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Thread: Taming the HW80 my way

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by look no hands View Post
    I know what you mean mate, it is a real problem if you have a family as well, I remember reading some of your old posts about how many days at work you do and the lack of weekends you have at home.

    ATB and take care.

    Pete

    Cheers for that, Pete.

    Yep, work every Saturday and alternate Sundays. The joys of working in the retail motorbike trade!

    It does make you really value your time off, though!

    Dunno how long it'll be until she starts moaning about going down the club on a Wednesday night....I've managed four in a row, now!

    Still not enough time, though. I could really do with coming into enough money so that I could work four days a week. Then I could hopefully get the play / family balance somewhere near right.

    Really struggling to find time to play enough......I could REALLY do with the range time. I've only shot at short range at home for years, so re-joining the club has served to highlight how crap a shot I've become! And I need some time to fit my WD spring kit to my 99, the same to my 95, do a lube service on my 98 and Venom 77, as I want at least one or two sorted and fettled before the spring bash.

    Might have to chuck in a sickie or two!!!!!
    THE BOINGER BASH AT QUIGLEY HOLLOW. MAKING GREAT MEMORIES SINCE 15th JUNE, 2013.
    NEXT EVENT :- May 4/5, 2024.........BOING!!

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by wonky donky View Post

    we all know how Venom did it with the Lazerglided 80 & it's well known Bigtoe01 did a similar thing by sleeving the 80's 30mm cylider down to 25mm, he went that extra mile & fitted a Walther LGV rotating piston & altered the trigger latch sear to accommodate the Walther piston rod.

    TonyL has always said how he liked my short stroke modified 80 ever since shooting it at last years springer bash,




    How does it shoot, well the stroke on this version is only 60mm, 12fpe is no problem at all, makes it with loads to spare. It shoots like a dream, so quiet too, I'm amazed myself with this one so lord only knows what TonyL would think because it's miles better than when he last shot it. Quick but not snappy, no lag or hint of laziness. Is it as good as a 80 Lazerglide? No! it's so much better it's in a bifferent league, truly!

    OK so it's .22 what would it be like in .177 I here you ask, well I can tell you, a quick route round to find my 95k with the 310 barrel, a quick change over a tin of JSB Exact over the chrono 10fpe & stunning to shoot. I have a HW55T I shot bell target with last week, the 80 is quieter, smoother, easier to cock & has miles less recoil.......am I happy I'll say!!

    Let me tell you, forget upping the power on a HW55.........Detune & tame an 80, I promise you won't regret it, it's the way to go.

    Is it finished NO!
    This sounds ABSOLUTELY AWESOME, Dave.

    I'm frothing at the mouth already!!

    I know I'm not the first...many, many springer fans will have debated for years as to which would be the best way to go......narrow bore / longer stroke vs big bore / mega short stroke.

    Much of the more recent thinking has pointed more towards the smaller bore option being the favoured option, with lighter piston weight and the fact that pellet release pressure is achieved whilst the piston is further from the cylinder end wall, supposedly giving more manageable surge characteristics.

    But THIS is very encouraging. Yes, your short stroke 80 I tried last year was beautiful. Okay, we weren't doing clinical accuracy testing, but I have no reason to suppose that it would not be anything other than very accurate and forgiving.

    And you say that this latest project results in an even better firing cycle. FANTASTIC!

    This could finally lead to the 80 re-establishing itself as a firm favourite amongst UK shooters.

    I know I asked last year if you'd consider making a short stroke piston commercially available.....If this thing works as well as it should, and judging by your findings so far, it does, this could be a very simple drop-in affair, so easy for those with only basic skills to completely transform their rifles at home; something that many couldn't undertake a reduced cylinder conversion without more tooling or expertise. And I really love the idea of the longer rod, as I've mentioned previously, so you don't get that "dead" movement on initial barrel opening.

    Bring back the mighty 80. A big, solid, heavyweight of a thing. Solidly engineered to last a lifetime. Loads of weight to settle the aim and soak up the slight recoil.

    With you mentioning the performance vs the 55....... Just think how sweet you could make one with an even longer rod, tiny stroke, set up to produce 6 or 7 ft.lbs!!!!


    I WANT ONE!!!! Please!
    THE BOINGER BASH AT QUIGLEY HOLLOW. MAKING GREAT MEMORIES SINCE 15th JUNE, 2013.
    NEXT EVENT :- May 4/5, 2024.........BOING!!

  3. #18
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    same basic make up as my LGV piston with a short stroke 30mm nose and the LGV piston weighs less....

    Not as shiny though

    You have to remove around 8mm off the stroke by adding to the nose minimum to allow the new style cocking shoe to be used, you can go down to 55mm stroke if you do the rod and the nose and still see 11+fpe at 30mm especially in .22

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigtoe01 View Post
    same basic make up as my LGV piston with a short stroke 30mm nose and the LGV piston weighs less....

    Not as shiny though No Tony its not got a short stroke nose.

