Tokyo Marui 1911

[sol1821]

i thought because of there power output they come into the same class as the co2 pellet firing pistols we use and can then look like a real gun without the need to be a skirmisher??

[magicniner]

The TM 1911a1 is classed as an RIF so is affected by the VCRA.

Not if it is developing over 1 Joule though - then it will class as an air pistol and not a RIF.
A sub 1 Joule pistol which has been modified to produce above 1 Joule is legally classed as an air pistol, whatever it's based on, or built to look like.
Regards,
Nick

[beagle2]

I was lucky and got a s/h one it's a TM 1911+A1 but the best part is it has had a guarder metal frame and slide kit replacing the plastic one this is not pot metal it is aluminum I just love it. One thing that I do like about airsoft guns as apposed to bb guns is ok they are not that powerfall but you do not have to worry about the plastic balls bouncing back and hitting you or the dog in the eye and they are surprisingly accurate as well.

[chris u'5]

Not if it is developing over 1 Joule though - then it will class as an air pistol and not a RIF.
A sub 1 Joule pistol which has been modified to produce above 1 Joule is legally classed as an air pistol, whatever it's based on, or built to look like.
Regards,
Nick

This wont have been the case in this situation though.

Either the OP is a airsoft skirmisher registered with UKARA or a skirmish site with PLI, the pistol he purchased is painted in a bright colour, it was sold to him illegaly or it was sold under some kind of loophole.

The OP PMd me to question why I was so interested in how he obtained the pistol but I'm just curious as he hasn't said that he's a suitably registered skirmisher so it makes me think it was purchased under some kind of loophole as I don't believe an established and well known retailer would risk his business by selling illegaly.

The OP has told me to contact Mr. Cripps and ask him what the story is but I've dealt with him several times in the past and wouldn't want to deal with him again which is why I asked the OP, it's as simple as that really.

Put it this way, airguns are banned in the UK and we are all forced to hand our rifles and pistols into the nearest police station for destruction
We all feel aggrieved but as law abiding citizens we obey the new laws but a few years later it becomes clear that airguns are still being sold and purchased either illegaly or via a loophole.

You would feel either;

a) Angry and cheated and/or
b) Want to know what the loophole was so you could get in on the act.

And as a side note pistols that are painted brightly by the retailer and sold are not strictly abiding by the VCRA as they are supposed to be painted brightly at the point of manufacture.

[Paul55]

No loophole, perfectly legal. I'm respecting the retailers wishes.

Now back off

[BobSki]

Paul, are you going to the pistol Gala at Redhill revolvers, Leicester on Saturday? If so I'll try to find you and have a chat (no hidden agenda) as I do Airsoft Practical Pistol.

[BobSki]

This wont have been the case in this situation though.
Either the OP is a airsoft skirmisher registered with UKARA or a skirmish site with PLI, the pistol he purchased is painted in a bright colour, it was sold to him illegaly or it was sold under some kind of loophole.

The OP PMd me to question why I was so interested in how he obtained the pistol but I'm just curious as he hasn't said that he's a suitably registered skirmisher so it makes me think it was purchased under some kind of loophole as I don't believe an established and well known retailer would risk his business by selling illegaly.

The OP has told me to contact Mr. Cripps and ask him what the story is but I've dealt with him several times in the past and wouldn't want to deal with him again which is why I asked the OP, it's as simple as that really.

Put it this way, airguns are banned in the UK and we are all forced to hand our rifles and pistols into the nearest police station for destruction
We all feel aggrieved but as law abiding citizens we obey the new laws but a few years later it becomes clear that airguns are still being sold and purchased either illegaly or via a loophole.

You would feel either;

a) Angry and cheated and/or
b) Want to know what the loophole was so you could get in on the act.

And as a side note pistols that are painted brightly by the retailer and sold are not strictly abiding by the VCRA as they are supposed to be painted brightly at the point of manufacture.

Chris, how do you "know"it won't have been the case in this situation? It is quite possible that the gun could have been built by Mike Cripps to a power exceeding 1 Joule which DOES take the pistol out of the RIF category and into the Air Pistol category and therefore DOES allow it to look like a "real" firearm.

Also, as Mike Cripps builds these pistols to the customers requirements from various parts, wouldn't that make him the "manufacturer" and therefore make any process of dual tone painting of the pistol quite legal? I'm not sure on this but would think it to be correct.

Your post suggests you have "history" with Mike Cripps and your "interest" in this may be more of a vindictive nature than you suggest, I may be wrong, if so I'm sorry, but that is how it appears to me and may I suggest, probably others too.

