Multi-shot air pistol

[harvey_s]

Can you show just one instance of an RFD being prosecuted for selling a .177 RIF ?
Any argument that all these sales are "slipping through the net" is Walter Mitty territory,
- Nick

Maybe because I can only think of 2 .177's with a power output low enough to qualify, the Gat and the G10.
The Gat the is mitigated by the fact it in no way imitates a real firearm.
However, the G10 does...but the fact that there's not exactly a rash of crim's using them to hold up banks or the fact that theres many thousands of pre-VCR airsoft replicas out there in secondhand circulation probably mean that any prosecution is hardly in the public-interest.

[jassi]

Milbro also used to make something with a push-in barrel, that functioned like a Gat, but looked like a Colt 1911

[Bjacobs571]

Well you asked for this so BOHICA

Look at the black ones for sale in the shops and wonder why the local FEO isn't interested, it's because you're wrong
Also look on the internet and see where you can buy one mail order, you can't because you're wrong ;-)
http://www.solware.co.uk/air-pistol-...r-pistol.shtml
http://www.getairgun.co.uk/smk.0.html
http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/1277_1_13972.html
Any more guidance you can vomit up in support of a statement which is clearly wrong would be greatly appreciated, I find it endlessly amusing

I have looked at your links which are "proof" that I am wrong because they sell the G10 pistol. It is obvious that you didn't look at your links before you posted. That is an old page you found on the Solware sight if you go to their home page you cannot navigate to that page as it is not current. I phoned Solware and they told me they have not been able to get the G10 pistol for at least a year.

I looked at the SMK web site and they do not list the G10 as a pistol they sell.
T
he Antics Website says they are out of stock and cannot get any more "We regret that this product is no-longer
available. Our current product range can be found at www.anticsonline.co.uk "

The getair website just says he will order any air gun you want , he doesn't have any in stock.
lots of companies leave out of date webpages on their website and the search engine will find them even if they are not current.

so perhaps you can find a retailer who has them in stock not just who has an old web page that mentions them.

My friend who told me about the G10 would love to find a supplier as he used to order them by the dozen and they used to sell like hot cakes

[Bjacobs571]

Power of a G10
All the American websites who sell the G10 which is a Marksman pistol re badged for who ever wanted to sell them (Diana, Milbro, Huntington etc.) quote the G10 as 200 fps . As for the gun which SMK has sold which is like a G10, I have no idea where it is made.
the websites who mention a power in the UK claim 300fps which is interesting as they may be a difference in the pistols that might be sold here and those sold in the US.

I found a YouTube video where the stupid kid who made the video shot his own hand with his G10 at point blank range to show how it would do no damage. I don't care how low powered a pistol is if it shoots anything more substantial than light I won't be shooting it at myself.

I found a review of the American G10 on the Pyrimid air Blogg

http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2006/...stol-that.html

Page 2 has the part where he Cronos a G10

I shot the 2000 for velocity, because it is the newest gun I have. The rated velocity is 220 f.p.s.
Daisy BBs (5.1 grains) averaged 187 f.p.s., with an 8 f.p.s. spread. 0.4 ft-lbs
RWS Hobbys (6.9 grains) averaged 123 f.p.s. with a spread of 6 f.p.s. 0.23 ft-lbs
Gamo Raptors (5 grains) averaged 217 f.p.s. with a spread of 20 f.p.s. That made them the velocity champs. Too bad that 300 pellets cost more than the gun! 0.52 ft-lbs
Finally a 12.7-grain Marksman dart (I used the same dart for all shots) averaged a turtle-esque 64 f.p.s. with a spread of just 5 f.p.s. 0.12ft-lbs


So the standard G10 as sold in the USA with pellets and BBs doesn't meat the criteria of being a firearm. There is no strict definition of a firearm but it is generally agreed by the courts that less than 0.74 ft-lbs and its not as it isn't capable of causing harm. A dart might pierce the skin as it has a point but it wont be able to penetrate enough to do any real damage.
I know that an eye is a lot more delicate but the chances of hitting an eye if you wanted to is 1,000,000 to 1 and the chances of hitting an eye if you don't want to is 1 to 1

[PJHIZZLE]

http://www.talarms.co.uk/acatalog/G1...r_Pistols.html

Almost bought one for my lil nephew

[jassi]

Gunstar also have a couple for sale http://www.gunstar.co.uk/Air-Pistols...px?newSearch=1

Judging by price, they may be becoming collectable

[Bjacobs571]

http://www.talarms.co.uk/acatalog/G1...r_Pistols.html

Almost bought one for my lil nephew

Press the "try our new website link" near the top of the page in red and try to find the G10 again. once again its an old out of date webpage
on their new website the G10 is not shown under SMK pistols.

