Building a HW35LGV

[T 20]

Well Folks


Back in July, John (HW55t) asked me what gun I thought Weihrauch should produce to celebrate their 2,000,000th gun.

Without really thinking about it this was my reply :-





It would be nice if Weihrauch produced a limited run of aniversary 35s --- but not any old 35s.


As the 35 cylinder is made in two parts brazed together I'd like to see the breach jaws section made with a machined 25mm ID X 30mm OD cylinder on the back of it with a 3mm OD X 4mm long transfer port.
This could be slid into the standard HW35 30mm Id cylinder and brazed in, so giving the same arrangement as the Walther LGV. The piston could then be made the same as a TX200/LGV with bearings.
Now as this would reduce the transfer port length from 26.3mm to 4mm there would be an extra 22.3mm stroke length to play with, but I'd stick with about 71mm as this still works in a standard 35 stock with no alterations to the woodwork.
A standard HW77/97 spring could be used in this cylinder coupled with a standard spring guide, back block and trigger unit.

Externally I'd like to see a carbine barrel with blended in slimline silencer and the whole lot set in a 35E walnut stock.

For a little bling it would be nice if the trigger block and barrel catch were gold plated and the trigger, trigger guard and pistol grip cap were made from brass.


The reason I'd like to see a HW35 made as I outlined above is the simple fact that Weihrauch would only have to produce 2 new main components to make a powerplant on a par with the new Walther LGV.
This would also give a proper old school retro gun with up to date guts.
This powerplant could also be retrofitted to any older 35s needing an upgrade.


The blingy bits outlined are a nod to some of the old school tuners.


Gold plated Trigger housing --- Northern Arms, Gold Sierra 77

Plated barrel latch --- Normay, Vixen 35

Slimline Silencer --- Venom

Brass Trigger and Guard --- Airmasters/Venom

Brass Pistol grip cap --- T R Robb


I doubt it will ever happen --- but I may make one for a laugh.



Well, Tony (bigtoe) picked up on this idea and has sleeved a few HW80s down to a 25mm bore and short stroked them with great success so I thought I should get on with a HW35LGV :- so I've made a start.

After gettting the breech block out of my spare HW35 cylinder and doing a bit of measuring the design of the gun was fixed in my head (6.75mm long transfer port and 25mm X 71mm stroke).


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...1012006664.jpg
http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...1012006666.jpg


Bigtoe came to my rescue (cheers Tony) in supplying me with a length of 25mm ID x 30mm OD tube and a 16 joule Walther LGV service kit.


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006675.jpg


After a bit of machining today on the HW35 breech block I ended up with this :-


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006689.jpg
http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006683.jpg (crap photo )


As you can see machining the breech down broke through into both the breech latch slot and the hole for the barrel stop ---- this was expected.

So the holes were welded shut and the block remachined to accept the 25mm ID tube.


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006694.jpg


With the 25mm tube welded to the breech block I should end up with an assembly that looks like this :-


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006695.jpg


When that major part of the build is complete I'll concentrate on modifying the piston to length to enable the standard 35 cocking link to work on the rim on the rear of the LGV piston.


http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...5012006696.jpg


I'll keep you all posted on progress and by way of a thankyou I'll be posting on Tony's blog with a bit more detail.




All the best Mick

[TonyL]

Hi Mick,

Saw your earlier ideas whilst discussing with Tone, and I knew it was going to be a mouth-watering prospect.
And here's the proof!
Been missing you on here.....weren't sure if you had gone away. This answers all.....you've obviously been a very busy chap.

Well done on what you've achieved so far, it looks brilliant! Can't wait to see the finished article and performance evaluation, either on here or on Tone's site.

Going back to your original factory design brief, personally I'd have to slightly modify and go for the Luxus stock as opposed to the Export one. But that's just me.

Well done on an excellent, well thought out, project.

And a belated Merry Christmas and a Very Happy and Successful New Year to you Mick.

Tone.

[Papa g]

Fascinating stuff! Look forward to seeing the finished item ,Looks a pukka job so far!

[thevoid]

Some might say its over the top engineering (most of these also are classed as tuners sitting behind the counters of certain RFDs)
To be honest it all makes perfect sense what you have done but it begs the question why Weihrauch made guns with such large transfer ports.
Had I still been in a fab shop environment I'd have toyed with the idea of de-brazing the jaws off my 50 and machined the block back as a simple way to both increase swept volume as well as transfer port efficiency.

I've been chatting to Bigtoe too long

Love what you breed of tuners are doing and would love to be able to shoot the finished article.

How long before you guys finally build a rifle from scratch with nothing more than a barrel blank and a rekord trigger?

[bigtoe01]

Some might say its over the top engineering (most of these also are classed as tuners sitting behind the counters of certain RFDs)
To be honest it all makes perfect sense what you have done but it begs the question why Weihrauch made guns with such large transfer ports.
Had I still been in a fab shop environment I'd have toyed with the idea of de-brazing the jaws off my 50 and machined the block back as a simple way to both increase swept volume as well as transfer port efficiency.

I've been chatting to Bigtoe too long

Love what you breed of tuners are doing and would love to be able to shoot the finished article.

How long before you guys finally build a rifle from scratch with nothing more than a barrel blank and a rekord trigger?

well I just bought the Mill to help me do it LOL.

Bring it on Mick...loving it up to now

[TonyL]

How long before you guys finally build a rifle from scratch with nothing more than a barrel blank and a rekord trigger?

With Mick and Tone's skills, not long at all, I'd say!

[Andy001]

I love reading threads like these.

[T 20]

To be honest it all makes perfect sense what you have done but it begs the question why Weihrauch made guns with such large transfer ports.

