Interesting findings of Walther LP53 and Lucznik

[clarky]

As a person that has a couple of LP53's I did find that interesting.

Thanks for the post,

ATB.

Thanks buddy. I am not expecting much interest because I think most owners of LP53s inparticularly, will want to keep their guns as design and I don't blame them. For me however, this kit does not permanently alter design but does improve the gun a goodly amount.
The problem with the Walther is it uses a different piston head arrangement. While a whole raft of piston heads can be spun up and fitted to the screw on piston face (as with so many designs) of the Lucznik, the Walther has a one off method of fitting with a keyhole head unit comprising of a leather piston washer and steel keyhole/guide locator. Its a nice idea and dispenses with the need for screws but does cause real problems if wanting to fit your homemade Teflon/leather washer.
I will look at perhaps using this P18 Konceptus mainspring. It fits the piston of the Walther perfectly, then may turn up a guide rod to slip over the existing guide off the base of the grip cap.
The Walthers upper keyhole locater/tiny guide rod at the other end rules out the piston weight fitting in the kit which gave the Lucznik 25fps during my tests. A good 50 fps came from the spring and guide though, meaning one should be able to get the Walther to within 25fps of the Lucznik.

[mrto]

Thanks buddy. I am not expecting much interest because I think most owners of LP53s inparticularly, will want to keep their guns as design and I don't blame them. For me however, this kit does not permanently alter design but does improve the gun a goodly amount.
The problem with the Walther is it uses a different piston head arrangement. While a whole raft of piston heads can be spun up and fitted to the screw on piston face (as with so many designs) of the Lucznik, the Walther has a one off method of fitting with a keyhole head unit comprising of a leather piston washer and steel keyhole/guide locator. Its a nice idea and dispenses with the need for screws but does cause real problems if wanting to fit your homemade Teflon/leather washer.
I will look at perhaps using this P18 Konceptus mainspring. It fits the piston of the Walther perfectly, then may turn up a guide rod to slip over the existing guide off the base of the grip cap.
The Walthers upper keyhole locater/tiny guide rod at the other end rules out the piston weight fitting in the kit which gave the Lucznik 25fps during my tests. A good 50 fps came from the spring and guide though, meaning one should be able to get the Walther to within 25fps of the Lucznik.

Even more interesting, because as much as I like the LP53 it is a bit gutless power-wise and if the power can be upped smoothly and any mod reversable I am all ears.

If only there was a way of getting the LP3 to perform a bit better eh?!

[clarky]

Even more interesting, because as much as I like the LP53 it is a bit gutless power-wise and if the power can be upped smoothly and any mod reversable I am all ears.

If only there was a way of getting the LP3 to perform a bit better eh?!

Ok ive homed in on why the Walther is just as powerful as the stock Lucznik despite a smaller volume.
Its because the piston is heavier. Due to the strength of the mainsprings the walther is better balanced in piston weight terms because its longer in length, despite losing a good couple of mm in stroke length due to the keyhole paraphernalia.
This why the Konceptous kit contains a piston weight of considerable (relatively) size....these little pistons lack weight!!
I have drawn up a design for a Delrin guide rod which will slip over the Walthers existing guide, complete with lower top hat of approx. 1mm ...or the same as a conventional guide in shape (im not sure how thick I can go with this yet) The guide will now be a nice slide fit on the outer spring, not the inner. This should now accept the P18 lucznik none stock spring.
However, the piston head end has a tiny guide (length of 8mm) which will now be loose on the outer spring and rendered useless of course but should not matter as the piston will do the job at that end just like any airgun with no top hat.
I will get here over the course of the B/hol and then maybe look at a piston weight washer if I get left with any room after assembly.
Im setting myself the challenge of 450fps but maybe being optimistic...

That LP3 you mention cannot be improved sadly. Even the new piston head replacements cannot drive them above 350fps.
We looked at setting the head closer to the valve but its near enough perfect. I would say less then 0.1mm of clearance to take up ....perhaps 10fps or something but risking the piston bottoming down and straining something.

