The Most Important Airguns - Top Ten?

[Geezer]

Thanks all for the replies.

I chose ten because it is really hard to get down to ten from my very long list of interesting guns. Item: Manuarm pistol. Desirability: high (always wanted one, do not know why, really, at all). Novelty or impact on design/sport: nil. Try BSF54, Original 50, and dare I say it Webley Mk3, ditto. And lots of other very good or interesting guns.

I nearly put a Venom on the list because of the importance of the 1980ish-onwards tuning houses to gun development, but held back. But Venom? Or Normay? Or Airgunaid? Or Airmasters? And so on. Or a Brum Tommy/Longbow, or TX, or new LGV as example of tuning techniques and design being in some way productionised?

Giffard? Agree. But what was the first post-Giffard successful mass market CO2 gun? Schimel? A Crosman? The latter might better make the list.

Meteor I considered. But less as a starter (see also Gamo Sniper, Relums, B2, RO71) but more as the first rifle sold as a package with a scope.

I also considered the 1990ish SSPs: the Dragon (I own one), Mohawk, etc. Fascinating. But little long term influence on the sport. And the S and P/Ensign/Brocock guns: similarly ultimately a dead end.

I find it very interesting how most - if not all - of the list has held up to challenge here.

[windygap]

There are some important springers from Engand and Germany. I'm not knowledgable to know exactly which ones ... but surely some BSA's are significant. HW and Diana's

BSA meteor, SHeridan (supergrade A/B ) I find magnificant examples or quality and are hightly collectable. And the Silver /blue streak as mentioned set a standard for a decent pumper for the masses.

Sharp rifles set high stds for a quality rifes and are still in prodcution , very hard to obtain new.

Air arms seemed to develop or grow in popularity quite well.

I like the Jackals , for better or worse I find them interesting air guns unlike anything before.

A Howa 55G might set the mark high for a quality Co2 rifle.

[Powderfinger]

Johnstone/Fearn system Webley pistols. In production since the early 1920's and still in limited production today. The various models of this pistol have introduced millions of people to shooting and they are still a great plinking or training pistol.

FWB 100 and 150. Was this the first gun with a sliding breech system of the type that is now found in the HW77/TX200?

Lincoln Jeffries underlevers. This seems to have been a big advance in making airguns that were practical tools for hunting and target shooting.

[Rob M]

Johnstone/Fearn system Webley pistols. In production since the early 1920's and still in limited production today. The various models of this pistol have introduced millions of people to shooting and they are still a great plinking or training pistol.

I'd second that, the Webley Overlever is a massive landmark in airgun history.

[Mattatack]

air arms prosport. the most innovative spring rifle of them all and in the right hands is as accurate as anything else which bumps the shoulder. a marvelous ken turner inspired masterpiece.

[Rickenbacker]

air arms prosport. the most innovative spring rifle of them all and in the right hands is as accurate as anything else which bumps the shoulder. a marvelous ken turner inspired masterpiece.

Awkward to cock, not as popular as the TX, and more hold-sensitive, 'AirArms does an Airsporter' ... Top 10? Really??

[Geezer]

Matt: I love the Pro-Sport, but it is a slightly improved HW77, with a factory version of a Venom lazaglide tune, and an Airsporter underlever. Ken Turner did a great job, but I think he'd acknowledge he had plenty of inspiration from existing guns. It is one of the most desirable airguns ever made, and one of the highest performing (though many prefer the original TX200 design), but I couldn't myself say it has been more important to the sport than those suggested by me and others above.

Looking at the sport now, I also wonder if the top ten should include the first realistic firearm replica CO2 pistol. In the modern era, I think that might be the Umarex CP88 (oddly, as the real P88 was a consummate failure); in years gone by, the Crosman 451 or 38T?

[MrGreengrass]

BSA L pattern .22
Webley Mk3
Airsporter Mk2
Webley Senior
BSF B55 deluxe
Hw 35 E .22
Fwb 124...Mk1
Hw80 ..Mk1.22
Rapid Mk1 .22
Rapid Mk2

Reason for choice ...production of airgunners over the years.......all really nice guns in their own way ...especially when in mint condition..

Used to hunt with the bsa ...

[Geezer]

BSA L pattern .22
Webley Mk3
Airsporter Mk2
Webley Senior
BSF B55 deluxe
Hw 35 E .22
Fwb 124...Mk1
Hw80 ..Mk1.22
Rapid Mk1 .22
Rapid Mk2 S Type .177



Used to hunt with the bsa ...

Nice list. We agree on a lot. But isn't the Mk3 really an LJ with a better stock and extraordinary finish?

