hw90 mods/tune/lubes

[slugger]

in 177 the evo is harder than the 90 to cock.... it may well be that in other calibres its the other way around ?

[maximus]

I have a Sirroco 2000 in .22 thats fairly easy and a fenman in .177, thats, er not. My mate had a 10" barreled .177 EVO which wasnt that difficult as I recall, I had a .22 at the same time and there wasn't much in it. They reckon that .25 needs as much "spring" as a .177 so maybe thats why my .25 90 takes some effort. Either way, not a deal breaker for the 90 or an EVO though.

[slugger]

might be heading up the range shortly.... expect smiley faces of delight or sturn looks of derision upon my return

[slugger]

just got back... gave the missus her 77k birthday pressy early [as rain predicted for tomorrow] so she had a sesh with that. she loves it, and is putting up some half decent groups already
as for the 90.
just as accurate as the evo........ but more effort required, a consistent hold is required to get the best out of it! but... when i found myself in the 'zone' for a spell it was putting in inch groups at 50 yds rested with mild breeze which is about average for me outdoors at that range. so its up there with a prosport/tx200/97k/98/evo/lgv in terms of capable-group-sizes..
im happy with it, its got bags of character and is very consistent over the chrono....... one thing i did notice is the barrel is a little larger than most of my guns........ my usual jsb4.51's grouped well, but almost fell int the lead-in area of the breech........
i therefore tried some hw field/dome things [cant remember the name] which were a proper snug fit........groups a little larger than the jsb's but a big change in poi enough to need a re-zero........ same story for the h&n ftt i tried after........ again a better fit [the best actually, not too tight, not too loose] but these changed the poi a little [not much after the zero to the hw's] but a fair bit different to the jsb's.
i think the perfect scenario is going to be jsb's in 4.53 flavour possible........ will have to get some to try
the idea of getting the 90 was to see if i liked it....... and if so , sell the evo........if not keep the evo and sell on the 90. but im struggling a little here, they both have their merrits, and i dont need 2 rammers......
i think i shall go ahead and sell the evo purely on the basis that ive had it a fair while now, [change is as good as a rest etc] and concentrate on improving my groups with the 90
overall [if anyone is reading this hoping for a clear winner in the top-end-rammer chatagory] im afraid its too close to call........ no really........ i love the looks of the evo, but love the trigger of the 90. i love the lightweight evo for its ability to be a good hunting rig........ but i love the extra weight of the 90 for helping calm the recoil........ i love the super fast locktime of the evo....... but i love the fact the 90 is a little easyer to cock........
they are both as accurate as each other. they are both built extremely well........ the lockup is perfect with both [no noticable vertical poi shift on either that can happen on some break-barrels at longer ranges]. you see it really is [in my eyes at least] 50-50 .

ps....... the 80 yard small coke bottle filled with baking soda, a splash of washing up liquid and the rest water didnt do anything very exciting when i nailed it, just a slight lazy fizz maybe i forgot something, citrous? dash of lemon juice. i cant remember the original 80's ingrediants now lol

[DCL_dave]

just got back... gave the missus her 77k birthday pressy early [as rain predicted for tomorrow] so she had a sesh with that. she loves it, and is putting up some half decent groups already
as for the 90.
just as accurate as the evo........ but more effort required, a consistent hold is required to get the best out of it! but... when i found myself in the 'zone' for a spell it was putting in inch groups at 50 yds rested with mild breeze which is about average for me outdoors at that range. so its up there with a prosport/tx200/97k/98/evo/lgv in terms of capable-group-sizes..
im happy with it, its got bags of character and is very consistent over the chrono....... one thing i did notice is the barrel is a little larger than most of my guns........ my usual jsb4.51's grouped well, but almost fell int the lead-in area of the breech........
i therefore tried some hw field/dome things [cant remember the name] which were a proper snug fit........groups a little larger than the jsb's but a big change in poi enough to need a re-zero........ same story for the h&n ftt i tried after........ again a better fit [the best actually, not too tight, not too loose] but these changed the poi a little [not much after the zero to the hw's] but a fair bit different to the jsb's.
i think the perfect scenario is going to be jsb's in 4.53 flavour possible........ will have to get some to try
the idea of getting the 90 was to see if i liked it....... and if so , sell the evo........if not keep the evo and sell on the 90. but im struggling a little here, they both have their merrits, and i dont need 2 rammers......
i think i shall go ahead and sell the evo purely on the basis that ive had it a fair while now, [change is as good as a rest etc] and concentrate on improving my groups with the 90
overall [if anyone is reading this hoping for a clear winner in the top-end-rammer chatagory] im afraid its too close to call........ no really........ i love the looks of the evo, but love the trigger of the 90. i love the lightweight evo for its ability to be a good hunting rig........ but i love the extra weight of the 90 for helping calm the recoil........ i love the super fast locktime of the evo....... but i love the fact the 90 is a little easyer to cock........
they are both as accurate as each other. they are both built extremely well........ the lockup is perfect with both [no noticable vertical poi shift on either that can happen on some break-barrels at longer ranges]. you see it really is [in my eyes at least] 50-50 .

ps....... the 80 yard small coke bottle filled with baking soda, a splash of washing up liquid and the rest water didnt do anything very exciting when i nailed it, just a slight lazy fizz maybe i forgot something, citrous? dash of lemon juice. i cant remember the original 80's ingrediants now lol

Cool, glad the 90 is living up to your expectations

BTW, if you want to tame your 90s recoil still further?...remove the inertia weight and chuck a heavy 98 barrel on it...

