Reply With QuoteThere is no reason why worn out dovetails cant be built up with weld then re profiled, it will take a good Tig welder, all the old solder will need to be removed first.
part time super hero and seeker of justice
I picked up a Bsa standard this morning that has a lot of solder round the sights. not going to do anything with this gun for a while but when I do, if the dovetails are sh####d out beyond the point where you can tap them, can they be welded up? I assume Edbear is the man to ask?
Secondly--what size are Webley scope rails and are there any cheap plinker scopes (max 4x32) that will go straight on and if not, what mounts and scopes will do? Obviously a couple of original Webley scopes would be useful but sometimes if the guns havent got open sights, I just want to fit something to try the gun out. Thanks
Cooler than Mace Windu with a FRO, walking into Members Only and saying "Bitches, be cool"
Optimisic Pessimist Fella
There is no reason why worn out dovetails cant be built up with weld then re profiled, it will take a good Tig welder, all the old solder will need to be removed first.
Hi, .....It is possible to do a weld repair to dovetails, but is something you should consider as a last resort after trying the usual other fixes. I have done a few in the past, but in every case the dovetail (front sight normally for some reason)....had been enlarged/filed out/peppered with punch marks, and was impossible to repair with any of the following.
I would remove the sights, clean away all the solder, and see what you have to work with....If the sight is merely loose, and the area is undamaged, you have several options before resorting to welding...
1....The normal tapping down of the top dovetail edge, (carefully)...then see what fit you have.
2...If still slightly loose, use a shim (old feeler gauge sets are good!) under the sight to lift it up slightly...this often works very well.
3...Use a penetrating, bearing retaining Loctite.
4...Build up the foresight base itself (not the gun!) with weld, and reshape to suit the barrel dovetail.
If all above fail, then any competent tig welder can carefully add metal..BUT.....what you must consider is that on, say a .22 standard, the thickness between the "floor" of the front dovetail, and the bore wall is in the region of .098"....say 2.5 / 2.6mm, so heat control is critical, and unless precautions are taken, you will "blister" the bore with weld scale. I normally file away the dovetail edges to make a square slot (in severe cases), and use a heat barrier paste in the bore to help (cold front or similar).
So...you have now got a front dovetail slot half filled with weld, and the barrel profile has been cleaned up etc. The next problem is machining...The actual re-cutting of the slot is actually fairly straight forward, but must be done in one hit for obvious reasons...the main thing is preventing "chattering" and ensuring the slot is in the correct plane....I normally use a Milling machine, and hold the action in the machine vise by the loading tap area, where it is flat either side......This of course leaves the barrel dangling in free air, so you need to support and clamp this area with jacks etc. so it is as rigid as possible.
The other thing to consider is that you will lose all finish to the last part of the barrel, and a re-blue will be needed.
Hope this info helps, and normally I would have a look, but am stacked out with various jobs for the next 3-4 weeks at least.
part time super hero and seeker of justice
Thanks for that Ed. I am not in a rush for it (he says) and it is one that I intend to put away for when I (finally) move. SOOOOOOO how am I fixed at some point in the future if I take the solder off and cant sort it out
Cooler than Mace Windu with a FRO, walking into Members Only and saying "Bitches, be cool"
part time super hero and seeker of justice
Okay---So if I want to fit a more modern scope to a Webley (or Bsa for that matter) ----maybe a 4x32 for plinking, can I get a scope that will go straight on or is it a case of scope and mounts bought separately? Which ones?
I prefer to plink with open sights but have fitted a few period scopes to guns without open sights. HAVE YOU EVER TRIED TO PLINK WITH AN AIRSPORTER FITTED WITH A BSA 5x15? you need a scope to see the scope. In poor light you have to look round the scope to check tyou are somewhere near what you want to shoot at
. I have this problem with the period Bsa and Webley scopes tried but it varies with gun and whether you can get eye relief somewhere near
Cooler than Mace Windu with a FRO, walking into Members Only and saying "Bitches, be cool"
Here is one "one the go" at present........Originally Posted by keith66
As received.....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31228487@N07/4579078346/
Blob on some weld and get filing....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
Crown was a bit dinged, so clean up here too....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
Fore sight has the common problem....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
Blob up with weld again........
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
Start by getting end flat.......
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
More to do,but it's coming back.......
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
One additional benefit of this process is that you can make the foresight bead one of the other shapes offered by BSA at the time.....I have one diamond shaped (works well with a government wide vee rearsight, and one square, matched to a square "U" backsight element ...the missus likes this one on her L model)
Finally........Please....I know I am building myself a hole by posting these, so I must say here that I am really busy for the foreseeable future, and can't help with this sort of job for now......the idea of posting these pics is just to show how it is done, or for someone to print and show a local welder to give them some help..
Last edited by edbear2; 04-05-2010 at 06:20 PM.
Banned
Very good mate ! I love the Pics,
I have done all of these, ( Many times ) Its a pity you get them all at once, While your set up.
Here are a couple of mine,, Air arms broken cocking lever -Machine/Mill to shape new piece, T.I.G weld on Etc
This is my set up, Chinese Lathe/Milling machine, It does all I ever ask of it,
Along with the above, You will need Hundreds of Drills, Tap,s Milling cutters, Steel, Ali, Plastic bars of all kinds to work with etc,
As an example ; Edbear showed us the weld repair to the barrel end, To machine this exact groove out again, A milling cutter would have to be made to this exact shape, When its done though, Its of no more use unless your going to do another ?
I can make/repair almost anything, So if you have a broken part or require a new one making Etc, ( I am not looking for work here ) I have too much, Only to help out on the old guns,
But the real reason I do the above, Is because its good fun, & Addictive !
All the best, Ged.
part time super hero and seeker of justice
So what scopes will fit Webley/Bsa for plinking? 4 x32 big enough I reckon. Can I get a complete scope and mount together or do you have to getthem separately these days? The only reason asking is that with some of the old 4x20 scopes, I cant easily get a good sight picture (often with a black ring round the out side) and I have to crane my neck. Plus in poor light, its worsr than shooting with open sights
Cooler than Mace Windu with a FRO, walking into Members Only and saying "Bitches, be cool"
Registered User
I use a simmons 1.5-5 x 32 eightpoint I got from jsr on old springers, has a period look to it & works well,mounts sold seperately.
Here are a couple more Ged.......It is an old Bridgeport at work (Bessie), I don't have the space at home, but am working on that
Setting up cutter position on another barrel for depth and position....I clamp the loading tap area in a lined machine vise, and use a knocked up support for the muzzle end to prevent chattering.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...09051/sizes/l/
Cutting the dovetail......not much to see really, as covered in suds! (soluble cutting oil)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/3122848...7623019958012/
I took the other half's Canon SLR in to take pics, as my Panasonic compact is being repaired after I managed to fill it with dust......and the rest of the pics came out all blurry.......the job came out fine though
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