    You have to remove around 8mm off the stroke by adding to the nose minimum to allow the new style cocking shoe to be used, you can go down to 55mm stroke if you do the rod and the nose and still see 11+fpe at 30mm especially in .22
    No I just made the body of the piston longer! If I had used a short stroke nose the piston would have been lighter but I'm not entirely sure I want it much lighter tbh

    There's always more ways than one!
    Last edited by wonky donky; 24-03-2014 at 01:20 AM.

  5. #20
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    aye i know BUT you have increased weight, I did an LGV piston here for an 80 with 30mm nose that weighed 230g 70mm stroke, 50g lighter than where you are at... which means you can tune the piston weight now with steel or brass tophat etc or use acetal to keep the weight down.


    get drilling some holes or thin it down some more.

    Alloy body, threaded skirt, steel bearing band on the back loctited on (hardened steel) may be the best bet

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigtoe01 View Post
    aye i know BUT you have increased weight, I did an LGV piston here for an 80 with 30mm nose that weighed 230g 70mm stroke, 50g lighter than where you are at... which means you can tune the piston weight now with steel or brass tophat etc or use acetal to keep the weight down.


    get drilling some holes or thin it down some more.

    Alloy body, threaded skirt, steel bearing band on the back loctited on (hardened steel) may be the best bet
    Absolutely no chance! Don't forget I'm at 60mm stroke not 70mm. my first mod was at 68mm! I'm heading for 50mm & I feel you can go to light. there comes a time when you get diminishing returns & I feel it's far sooner than the theories may suggest.

    Anyway I have not increased weight the original piston was well over 300gms 340ish iirc?

    The lighter the piston the more spring/pre-load, I know this you know it & others on here have been finding out....I put a thread on here some time ago HOW MUCH PRE-LOAD IS TOO MUCH but deleted it because it attracted mostly uneducated responses.

    Untill I have more of my own data it remains as is...anyway you haven't shot it! I had a chap here today with his shooting mate from Liverpoll trying it & they were absolutely blown away with how it shot.......the one lad has had rifles tuned at all the best tuning houses as well!

    No nothing radical, a bit at a time will do!
    IF IT'S NOT BROKE.........DON'T FIX IT!

  7. #22
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    At the end Dave's first post he says he is happy ( that's a first), then goes on to say ...." is it finished, No..."
    That proves that Dave is not actually happy. Dave is never happy with his tunes.....even when I shoot one of his tuned rifles ,that may have had 20 hours work on it,and go "wow"..... worries that it isn't good enough.
    This is why his tuning work is so outstanding and worth every penny. His quest for perfection is never ending,, and for that WE should be grateful. Wonky and Bigtoe are always searching for perfection but because of their mindset will never find it.
    They are true airgun tuning pioneers, ' boldly going where no man has gone before'.
    Just don't overdo it mate.....oh, and yes you do need to get out more.!
    atb,
    Pete.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by wonky donky View Post
    The lighter the piston the more spring/pre-load, I know this you know it & others on here have been finding out....I put a thread on here some time ago HOW MUCH PRE-LOAD IS TOO MUCH but deleted it because it attracted mostly uneducated responses.
    I'm rather interested in this too... for me personally, so long as the piston isn't slamming, the only way you can have too much preload is:
    i) the gun in too hard to cock
    ii) components are put under excessive stress
    iii) the spring itself is under too much stress

    Personally, I like lots of preload... but practically, most of my guns end up shooting nice in the 40-70mm range... probably about 50-60 kg preload force max, most are more like 15-30 kg (and around 50mm)

  9. #24
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    at 60mm or so you have turned the hw80 into a hw35 with a short transfer port...interesting fact

  10. #25
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    And I STILL want one!
    THE BOINGER BASH AT QUIGLEY HOLLOW. MAKING GREAT MEMORIES SINCE 15th JUNE, 2013.
    NEXT EVENT :- May 4/5, 2024.........BOING!!

  11. #26
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    I do want a break barrel, but have found those that I've dabbled with have just felt too light for me to be truly comfortable with.

    The thought of a short stroked 80 does appeal (not that I have the time or money at the moment!). My Wonky Donked TX is my sole gun at the moment (and the forseable future), so I'd be intrigued to see the magic he can weave on an 80 as well, or some of the other learn'd gents on here for that matter.

    A couple of years on from this thread, has there been much development on what set up best suits a sub 12 .177 80?

    Whilst most of it goes straight over my head, I do find these types of threads fascinating...

    Maybe I need to get out more!

  12. #27
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    Joffy's been playing with one too, recently.
    THE BOINGER BASH AT QUIGLEY HOLLOW. MAKING GREAT MEMORIES SINCE 15th JUNE, 2013.
    NEXT EVENT :- May 4/5, 2024.........BOING!!

  13. #28
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    Brilliant read, I knew there was a reason I got an 80 last year
    Basc member

    *** Looking for a Diana 54/52 ***

  14. #29
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyL View Post
    Joffy's been playing with one too, recently.

    Its a very different beast to the original gun
    them there springer's are soooooo addictive

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by joffy View Post
    Its a very different beast to the original gun
    Spill the beans please!

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