[slugger]

seems there are 3 options i need to explore re the innertia weight.
option 1 / stock, weight with hole through
option 2 / block the hole so it has compressed air behind it [ala evo]
option 3 / remove altogether
what we need is some clever sciencey blokey to work out which option should give least recoil

[RFCII]

The HW90 / RX-2 is my favorite "springer." I have two (.22 and .177) and an Evo (.177). Even though you can hop them up to 23+ fpe, I have found that the accuracy tightens up dramatically at the 17-18 fpe. The .22 now wears a HW98 barrel, which has brought accuracy up to benchrest quality (for springers). I'm going to do the same to the .177. The Evo is also a great little rifle. With its substantially shorter barrel, it is harder to cock than the RX-2.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...ps6f4kltvi.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...ps2c3e8264.jpg

[maximus]

Here's a few pics of my 90TB as requested by Joffy

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...pspypr4bwl.jpg

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...psysq3czw7.jpg

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...psa32qk4cm.jpg

Cheers

Max

[joffy]

Here's a few pics of my 90TB as requested by Joffy

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...pspypr4bwl.jpg

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...psysq3czw7.jpg

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/a...psa32qk4cm.jpg

Cheers

Max

Thanks max i feel another project coming on

[peddy]

I've just purchased a 90 from a nice chap on here. Itching to strip it down when it arrives so on reading this post what is the purpose of the inertia weight? Looking online it has two O rings attached. Also what do I need to regas it after assembly, I've two 300bar bottles. Also can I use pelgun oil on the seals, never owned one of these before.
Thanks
peter

[slugger]

be VERY VERY carefull if filling with a bottle... it only needs like 300 psi.
the innertia weight is to help combat recoil some.. the jury is out on wether or not it helps or hinders.... my personal oppinion is , if its stuck [crudded up and not moving] then yes its going to be added piston weight and will increase recoil.......
however, if freshly cleaned and lubed properly im thinking it will help reduce bounce/surge and thus reduce felt recoil, i shall of course be experimenting with this very thing next week [with weight / without and with weight but hole blocked.
as for lube, i covered all the o-rings with rubber grease upon insertion........ and then poured about 1 teaspoon of gearbox/diff addative.. this is a super slippy liquid of fairly thin viscosity...... it will ensure theres no way the innertia weight will ever "get stuck" and keep the rear-ram-shaft constantly lubed to reduce friction

[peddy]

be VERY VERY carefull if filling with a bottle... it only needs like 300 psi.
the innertia weight is to help combat recoil some.. the jury is out on wether or not it helps or hinders.... my personal oppinion is , if its stuck [crudded up and not moving] then yes its going to be added piston weight and will increase recoil.......
however, if freshly cleaned and lubed properly im thinking it will help reduce bounce/surge and thus reduce felt recoil, i shall of course be experimenting with this very thing next week [with weight / without and with weight but hole blocked.
as for lube, i covered all the o-rings with rubber grease upon insertion........ and then poured about 1 teaspoon of gearbox/diff addative.. this is a super slippy liquid of fairly thin viscosity...... it will ensure theres no way the innertia weight will ever "get stuck" and keep the rear-ram-shaft constantly lubed to reduce friction

Think a bottle would be risky when only 20 bar to fill. Will try my dealer nearer the time. Will you keep us updated on the inertia as to whether to leave it out all together. Having mine reblued so will be a while before I'm ready for assembly.

[DCL_dave]

I've just purchased a 90 from a nice chap on here. Itching to strip it down when it arrives so on reading this post what is the purpose of the inertia weight? Looking online it has two O rings attached. Also what do I need to regas it after assembly, I've two 300bar bottles. Also can I use pelgun oil on the seals, never owned one of these before.
Thanks
peter

Hi Peter,

Inertia weight does as slugger says (if it's working ) ..and I just used a smidge of 10/40 engine oil in the ram...

Here's a pic of the HW90 innards.

Here's a stripdown guide.

You'll need an adaptor to fit the schrader valve thread in the end of the cyinder to charge it from bottle or pump (pump is better as it's slower and easier to control at low pressures involved)

[slugger]

yeh, when i get time i want to build a hammock to suspend the gun from , nothing fancy just suspended from strings front and rear hanging a metre or so from the cieling. then take afew shots and measure the swing distance....... that kinda thing

[slugger]

update.......
tried it without the innertia weight, shot cycle 'feels' the same........ but........noticibly more muzzle flip
im beggining to thing the weight isnt just to calm recoil/surge........ but to be a 'weight' that is moving to help counter flip........ i guess the momentum has a singular-direction gyro effect to some degree........who knows, but what i did experiment with was the friction of the innertia weights movement........the long and the short of it is i have re-sized the outer edge of both o-rings a little, this is now allowing the weight to be pushed and pulled much easyer......i have also ported both entrances of the central hole........ this is afterall a kind of transfer port now then... i didnt want it moving under its own weight [this would then give varying degreed of friction/movement at different angles of elevation [shooting uphill, versus downhill for example] but wanted it free-er to move more within the piston upon firing..... this does seem to help dampen recoil/muzzle-flip even more........
this was by no means a scientific test, this was just shooting into a backstop with the rifle balanced on a bean rest and observing rearward movement and flip movement........
i dare say you could get very mathematical and alter the inneria-weights overall weight........ work out the best hole size [like a TP] and engineer-in a precise friction of movement....... thats for someone much cleverer than myself
personally i have gone as far as i want/need to........ at present it has a very fast locktime, and recoil is mostly on the horizontal plain [no noticable muzzle flip] ....... whats more its ridiculously consistent fps wise....... like better than any springer ive tested so im happy ....... all i need to do now is find a lovely stock for it