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Thread: Easyjet refuse Airrifle shooters for not having license...

  1. #61
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    I'm pleased to say this seems to have a positive resolution. Thanks to all the help and guidance of the BASC, and the AMTA, the EFTA has been able to get this statement from Easyjet.

    Unfortunately easyJet's carriage of firearms policy was applied incorrectly on this occasion and so we would like to apologise to the passengers affected.

    We do not ask for the production of a licence, we simply ask for the owners to be able to prove legal ownership. We are aware that air rifles do not require owners to hold a licence but will now relook at the wording of our policy to ensure this is clearer and this error does not occur again.

    We do ask for passengers to notify us in advance of travel which did not happen on this occasion and this is always preferable as any issues can be discussed before the flight.
    The EFTA has asked for more clarification on what constitutes "proof of ownership", to which we have been told we should have a reply within a week.

    #easyjet

  2. #62
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    Proof of ownership is going to be a problem if they decide that something in writing is required.
    I've always thought that a register run by ourselves on a public available website would go in the direction of proof of ownership. We don't have to wait for it to be made law, we could 'jump the gun'.
    When AMTA agreed to fit anti tamper to protect us shooters from the government bringing in swingeing legislation, it was done for our protection but unfortunately it had to be done quickly otherwise I am sure the industry would have spoken to the shooters on the various shooting websites in advance to get some feed back.
    There is nothing to stop someone sponsoring/provide financial backup to set up a straightforward online register run by shooters to keep a register of serial numbers - they could even have a photo attached of the owner. It's just a thought but if serious shooters wanted to I am sure it could be made to work. Hopefully by a young an enthusiastic group of people. Not an old git like me.
    I should add that this is not aimed at the 3 million or so air rifles currently in circulation. This is aimed at serious shooters who may need to supply proof of ownership.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by mostlyharmless View Post
    Proof of ownership is going to be a problem if they decide that something in writing is required.
    I've always thought that a register run by ourselves on a public available website would go in the direction of proof of ownership. We don't have to wait for it to be made law, we could 'jump the gun'.
    When AMTA agreed to fit anti tamper to protect us shooters from the government bringing in swingeing legislation, it was done for our protection but unfortunately it had to be done quickly otherwise I am sure the industry would have spoken to the shooters on the various shooting websites in advance to get some feed back.
    There is nothing to stop someone sponsoring/provide financial backup to set up a straightforward online register run by shooters to keep a register of serial numbers - they could even have a photo attached of the owner. It's just a thought but if serious shooters wanted to I am sure it could be made to work. Hopefully by a young an enthusiastic group of people. Not an old git like me.
    I should add that this is not aimed at the 3 million or so air rifles currently in circulation. This is aimed at serious shooters who may need to supply proof of ownership.
    We (the EFTA) have made a suggestion that the passenger writes a written statement that they are the full and legal owner. We are awaiting a response.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobF View Post
    We (the EFTA) have made a suggestion that the passenger writes a written statement that they are the full and legal owner. We are awaiting a response.
    I would strongly resist this unless the passenger can do this there and then via a ready made form that the carrier will provide.

    Ownership has F-A to do with it.

    Easyjet does not ask you to submit proof of ownership for the Rolex you may have on your wrist, or the laptop in your hand luggage, an air rifle is no different and ownership is irrelevant and of no concern to the airline insofar as the specific item is legitimately held, i.e. with no supporting paperwork legally required.

    Otherwise be prepared for some poor sod to be disappointed at the airport for simply being unaware of this requirement and not having prepared for it, despite having paid EJ for the carriage of said air rifle.

    Making such a suggestion brings to mind stones, drops, feet, ones.
    **WANTED**: WEBLEY PATRIOT MUZZLE END; Any Diana/Original mod.50 parts, especially OPEN SIGHTS

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by air-tech View Post
    I would strongly resist this unless the passenger can do this there and then via a ready made form that the carrier will provide.

    Ownership has F-A to do with it.

    Easyjet does not ask you to submit proof of ownership for the Rolex you may have on your wrist, or the laptop in your hand luggage, an air rifle is no different and ownership is irrelevant and of no concern to the airline insofar as the specific item is legitimately held, i.e. with no supporting paperwork legally required.

    Otherwise be prepared for some poor sod to be disappointed at the airport for simply being unaware of this requirement and not having prepared for it, despite having paid EJ for the carriage of said air rifle.

    Making such a suggestion brings to mind stones, drops, feet, ones.
    There is no legal requirement, but it's in their terms (which are quite clear if you look up Easyjet sporting firearms, which would be expected if you were thinking of travelling with them), so we've asked what they would accept, and a suggestion that could be easily complied with. Our (the EFTA) aim is to ensure that there's easy and clear travel for passengers with airguns with Easyjet.

  6. #66
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    Surely a signed receipt of purchase, quoting the serial number, would suffice?