Kind Regards
Bob

[chris u'5]

It's a simple question so I don't understand why it's upsetting people but it obviously has so I'll apologise for causing distress to the OP and to Bob.

I'll leave it there anyway but I can assure you there is nothing "vindictive" in my query Bob, I haven't critised Mike Cripps in any way and my personal experiences with him are my own. It has nothing to do with Elite, it's a general query about the purchase of RIFs.

Best of luck fellas

[rockdrill]

From a bystander's perspective, I think it may have been the way you phrased your response.

AFAIK, the issue of power output is no loophole, just a fact of law in the same way as 12ft.lbs no licence, anything over needs FAC.

If the pistol in question produces more than the 1.5J limit then RIF status does not apply, instead the VCR rules on airgun sales apply.

[MikeB]

It's a simple question so I don't understand why you are being so evasive but it's none of my business really.

You got that part right, at least.

Move along now, nothing to see here. Who appointed you as the Airsoft Police, anyway?

[chris u'5]

It seems you have miscontrued my intentions, there is nothing sinister about my query and I'm not trying to have a go at anyone so take it easy guys.

[BobSki]

It's a simple question so I don't understand why it's upsetting people but it obviously has so I'll apologise for causing distress to the OP and to Bob.

I'll leave it there anyway but I can assure you there is nothing "vindictive" in my query Bob, I haven't critised Mike Cripps in any way and my personal experiences with him are my own. It has nothing to do with Elite, it's a general query about the purchase of RIFs.

Best of luck fellas

Understood Chris, as I said, I May have been wrong (and it looks like I was), it was just the way I read part of your post. You haven't upset me fella and I can understand your questions.

The power level of the gun does affect its position with regard to the VCR act though, so if Paul has bought one over 1 Joule it would be perfectly legal.

Kind Regards
Bob

[chris u'5]

No worries Bob

I'm sorry if my posts have caused offence which was never my intention.

[beagle2]

This wont have been the case in this situation though.

Either the OP is a airsoft skirmisher registered with UKARA or a skirmish site with PLI, the pistol he purchased is painted in a bright colour, it was sold to him illegaly or it was sold under some kind of loophole.

The OP PMd me to question why I was so interested in how he obtained the pistol but I'm just curious as he hasn't said that he's a suitably registered skirmisher so it makes me think it was purchased under some kind of loophole as I don't believe an established and well known retailer would risk his business by selling illegaly.

The OP has told me to contact Mr. Cripps and ask him what the story is but I've dealt with him several times in the past and wouldn't want to deal with him again which is why I asked the OP, it's as simple as that really.

Put it this way, airguns are banned in the UK and we are all forced to hand our rifles and pistols into the nearest police station for destruction
We all feel aggrieved but as law abiding citizens we obey the new laws but a few years later it becomes clear that airguns are still being sold and purchased either illegaly or via a loophole.

You would feel either;

a) Angry and cheated and/or
b) Want to know what the loophole was so you could get in on the act.

And as a side note pistols that are painted brightly by the retailer and sold are not strictly abiding by the VCRA as they are supposed to be painted brightly at the point of manufacture.

It sounds to me that someone is a bit jealous as the guy would not sell him a gun so he is acting like a spoiled kid and trying to make truoble for the guy how sad you are.

[chris u'5]

You couldn't be more wrong on all counts and I don't appreciate your disparaging comments.

I'm not jealous, I wasn't refused and I'm not trying to cause trouble for anyone.

I really can't understand why people are getting so angry about this, it was just a simple question as to what exemption the OP used to purchase the pistol

Anyway Paul, I hope you enjoy your TM 1911 A1, I'm sure you will!

There is a ton of upgrades and accessories available from Hong Kong (especially for this model) and some excellent retailers, unfortunately this can be very addictive and extremely expensive

A good quality metal kit kit from PGC makes a huge difference to the pistol but once you go down that road you wont be able to stop!

Next it'll be the grips, trigger, hammer...don't even get me started on the internals

It can be expensive buying from Hong Kong but the choice of products is amazing and it can often be the only option as UK retailers don't hold much in the way of GBB upgrades.

If you ever need any spares or upgrades for your 1911 give me a shout as I have a spares box full of goodies

As I said, I sold most of my collection but I kept a beautiful Western Arms Colt 1911 (the orginal, not the A1) and a Western Arms Colt Series 70 both have WA's 'Carbon Black' finish which is an amazingly realistic 'used and worn' finish.

I can't get on Photobucket on my work PC but I can post some pictures another time.

All the best and happy shooting