Improved Model D problem

[dogsbody]

Hi all,
Acquired a much abused BSA Improved Model D from about 1913. Main problem that I need some advice on is the tap hole. The hole is not circular, there is quite a lot of wear at the 2 o'clock position. Don't have the original tap so can't check for leaks. I understand that the tap and hole are tapered, so drilling and sleeving seem a difficult operation. Any one successfully sorted this problem? Anyone any ideas? I could scrap the rifle of course which is something I don't like doing, kind of like to bring it back from the dead.
atb
dogsbody

[edbear2]

Hi, this sounds really serious, and highly unusual!.......the taps are tapered, and individually lapped to each gun, with a number stamped both under the barrel and on the end of the tap to prevent mix ups in assembly.

The missing tap is a ball ache as taps from different guns rarely match exactly.......close enough to fire in many cases though.

Any more info?........serial number and calibre would be some help, and do you have the tap retaining plate and screws?

The normal procedure to repair one of these that has been shot with the retaining plate loose is to get the tap plated and re-lap in, but wear to the action breech area will be very hard to sort out.......however, these guns come apart at the cylinder / tap area joint (heat gun and strap wrench, they are soft soldered), so it may be the case that another action may pop up on that auction site and you can either swap all your stuff onto that, or keep your cylinder and use just the front end......depends on the size of your gun (43.5 or 45"......the latter being the .22 'sporting').

If the gun is complete, and depending on the type of stock, you will have a pleasant surprise at how much it is worth in bits....normally enough to buy another gun!


Some good photos would help, either post a link to flikr or photobucket etc., or email them to me and I will host them for you

[Binners]

Once again Eddie...Your knowledge astounds me

[Binners]

Once again Eddie...Your knowledge astounds me

I reckon you and Lakey could write the ultimate book on these...Better than Knibbsy and at least another 20 pages just for passion.

[Garvin]

I reckon you and Lakey could write the ultimate book on these...Better than Knibbsy and at least another 20 pages just for passion.

If Eddie was involved I reckon it would end up spread over ten 800-page volumes.

[Nitro-Express]

I reckon you and Lakey could write the ultimate book on these...Better than Knibbsy and at least another 20 pages just for passion.

I'll buy one!

[dogsbody]

Hi all,
Thought is was unusual and probably serious Eddie. The rifle is a .177, 43.5 in model. It needs an awful lot of work to get it looking reasonable. I do have a brand new tap that came with it, never been in a gun. If you put it in the tap hole you can only see half of the pellet hole so needs a lot of lapping in. Just thought it was a waste of time if its going to leak like a sieve because the hole is not round. I am hoping to get the original tap (broken lever) so maybe that will give me a clue to how bad it really is. The rifle is fitted with a straight stock but no butt plate, has the ribbed butt with wooden plug (missing of course). I know some of the rifles produced during WW1 had these stocks but according to Knibbs this one was made in the first half of 1913. Anybody know when these stocks were introduced?
It looks just like the one in the 1913 catalogue
atb
dogsbody

[edbear2]

Once again Eddie...Your knowledge astounds me

........I don't know THAT much mate, I do however have a mental problem (so my missus reckons) in that I can remember almost any fact or figure I read or see for years (but often can't find my bleedin keys after 5 mins).

Consequently my head is full of rubbish about all sorts of interests and hobbies I have had over the years....enough to get 100% of the answers on mastermind at least 3 times when I have watched it and the person's subject was something I have been interested in.

Back to the 'nettle bashers'........in engineering terms, the tap area on these is a glorified gas plug as fitted to every home years ago (I read that LJ's shop was adjacent to a gas fittings shop, and it was mooted he may have had his idea of the rotary tapered tap when looking at a gas fitting!).

Anyway, I have maybe 6-10 taps (post Lincoln / early BSA later 'fat' ones) ....It would be a simple job when time allows to measure these accurately and get a cutter made to re-machine the breech / loading area......the main problem is how to reclaim any wear in the breech as it is part of the barrel forging.....hot metal spray build up may be an option, as would an oversize tap and tool ground to suit....

In fact this latter would be the norm in engineering, a sort of 're-bore' and new piston job!...A fixture would have to made to hold the whole shebang in the correct orientation, but this new oversize method is all possible with time and effort, but totally non economical in most cases.

Regarding the O.P.....If the original tap can be found, It would be a start to blue the tap hole, and insert and twist the tap to see how it fits (any bearing surface will show shiny after the tap is removed...you can also use a Pental or similar quality permanent marker for this, extreme wear at one end may not be the end of the world as long there is contact around the pellet hole, and a fairly long lasting remedy that is more accessible to many folk in real terms may be to key the socket with sandblasting, use devcon plastic metal to fill, and and teflon thin tape around the tap...insert tap to get a basic fit, but not too hard, let the plastic metal set, then remove tap, remove tape, and lap in......The gun would be usable and should last a fair while if you think that this area is really over-engineered compared to say a MK6 sporter with its diecast junk set up.

Just an idea, another option would be to build up with a reclamation filler rod, either tig low melting or bronze, but this would entail removing the barrel from the cylinder and a lot of finish loss!

ATB, Ed

[dogsbody]

Thanks for all that Ed. Hoping to get the old tap but can't be certain about that. Will leave the tap problem until I know if I have the old tap. There are a few other problems with this gun and to resurrect it is going to take some time, still trying to shift the stock bolt for instance. I did manage to remove the trigger pivot bolt without damage after 2 days of WD40. Not too worried about finish on the metal bits as its a nice uneven black enamel at the moment. Its all good experience.
atb
dogsbody