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snagglepuss View Post
    Surely a signed receipt of purchase, quoting the serial number, would suffice?
    It should do for rifles bought new, but it wouldn't necessarily stand as proof for 2nd hand over and above anything else. We've raised this point and are awaiting a response, and have given Easyjet a reasonable amount of time to respond.

  8. #68
    peterd8877 is offline Anschutz connoisseur and marksman
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    Back to having all airguns on certificate and then no more problems. Works for us in N. I. The only people who should be complaining about this should be the police due to the extra work involved.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by peterd8877 View Post
    Back to having all airguns on certificate and then no more problems.
    To be replaced by a whole host of other problems, no thanks.

  10. #70
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    Most of you are too young but we used to have a radio licence, it was renewed at the Post Office. It gave permission to record.
    There were probably more of them than there are air rifle owners. There is no reason why it should be excessively expensive to run a licencing system.
    It does not necessarily need to be run by the Police. We could put up the TV licence and Road Tax to pay for it
    Don't forget that we have fishing licences as well.
    Last edited by mostlyharmless; 18-07-2014 at 04:34 PM.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobF View Post
    I'm pleased to say this seems to have a positive resolution. Thanks to all the help and guidance of the BASC, and the AMTA, the EFTA has been able to get this statement from Easyjet.



    The EFTA has asked for more clarification on what constitutes "proof of ownership", to which we have been told we should have a reply within a week.

    #easyjet
    I said in my response that you should speak to the compliance officer prior to travel and get a letter and or email from them confirming the companies policy and directing staff on procedure or to contact the compliance team if unsure. Their response said this was not done.

    I would suggest that maybe the airlines reaction may have been if this had been done.

    Maybe BASC and the other associations should get to know who the compliance people are within airlines and get them to disseminate the information the front line staff need to know and cannot be reasonably expected to know.

    My own experience was a senior customs officer explaining to a new member of staff that my rifle was clearly an air rifle because its got one of those (pointing to the moderator). So ignorance is rife and a central point of reference for an airline such as a well briefed compliance officer is not a bad thing IMHO.

    I gave him the benefit of my experience in understanding what an air rifle was.
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snagglepuss View Post
    Surely a signed receipt of purchase, quoting the serial number, would suffice?
    I bought mine 2nd hand. cash. no receipt.

    Ownership is irrelevant.

    I might borrow my mate FT rig to take as a spare if I am going on an international in case mine goes down.

    I might be taking a prototype out or it might be a team rifle and I might be going to a comp on my own not a team event.

    I think ownership is a total crock.

    A letter with the name and address with the serial number and a statement that it was manufactured as a UK legal limit air rifle is all that is needed.

    It is not a firearm such as a rifle which can ONLY be held by the FAC holder. unless you are RFD or have appropriate sectioned clearance to transport firearms to the class agreed.

    Ownership route is deeply flawed.
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by peterd8877 View Post
    Back to having all airguns on certificate and then no more problems. Works for us in N. I. The only people who should be complaining about this should be the police due to the extra work involved.
    Hmm and when they put up the application fee and renewal fee to cover the increase in man power needed........

    Sub 12 do not need a licence. they do not need proof of ownership either.

    This is a crock route to follow and just makes it harder. if you have a letter from the manufacturer stating its a sub 12 legal limit and it has the travellers name and address and serial number end of problem.

    Even that is not necessary is it.

    Don't get me wrong - I have a sub 12 and rim and centres but if my rifle went over then I am in absolute breach of the law and I have to rely on the decision of someone applying judgement which is no safe thing. I could end up with a caution(which you should NEVER accept) or have the equipment destroyed.

    I cant even put a sub 12 onmy FAC because then I cant compete in FT or HFT etc due to insurance even though it can be proven to be sub 12.

    I would prefer to have my air on my FAC because then I cant loose everything because of a few poxy FPE going a bit heavy. But then that carries onerous restrictions on storage over and above the somewhat vague and ill worded VCR amendment....

    buggered if you do stuffed if you dont
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian.Samson View Post
    To be replaced by a whole host of other problems, no thanks.
    Jeesus Bri...wish you would stop padding your answers out with intelligent counter arguments LOL

    Hope you are well buddy
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by mostlyharmless View Post
    Most of you are too young but we used to have a radio licence, it was renewed at the Post Office. It gave permission to record.
    There were probably more of them than there are air rifle owners. There is no reason why it should be excessively expensive to run a licencing system.
    It does not necessarily need to be run by the Police. We could put up the TV licence and Road Tax to pay for it
    Don't forget that we have fishing licences as well.
    Actually I think you may well find that both of those will cost more to run than they collect.
    In a battle of wits I refuse to engage with an unarmed person.
    To one shot one kill, you need to seek the S. Kill only comes from Skill

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