Ah well

There a a few good reasons why the 35 breech block extended so far into the cylinder.

1) The breech blocks were brazed in so a long block made for a large surface area for the braze to form a strong joint.

2) The hole for the barrel stop extended a fair old way into the breech block so the length was needed.

3) On the early 35 there were two forend screws holding the stock on, these were screwed into the extended breech block.

Had I still been in a fab shop environment I'd have toyed with the idea of de-brazing the jaws off my 50 and machined the block back as a simple way to both increase swept volume as well as transfer port efficiency.

I had thought about that myself :- it would be a win win win situation:-

Shorter transfer port
Increased swept volume
And you'd gain room for a longer spring if needed.


With the breech block altered as I've shown it would be possible to build a 30mm X 95mm stroke HW35 --- that's 14mm more stroke than a HW80.




All the best Mick

[thevoid]

Ah well

There a a few good reasons why the 35 breech block extended so far into the cylinder.

1) The breech blocks were brazed in so a long block made for a large surface area for the braze to form a strong joint.

2) The hole for the barrel stop extended a fair old way into the breech block so the length was needed.

3) On the early 35 there were two forend screws holding the stock on, these were screwed into the extended breech block.
I had thought about that myself :- it would be a win win win situation:-

Shorter transfer port
Increased swept volume
And you'd gain room for a longer spring if needed.


With the breech block altered as I've shown it would be possible to build a 30mm X 95mm stroke HW35 --- that's 14mm more stroke than a HW80.
All the best Mick

Of course, the long block makes sense when explained like that.
I've sent the 50 to Bigtoe to work his magic on the piston, it will give me all the power I need but mainly I needed to get the gun out of my house so I didn't tinker with it without the use of proper tools.
I might look out for a doner gun in future if my spine ever gets fixed.

[T 20]

Hi Mick,

Been missing you on here.....weren't sure if you had gone away. This answers all.....you've obviously been a very busy chap.

Hi Tony

I've been busy at work (even worked yesterday) but I haven't had much time to play with guns lately.

All the above work on the 35 was done this afternoon --- it really is that easy to do.

I decided from the off not to use any specialised equipment on this build so I'm using a single phase hobby type MIG welder for all the welds and an old student lathe for all the machining.

In doing this it shows that anybody could do this in their garage or workshop.

Going back to your original factory design brief, personally I'd have to slightly modify and go for the Luxus stock as opposed to the Export one. But that's just me.

My idea behind this project was to show what Weihrauch could be making using the minimum of none standard parts, hence the use of the E stock as it's still in production.

And a belated Merry Christmas and a Very Happy and Successful New Year to you Mick.

Tone.

And a Happy Christmas to you as well Tony and to all other BBS Members




All the best Mick

[TonyL]

Hi Tony



All the above work on the 35 was done this afternoon --- it really is that easy to do.


In doing this it shows that anybody could do this in their garage or workshop.

My idea behind this project was to show what Weihrauch could be making using the minimum of none standard parts, hence the use of the E stock as it's still in production.



All the best Mick

Hi Mick,

Cheers for that. It's going to be a brilliant project.
Although I have a garage, it's nothing like a workshop, which is what I really need! At one point, I had six motorbikes in the garage,there's only one in their now and I still can't move in there..... the rest of the space is taken up by the wife's and kids' crap. I don't even have a workbench with a vice, so have to go around to my day's to borrow his.....I know, a very poor state of affairs!
And I don't have the skill or confidence.....maybe one day....In the meantime, peeps like me will take great interest in the work that you and Tone are doing.

And I fully understand your design brief / criteria.......hopefully messrs HW will take note..

Can't wait to see the finished product and performance test.

Will you let Jim run a feature of it in AGW, now he has all the recoil measuring equipment etc? Now that would be something......and the factory would have to take note...

[u.k.neil]

Hi Mick

Very, very interesting mate...

Whereabouts in Nuneaton are you? I am quite close to the Crows Nest pub.

Neil

[look no hands]

I have to agree as well with what's been said already, I've been talking to Tony too long as well, I used to do a lot of home tuning of older guns but could never really get them as good as a SFS tune (other tuners are available) for the price SFS would charge, I sort of gave up on the idea and have for many years allowed others to do the work for me, I recently had a chat with Tony (Bigtoe) and also purchased his Diana 280k off of him BUT I do have to say after that conversation he has wetted my appitite again for some tinkering, I only wish I had the skill and tools (I do have a vice, pillar drill and bench grinder in my shed) to be able to do a very small amount of what you guys seem to be able to do, I also have an ex engineer friend of my wife's who has a lathe as well so if needed he can do some small bits for me, next year I'm intending to tune a rifle I've found in a gun shop (I won't tell you what it is as I'll get my arse bitten off) and have Tony's (and maybe others) input into it as well but I want to try and do most of the work myself.

Thanks for the insperation again guys

Cheers

Pete

[T 20]

Hi Mick

Very, very interesting mate...

Whereabouts in Nuneaton are you? I am quite close to the Crows Nest pub.

Neil

Hi Neil

I'm on a farm at the back of MIRA from you, about half a mile North of the crossroads between Stoke and Higham.

Most folks know my place because of all the Shetland ponies.



All the best Mick

[T 20]

I'm intending to tune a rifle I've found in a gun shop (I won't tell you what it is as I'll get my arse bitten off) and have Tony's (and maybe others) input into it as well but I want to try and do most of the work myself.

It dosen't work like that with me Pete


I hate all this gun Snobbery, I'm just as happy working on a b2 as I am working on a 77k.




All the best Mick