Target and foresight sizes

[Nikkormat]

Can anyone tell me the usual sizes of target (bull size) for rifle shooting at 25 and 50 metres, and also the usual sight set-up - iris size and foresight size?

I know it's common to use a 1.1mm or so iris with something around 4mm up front at 10 metres, I'm just interested to see how it compares to longer range disciplines.

Matt

[Vic Thompson]

The Nsra Rules list Target Dimensions as below (http://www.nsra.co.uk/index.php/downloads/rules) :

1989 SERIES - LONG RANGE
Scoring Ring (Inward gauging - see Rule 5.1.6)
Value 100 yards 50 yards
X Ring 12.40 4.09
10 26.48 9.03
9 57.32 23.66
8 88.16 38.29
7 119.00 52.92
6 149.84 67.55
5 180.68 82.18
4 211.52 96.81
3 242.36
2 273.20
Aiming Mark
205.55 102.78

Also, not quite what you wanted to know, but this link contains useful advice : http://www.hamptonrifleclub.org.uk/consider.htm.

HTH,

Vic Thompson.

[TheWilding]

Well played sir, that hampton rifle club link is a splendid link for the home rifle shooter like myself that is still in the learning stages of target shooting........, sat on the bog and read most of it until the blood was cut off to my feet, I'll be reading the rest as soon as Ive finished my assigned tasks around the house

[RobinC]

There are many variations and its also down to preferences and eyesight, but generaly the front size is a little smaller due to the hold being a lot steadier (hopefully!!) Depending on wether its out door which most is and light conditions there are more variables than indoor with air at 10 mts, also in smallbore there are barrel (or tube) length variations which also alter fore sight size.
As an indication, at 10 mts my wife uses 4.3 front sight on a max length sight base LG400 rifle and generaly 1.0 to 1.1 rear, at 50 mts and 100 yds smallbore a 3.7 front on a standard barrel length KK300 rifle and between 0.8 and 1.2 rear depending on light, at 300 mts with a standard length barrel Keppeler 6mmBR rifle she uses a similar set up. The rear iris is used and varied much more than indoors with air, also filters come much more into play than with air.
Using the same smallbore and 300 mt equipment mine is also the same sizes even though my eyesight is very different.
But, you or any one else may end up using a totaly different set just as successfully.
Have fun and good shooting,
Robin

[TheWilding]

There are many variations and its also down to preferences and eyesight, but generaly the front size is a little smaller due to the hold being a lot steadier (hopefully!!) Depending on wether its out door which most is and light conditions there are more variables than indoor with air at 10 mts, also in smallbore there are barrel (or tube) length variations which also alter fore sight size.
As an indication, at 10 mts my wife uses 4.3 front sight on a max length sight base LG400 rifle and generaly 1.0 to 1.1 rear, at 50 mts and 100 yds smallbore a 3.7 front on a standard barrel length KK300 rifle and between 0.8 and 1.2 rear depending on light, at 300 mts with a standard length barrel Keppeler 6mmBR rifle she uses a similar set up. The rear iris is used and varied much more than indoors with air, also filters come much more into play than with air.
Using the same smallbore and 300 mt equipment mine is also the same sizes even though my eyesight is very different.
But, you or any one else may end up using a totaly different set just as successfully.
Have fun and good shooting,
Robin

Robin,

I've read a good deal of your threads about your good self and your wives set-ups over on CAPA, can I ask if you or your wife have ever used a pointed post on the fore sight?


At the moment Im using the pointed post that came with my Diana-Original 24D as standard, a cheap diopter at the back as I'm only just starting, I find it helps me to stop canting the rifle, I worry that if I fit a O style fore sight I'll cant the rifle and not know it and causing inaccuracies...... what is your/wifes experiences of this?


Also you mention the sight distance apart, how far are you allowed to have them apart? I have thought about fitting an extension tube to move the fore sight forward, I'm just unsure as to what distance this is, it doesn't help that I have a fixed size diopter, believe its 1.1mm, and have yet to work out what sort of eye relief I like

you expert guidance wuld be most appreciated


Sean

[Nikkormat]

Thanks for the replies, chaps, just the information I was after.

Matt

[RobinC]

Sean
Posts pointed or square are a very old fashioned, and were more common when positional stability was generaly not so good as it is now with modern techniques. There are of course exceptions to every common practice and I know of one world level Olympic medalist and world record holder Raimond Debevec who uses a post fore sight but he is in a miority of one. You can get better definition and more precision using a ring and any advantage that a post can have in less percieved movement can be achieved with a bigger ring. That is the crux, particularly standing, is to keep it big enough. If you are wobbly use a big element, I think 5 mm is a good start for a beginner, when you are over 80 average go to a 4.5, over 90 go smaller, but its all relavent to the sight bas as well, the top people in the world are not a lot under 4.
Cant is no problem, any difference at 10 mt is minimal and most people can judge the degree of cant they use, my wife cants and so do most people I coach, it helps to get the rifle into your body and your head line upright.
The longer the sight base the more precise the aim and also you get the foresight further out improving comprimise focus for most people. With standing it can amplify the movement so longer sight bases are best left to the experts. The maximum action length rule (850 mm) for an air rifle dictates the maximum sight base, the sight must not extend beyond the apparant muzzle.
Technique is far more important than variations in equipment although with a model 27 you are quite limited, you will find a lifetimes difference in a modern match rifle, but your technique must still be good otherwise you will get no where.
Have fun and Good Shooting.
Robin

[tim s]

For smallbore prone I recommend somewhere between 3.6mm and 4.2mm. If pressed I'd say to start at 4.0mm and work from there. This is with an Anschutz 690mm barrel; you'd want to go slightly smaller with a shorter barrel such as the KK300 (650mm) that Robin and his wide shoot; Mrs Robin's 3.7mm could be say a 3.8/3.9 with a longer Anschutz barrel, Add an extension tube, and you'll need to go larger - 0.1mm per inch of tube is a start. I use a 4.8mm with a 6in tubve, and from memory 4.1mm without.

If you're shooting on outdoor ranges you may chose to vary the foresight aperture depending on the ambient light, to mainatin an optimal sight picture.

For NRA TR foresight size is complicated by target size; the same targets are used at several distances, whereas NSRA prone targets are proportional.

[TheWilding]

Cheers guys, very informative ...... Intershoot will be getting a call later tomorrow to confirm the sizes suggested are in stock



Sean