR11 printed on it. Full size, metal and weighty, takes 2 co2 bulbs, semi auto, 45 BB's, .177.
AR15
AR15
AR15 serial number 0047 (of 100)
It has weaver rails at the front, either side of barrel grip area. I've already put a laser on. I've also added a scope, but I'm not sure if that adds to its looks...
To gas it up, unclip the stock, by pressing a button behind the pistol grip. The stock slides off, to reveal the gas compartment. This is a standalone unit that can be screwed in once charged. Put 2 gas bulbs in, then tighten up the nut that is closest to the cylinders. This seals it. Now tighten up the secondary nut, which punctures the 2 bulbs. This means there is no loss of gas, as it is sealed before punctured.
Now to load. The magazine release button, er, releases the magazine. n It takes 45 BB's, and I heard from the gunsmith that copper coated, or steel BB's are best. Don't try the lead ones. There is a quick loading stick, which is a tube with a plunger inside. Pull the plunger/ram rod out, tip 50 BB's in (and thirty on the floor), then carefully insert the end into mouth of magazine, push the ramrod and BB's straight into mag. Put mag into rifle, switch from safety to fire, and pull the trigger as many times as you like, as quickly as you can. I haven't chrono'd it, but was told it's 10ft lb! Lets assume it's nearer 9ft/lb, still very good.

Lovely bits:

• The dummy cocking lever is pullable (like a T-bar just above where the co2 screws in), and this flips open the dummy cartridge eject port cover.
• There's another button that is depressable, but in the real world, I don't know what its function would be.
• The safety switch has a 'safe' and two 'fire' settings, although regardless of where you set it, you won't get full auto!
• Attention to detail is very good.
• Only 100 have been made, mine is individually marked as 47 of 100.

Unfortunately, you only get about 60 shots for two gas cylinders. And I don't care. Buy a box of 100 gas cylinders, and go crazy. Could it have been done with 88gm airsource cylinders?

If you fire 40 shots on the trot, due to the nature of co2, everything will go cold. When gas is getting low, as you pull the trigger, you can hear the gas going from the cylinders in the stock, into the 'gas chamber'. If pressure is down, or temperature is down, it won't be enough gas pressure to fire the bb. In this scenario, you will hear a slight gadump noise, but not the crack of the BB being fired. BEWARE! If you now put the rifle down, things may warm up, which means the pressure may go up, which means the rifle may now go off! If pressure is too low to fire, keep pointing down range and put the safety on. This will release any co2 that has left the cylinders, and has gone into the danger area.

Accuracy isn't really an issue, as this is a BB gun. But what a BB gun it is! Another super plinker, along the lines of a Beretta CX4. But this is proper collectable...

Hiya mate, looks the business, However I have a Question ( I know we answer it ) ?
How are they allowed to sell it, When this was banned ( from being imported )
As you know its a Kalashnikov AK 47. ( Yunkers 3 )

Its Co2 & fires about 10 ish bb,s in semi mode, I uprated this gun ( And did a thread ) It fires around 4-500 Fps, To make 10 Fpe it would have to shoot them at 950 Fps, Co2 just does not expand that fast !When you chrono it, Please tell us,

Also, I advertised this on the forum about 2 years ago, for £70, It wasn,t mine, but I said I would fix it for the buyer, ( It might still be there in the annals ) No takers,
So I ended up with it !
How does it shoot ! It shoots better with lead bb,s they carry more energy
& come back ( As much )
Do I like it, No, The semi mode is fun, but smooth bore/bb,s etc, Its quite accurate but not my cup of tea, ( this is not a sales pitch )
I see one USA site is buying them for the " Original " bits ?http://www.rusmilitary.com/html/c-deact_accessories.htm
Maybe the one started in the thread will go the same way , Cheers, Ged.

[bigjob]

i own both of these, ar15 and ak47, the ar15 has been converted to run on air bothe great fun and raised a few looks at the gunclub!

[MojoCrow]

The AK CO2 rifle was made at the Izmash factory that also makes the real AK models. The powers that be probably decided that it used too many parts from the real thing and got all shirty over it.

Back to the AR; We had an AR-12 RA in stock. This is the M4A1 equivalent. It uses an 88 gram CO2 bottle. The customer who bought it has been back since and says it's great for plinking with plenty of power.

The AR's being imported by Brocock are based on the Real Action Marker rifles and, therefore, devoid of any 'naughty' parts that the home office might get into a hissy fit over. However they will accept AR accessory parts like R.I.S. fore ends.