Did you contact them and did they say they had them in stock?

[Bjacobs571]

Gunstar also have a couple for sale http://www.gunstar.co.uk/Air-Pistols...px?newSearch=1

Judging by price, they may be becoming collectable

I am sure there are lots of them on Gunstar as they have been made for 40 years, but only if they are new from a shop are they relevant to the discussion of can you buy then now from a gun shop

[jassi]

I am sure there are lots of them on Gunstar as they have been made for 40 years, but only if they are new from a shop are they relevant to the discussion of can you buy then now from a gun shop

Surely the point is that they are still freely available from a gundealer. Okehampton guns are a shop.

[Bjacobs571]

I agree that they are avaiable second hand. The dealer might not know there may be a problem and just assumes they are an intresting collectors pistol. I doubt anybody is going to be intrested in one or two pistols.
the point of the argument was I was told buy a RFD that you can't get them new anymore as they are technicaly not an airpistol because they are under the limit of what is an airpistol. The other person said I was an idiot to believe this and thay my friend was an idiot because they are airpistols and freely availible. So if people can find say 10 gunshops that have them new in stock then they are freely availible and I was a fool to listen to my friend otherwise I feel I am owed an apology

[ratgunner]

I have a working Milbro Repeater No: 6D270350 Pat Pending Made In Torrance California and I don't believe it is what your friend needs,

I would suggest he buys a Smith & Wesson Sigma in 6mm Model SW40 Made In Taiwan,

Has heavy 14 round mag that drops out when release button pushed,

Looks the Dogs In semi auto pistols,

Has articulated spring loaded trigger bar (conforms to your finger shape on contact)

Cock slide to the rear will give you one round White 6mm Plastic BB,

Mine gives me 12+ metres range, and is suprisingly accurate at short range,

I picked mine up for a tenner, I Love it as a fun pistol,

Lube with Abbey Silicone Spray,

Hope this Helps, Bernard.

[jefL]

the point of the argument was I was told buy a RFD that you can't get them new anymore as they are technicaly not an airpistol because they are under the limit of what is an airpistol.

There is no lower limit for an air pistol. the definition in law says capable of causing significant injury, which has been clarified by case law as a "penetrating" injury. It is generally accepted that at less than 1 ft lb a penetrating injury will not result so it will not be classed as a firearm. Not because it is below 1 ft lb but because it is incapable of causing a penetrating injury. If you have a pistol that uses air to discharge the projectile (spring, co2, PCP), and it discharges a dart at significantly less than 1 ft lb and sticks in someone's skin you have caused a penetrating wound and hey presto YOU HAVE A FIREARM.
.177 pistols are the most likely candidates here because it is possible to fire a .177 dart fast enough to cause an injury with very little power. As soon as you change calibres the projectile gets heavier and there is insufficient power to injure.

[ChrisH00]

How sharp does the projectile need to be? Because if you fired a hypodermic needle at extreme low velocity it would still penetrate the skin. More BS laws.
Laws should apply more to the person and their intent rather than the hardware itself.

[Bjacobs571]

What I should have said is

the point of the argument was I was told buy a RFD that you can't get them new anymore as they are technicaly not an Firearm because they are under the limit of what is an firearm.

as its not a firearm its then a imitation firearm and should be painted bright colours as airsoft are because they are airpistols but not a firearm.

My local shop phoned SMK to see if he could get some and he was told they don't sell them anymore and haven't for a couple of years. Since they appear to be for sale in the USA its not because they are not made anymore.

Back in the real world If SMK don't import them than they are not for sale in the shops therefore all arguments that they must be firearms because they are in the shops are invalid.

Finally a 12.7-grain Marksman dart (I used the same dart for all shots) averaged a turtle-esque 64 f.p.s. with a spread of just 5 f.p.s. 0.12ft-lbs

if think the dart would have to be very sharp at 0.12ft-lbs to piece the skin.

I remember at school we wrapped cotton around a pin with a few tufts of wool at the back. we then put used a bic pen as a blowpipe. I recon they were more powerful than a G10 with a dart