I have the same issue with the Airsporter. It's a true classic, lovely, everyone should own one, anyone over 50 wanted one back in the day to the exclusion of all else bar a MK3, Falke or 35E, but it's ultimately an LJ with a full stock and a different cocking lever that prioritises "jet age" looks over function.

Same with the 55. Lovely gun. I would love the Venom Bavaria in particular. But, in its time, it was not only badly marketed in the UK, it was in essence a German Webley Vulcan sold at FWB Sport or HW35 prices. It could not and did not compete.

[pompeyplayer]

Definatly Daystate X2 Multi shot ... its amazing !!!

I have been toying with the idea of a short list of the airguns one might collect because of their importance in the development of the sport and could be used to illustrate the key points in the development of the modern airgun. Here's my starter, doubtless reflecting my bias toward rifles and especially sporting rifles. I'd be interested to hear what others think.

1. A Gem, for introducing the airgun to a mass market.
2. BSA underlever, for setting the standard for a grown-up air rifle for decades.
3. Sheridan pumper. First US "premium" airgun. Introduced - or popularised - 20 calibre. All subsequent pumpers are attempts to improve on it, often successfully.
4. Original Diana Model 60. First recoilless target rifle.
5. HW80. First gun designed specifically for the "adult airgun" market (FWB Sport close second; Webley Vulcan distant third).
6. Early 1980s Daystate. First modern PCP.
7. Theoben Siroccco. First gas ram.
8. HW77. Just sneaks in because it ruled FT when FT moved from a niche sport to a mainstream one, set a new bar for springers and sired the 97, TX, etc.
9. Theoben Rapid Seven. Brought together the buddy bottle and magazine and made the PCP the hunting tool of choice.
10. No idea. Probably a pistol (Webley Johnstone/Fearn?) or the first SSP match rifle (Anschutz? FWB?) , or something elsse I haven't thought of.

Oddly, aside from an Original 66 (improved 60), the only one I currrently own is the 77 (three of them) and that's the one I'm least sure about.

[ogilkes]

Interesting thread thsi is turning into. Here's my list of milestones. These are listed as milestones in development history and not just things I like:

1. Girandoni - as one of the first mas produced 'repeating' air guns
2. Quackenbush GEM - origin of all modern break barrels
3. Giffard CO2 - in essence the mother of all modern CO2 rifles
4. Lincoln Jeffries/BSA underlever, first underlever and the first real air 'rifle'
5. Webley Mk1 over lever pistols essentially the first reliable mass market air pistol
6. Diana/Wlather recoiless systems, LG55 etc.
7. HW80 first magnum rifle
8. First Daystate Huntsman, the beginning of the modern PCP revolution
9. Theoben gas spring rifles
10. ?????

Tempted to put Chinese air rifles in there as they must represent the greatest application of productive capacity to airgun manufacture ever tried, as well as the possible originators of the sliding breech. But thought that would be unpopular!

[Geezer]

Drat - just thought of another one. The FWB LP90 I think introduced the electronic trigger to airguns and is thus sort of the grandfather of those battery-powered daystates.

And a query: first buddy bottle rifle? Was that the Colchester Gamekeeper?

[Rickenbacker]

Hrm, but how important is the electronic tigger to airguns overall?

And by that rational - is it right to put a recoil reduced spring airgun in there, or a SSP rifle? Both being total milestones in match rifle/pistol development, but not so for general purpose or sporting guns ... ? ... although the SSP pistol has been a revolution to be fair ... LP-53 anybody??

[Rickenbacker]

1. Gem.
2. LJ/BSA underlever.
3. JF/Webley steel pistol.
4. Gat.
5. Crossman 1322.
6. Daystate Huntsman.
7. Theoben Siroccco.
8. HW77.
9. Theoben Rapid Seven.
10. The most important regulated PCP? ... or SSP pistol?

Rapid mk2, CRX, Ripley, or SuperTen? ... or the holy GC2 ... or the NJR 100
Walther LP-53, FAS AP-604, Gamo Compact, or the Webley Alectro Multi/single SP!

[ogilkes]

Good to see the GAT in there, but the actual design and patent for this was another Quackenbush effort in the US during he 1880's (?), so it should be up with the GEM.
[
QUOTE=Rickenbacker;5728315]1. Gem.
2. LJ/BSA underlever.
3. JF/Webley steel pistol.
4. Gat.
5. Crossman 1322.
6. Daystate Huntsman.
7. Theoben Siroccco.
8. HW77.
9. Theoben Rapid Seven.
10. The most important regulated PCP? ... or SSP pistol?

Rapid mk2, CRX, Ripley, or SuperTen? ... or the holy GC2 ... or the NJR 100
Walther LP-53, FAS AP-604, Gamo Compact, or the Webley Alectro Multi/single SP! [/QUOTE]