100s+ Pics for all LOVERS of 'BSA and Lincoln Jeffries Vintage air rifles.

[Mr. Scratch]

You know when you think "it's not really what i would normally buy" but look back over the 12 months plus of ownership and think...YES! i'm glad i did!
Some time ago a customer came into my shop and as you do, in general conversation, he mentioned an old BSA air rifle that he had completely refurbed and was looking to sell. Not what i would normally consider but appeasingly we agreed that i would have a look. A couple of weeks later he bought it in, opened the old pvc bag and took the rifle out. IT LOOKED NEW! Every screw had no signs of anyone even showing them a screwdriver, it had been totally re-blued, with a (sorry to say this purists) GOLD PLATED TRIGGER, other than that, everything looked original and in place. I must admit i was a bit shocked! The stock had been replaced with a 'hand made' walnut straight stock, lovely grain, "i didn't think the old stock did it justice, so i had a new one made" he said, but then got the old stock out of a seperate bag. To be honest for a 100+ year old didn't look too bad. So after asking several questions with several BSA guru's (some of which said "don't touch it, it's not original patina, it's been spoilt etc") I BOUGHT IT!
Now i know some may agree with the purists, and everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but, with g/p trigger, spare stock, and shoots ok as well, how could i not!
I'm chuffed to say the least. If i can fathom out how to put some piccys on here i will. Good luck with your search sir, i'm sure the right one is just around the corner! Atb

[chieffool]

You know when you think "it's not really what i would normally buy" but look back over the 12 months plus of ownership and think...YES! i'm glad i did!
Some time ago a customer came into my shop and as you do, in general conversation, he mentioned an old BSA air rifle that he had completely refurbed and was looking to sell. Not what i would normally consider but appeasingly we agreed that i would have a look. A couple of weeks later he bought it in, opened the old pvc bag and took the rifle out. IT LOOKED NEW! Every screw had no signs of anyone even showing them a screwdriver, it had been totally re-blued, with a (sorry to say this purists) GOLD PLATED TRIGGER, other than that, everything looked original and in place. I must admit i was a bit shocked! The stock had been replaced with a 'hand made' walnut straight stock, lovely grain, "i didn't think the old stock did it justice, so i had a new one made" he said, but then got the old stock out of a seperate bag. To be honest for a 100+ year old didn't look too bad. So after asking several questions with several BSA guru's (some of which said "don't touch it, it's not original patina, it's been spoilt etc") I BOUGHT IT!
Now i know some may agree with the purists, and everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but, with g/p trigger, spare stock, and shoots ok as well, how could i not!
I'm chuffed to say the least. If i can fathom out how to put some piccys on here i will. Good luck with your search sir, i'm sure the right one is just around the corner! Atb

oh yes.... pics please.
I believe (it appears) i am in final negotiations on a 'very original' and in good nick 1912 model D.

[chieffool]

would you buy a 'very original' Improved Model D (1912) in excellent condition with nothing to do to it (£270 - good compression)

OR

By a clinker in 'molested state' which needs everything done to it (but still shoots - ie mechanically sound) (£120) so you could do anything you wanted to it (reblue, gold trigger, engrave, rear flip up period peep sight, walnut stock, etc

?

PS: can't have both

PPS: what did the 'pimped' underlever Mr Scratch cost (are we allowed to know)?

[chieffool]

What is a reasonable chrono output for .177 and .22 for these ?
I know its a very general question - but i'd love to get some feedback on your own guns [year/model/calibre/ft lbs] to compare

[edbear2]

What is a reasonable chrono output for .177 and .22 for these ?
I know its a very general question - but i'd love to get some feedback on your own guns [year/model/calibre/ft lbs] to compare

Hi, depends on the length of gun, generally three lengths are commonly found ...Light / Ladies at around 39" long, only in .177 a good one will be around 600fps,

Standard length Lincoln's / B's / D's later 1919-39 C and S models. These can go up to 725 fps if fresh inside, again 99% are in .177

45" Guns...pre 1919 known as Sporting or at the end of production Standard model (.22 / .25) then again from 1919-39 as standard no2 (.22) or C.S. / Club Special / Club Standard (.177).

These long guns can be full power, with the earlier Sporting .22 normally making high 10's to full power and even slightly over (up to 600fps and beyond in .22!)

The 1919-39 45" .22 guns usually had a different piston / rod and these seem to top out at 560-70 I have found.

The 1919-39 45" .177 guns can go up to high 700's in fps.

I have omitted some rarer guns found, and been simplistic but the above is a basic guide. I have used FPS and these figures are using fairly light waisted pellets as would have been available originally.

Bear in mind these figures are for either little used, or rebuilt and run-in gins in good order, these guns are all getting older now, and although built to a very high standard originally, may have had generations of neglect and abuse, so always chrono/ test fire for accuracy any example you are intent on using to see how it shoots. They do vary and some which have had all sorts down the barrel may not be accurate.

ATB, Ed

[chieffool]

This is apparently described as a 1912, Improved model D, single hole Trigger block, serial: 27843.
It has the side catch on the underlever.

The gun dealer is the owner for last 25 years. His business is mainly a small gun restoration business and very kindly sent scan of relevant page from the John Knibbs books, showing:
"27530-28029 - manufactured sept 09/Jan 10 - despatched set 09/nov 11 - BSA Standard 0.177 & 0.22...."


Chrono results are from 7.5 gr:
1 shot 485
2 489
3 501
4 500
5 499
My calculation gives me 4.16 ft lbs

Even though this is a gun restoration biz, he resisted doing anything too it as very original.
Describes compression as very good. Mechanically all sound and complete.

I'm inclined to buy this as background for the gun seems so good.

BUT: want it to shoot well....
....so presumably SPRINGS are easy to source (as compression seems to indicate the seal and air chamber are in good condition)?

[chieffool]

...didn't realise until now that the spring system is 'double springs'...
If i am replacing - do i source 2 x springs -or is there an alternative 1 x spring that is 'better'?

[OR: is there a very good reason it should be TWO springs - ie mechanical design?]

[Josie & John]

[QUOTE=chieffool;6597133]would you buy a 'very original' Improved Model D (1912) in excellent condition with nothing to do to it (£270 - good compression)

OR

By a clinker in 'molested state' which needs everything done to it (but still shoots - ie mechanically sound) (£120) so you could do anything you wanted to it (reblue, gold trigger, engrave, rear flip up period peep sight, walnut stock, etc

?

Always go for original condition. Think of it like this. A good rifle with original parts in fine condition will retain and hopefully increase in value, whereas you are unlikely to ever get back the price of a refinish, unless you have the facility to do it yourself. Factor in the price of replacement parts and the price of a restoration increases way past its value. It will only ever be a refinished gun rather than an original item.

John

[Mr. Scratch]

To answer this question honestly i must say neither. I wasn't looking for one of these (model a 5th batch) dating about 1906 but it totally took me over, how can i explain? It's just so different. How many 100+ year olds look new, have g/p trigger, spare beautiful stock, someone had obviously spent a lot of time and money! Walnut stock alone i'd expect to pay £200ish min. Just so quirky. I had the chance to have any one of a late friends l/j bsa but turned it down! Just not my thing, but this is different. All other rifles are excellent power wise (10-11.5 flbs) some really nice ones and all do the job i ask of them, but this old one doesn't have to. Must be an age related respect thing!
Anyway powerwise, just under 8ftlbs. I CAN LIVE WITH THAT! especially as it has original internals as far as i can see. Still can't do this photo thing, can anyone help as i would like to get other members opinions. Regards Tony