[GRAZY]

I love the lp53 and have not yet had mine apart, I was always a bit put off that I may end up damaging the finish to the grip cap. I have seen this recommended to be done with a soft metal strap twisted tight around like an oil filter remover, but I've never been too sure on this. That aside I would love to improve the feel of the pistol as it always seemed a bit clunky when shot and not so much bang for your buck in the power stakes.

[clarky]

I love the lp53 and have not yet had mine apart, I was always a bit put off that I may end up damaging the finish to the grip cap. I have seen this recommended to be done with a soft metal strap twisted tight around like an oil filter remover, but I've never been too sure on this. That aside I would love to improve the feel of the pistol as it always seemed a bit clunky when shot and not so much bang for your buck in the power stakes.

No my friend its dead easy to remove. Just unscrew anti clockwise but with the palm of your left hand driving upward slightly as you unscrew in anticipation to receive the jolt as the cap comes free. Its not under spring compressor like forces but enough to fly down to your balls if your not careful.
At this point there is nothing to lose, no trigger springs to go flying off....just the 2 mainsprings that you can inspect and lightly grease. The cap and springs come out with about 10lbs of force under approx. 30mm of preload. You will easily cope with it but I would not recommend the operation for a junior.
Its getting the piston out where your problems start. So if your not a bit handy mechanically stop here.
When you put your grip cap back on you need to drive upward and turn at the same time. Put a tiny drop of lube on the threads to help if wanted but ive never manage to damage the finish any in many strip downs.
Its possibly the easiest gun to access the springs but the hardest with the piston. You need to get the cocking pawl out to do that, which requires the pin tapping out which sits under the grips so the grip panels need to come off first.
I can give you an instant 20fps with a thruster washer to sit under your springs, machined from self lubricating Delrin. but I have not moved into the world of Walther 53 tuning because the piston head is such a complex little bugger to allow easy mods.
I will post more regarding the performance of this P18 spring in the Walther and possible a Delrin guide rod but it requires careful planning, measuring and try out before I would report anything positive here.

[GunDad]

Being the owner of an LP53 already, I'm reading this with interest, although I don't intend any mods to mine. It comes out several times a year for light use, and always performs faultlessly. I've been tempted a few times to remove the end cap for a spring relube, but 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' is always foremost in my mind.
In fact holding a FAC and fortunate enough in my location to have several S&W .22 lr revolvers & pistols, I can honestly say I get equal satisfaction whenever I bring out the Walther (for use at 10 meters), such is it's fine engineering, balance and excellent feel throughout the firing cycle. It's one of the few air pistols that I've been tempted to duplicate.

[clarky]

Being the owner of an LP53 already, I'm reading this with interest, although I don't intend any mods to mine. It comes out several times a year for light use, and always performs faultlessly. I've been tempted a few times to remove the end cap for a spring relube, but 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' is always foremost in my mind.
In fact holding a FAC and fortunate enough in my location to have several S&W .22 lr revolvers & pistols, I can honestly say I get equal satisfaction whenever I bring out the Walther (for use at 10 meters), such is it's fine engineering, balance and excellent feel throughout the firing cycle. It's one of the few air pistols that I've been tempted to duplicate.

Its a good little shooter but major flawed (in comparison with modern springer design) for utilising 2 mainsprings one inside the other in attempt to pull out the most from its small internals. Basically the large outer spring is guided by the inner as a sudo guide rod but guide rods should be ultra smooth and not trying to twist or rippled with bound up coils. Hence the firing cycle is one of thud, twang bounce, when it only needs to be a thud.
I did achieve what I was seeking at the start of the post but did not relay anymore of my findings due to lack of interest in the thread.
I will however launch a topic on the airgun forum for anyone who is interested.

To be fair this site is more about springer tuning and PCP stuff, where pistols are a tiny side topic.