Another lubed wad question (sorry)

[Renegade Master]

Hi Guys,

Having sent my FAC off for variation and putting down a deposit on an Uberti NMA my attention has now turned to the plethora of "other bits" I also need to start getting.

With this in mind I have over the past couple of days been combing all the threads in this section (60 odd pages worth!) and a lot of the threads relate to lubed wads. Now I like the idea of using a lubed wad in terms of ease of use and benefits to fouling, and I already have many of the ingredients to make the lube (paraffin wax, beeswax, Trex, etc).

However, one thing I haven't seen asked is, is there any chance of contaminating the powder with the lube? I'm really thinking in the warmer weather when there is possibly the chance the lube may soften to the point it becomes semi-liquid again.

This may be a very stupid question, but as a newbie I thought it best to ask.

Cheers,

Dan

[enfield2band]

Hi Guys,

Having sent my FAC off for variation and putting down a deposit on an Uberti NMA my attention has now turned to the plethora of "other bits" I also need to start getting.

With this in mind I have over the past couple of days been combing all the threads in this section (60 odd pages worth!) and a lot of the threads relate to lubed wads. Now I like the idea of using a lubed wad in terms of ease of use and benefits to fouling, and I already have many of the ingredients to make the lube (paraffin wax, beeswax, Trex, etc).

However, one thing I haven't seen asked is, is there any chance of contaminating the powder with the lube? I'm really thinking in the warmer weather when there is possibly the chance the lube may soften to the point it becomes semi-liquid again.

This may be a very stupid question, but as a newbie I thought it best to ask.

Cheers,

Dan

Hi,

Don't apologise for asking a question. The whole point of this forum is about sharing information and helping each other when we can.

You have a valid point about the lube affecting the powder in hot weather. In winter I use more tallow on my patches because the cold makes the beeswax harden. In Summer the tallow melts easily so I increase the amount of beeswax. The same would appliy to lubed wads.

In winter I use 5 parts tallow to 1 part beeswax. In summer I use 3 parts tallow to 1 part beeswax. If you use that as a guide you should not be far out,but experiment and see what suits you the best. I sometimes vary the tallow/beeswax ratio if I think I need to.

Atb

[Renegade Master]

Fantastic, thanks for that. So by varying the ratios I can adjust for temperature. Good information, cheers.

[tacfoley]

I can see the appeal of making wads, given the ridiculous price of the Wonder Wads here in yUK, but just to say that in almost fifty years of shooting BP revolvers, I've never used them at all - just as the originals didn't either.

The only wads I use are in BP rifles.

tac

[Renegade Master]

Hey Tac,

So out of interest, how do you lube? I think I read one of your posts where you said you use E45 cream, so is that over the ball, or between ball & filler?

Cheers,

Dan

[tacfoley]

Hey Tac,

So out of interest, how do you lube? I think I read one of your posts where you said you use E45 cream, so is that over the ball, or between ball & filler?

Cheers,

Dan

The last time I load, I fill the end of the chamber with E45, and it clears out most of the crud from previous shots. As it is water soluble, it disappears in the clean up, taking most of the crud with it. In what passes for colder weather here - around 5 degrees of 0, I use it on my .58cal muzzleloading carbine, just smeared around the grooves.

It's not a good idea to use any form of lube between the powder and the ball, or filler, and I don't use any kind of filler either.

Hope that helps.

tac

[Renegade Master]

Hi Tac,

Yes that's very useful information, thanks. Can I ask what your take of the use of wads in ML revolvers is?

Dan

[tacfoley]

Hi Tac,

Yes that's very useful information, thanks. Can I ask what your take of the use of wads in ML revolvers is?

Dan

I don't use them, and never have. Read the instructions inside the Colt's revolving pistol case.

tac

[Turnup]

Hi Tac,

Yes that's very useful information, thanks. Can I ask what your take of the use of wads in ML revolvers is?

Dan

Jumping in on the thread - FWIW I think that a wad is useless in a revolver, with one exception:


many indoor ranges prohibit BP and lube. This is because there are H&S issues unless the range can be, and is, washed down after each use. So I would prefer to use a wad when using BP sub and no lube on the rare occasion I shoot M/L indoors - it helps to keep the crud down. I would much prefer to use BP on an outdoor range as I find BP subs inferior to BP in almost every respect.

[tacfoley]

Jumping in on the thread - FWIW I think that a wad is useless in a revolver, with one exception:


many indoor ranges prohibit BP and lube. This is because there are H&S issues unless the range can be, and is, washed down after each use. So I would prefer to use a wad when using BP sub and no lube on the rare occasion I shoot M/L indoors - it helps to keep the crud down. I would much prefer to use BP on an outdoor range as I find BP subs inferior to BP in almost every respect.

I really don't know what to say to this, so I'll keep my gob shut. All I'll note is that if you don't use wads, 'washing a range down' is not necessary. IMO nor is lube, lead being self-lubricating in a steel tube.

tac

[Turnup]

I really don't know what to say to this, so I'll keep my gob shut. All I'll note is that if you don't use wads, 'washing a range down' is not necessary. IMO nor is lube, lead being self-lubricating in a steel tube.

tac

The wash down is to remove/neutralise unburnt BP and the grease which gets everywhere. H&S allege that both will accumulate to become a fire hazard. I am a little dubious on this but if you are responsible for the running of a range any organisation is open to grief if they don't follow best advice, so there it is. Not deemed necessary for indoor ranges using only nitro powders, but following an accident where a vacuum cleaner (gently) exploded from accumulated unburnt nitro, the H&S advice is to use vacuum cleaners which are designed to work with combustible powders - Dyson and Henry being examples. We live in a risk averse culture.

WRT lead being self lubricating in steel, I wonder why pretty much every lead bullet has lubrication cannelures, even those designed for use with BP, most commercially available bullets are ready lubed, and I have never seen commercial lead ammunition with unlubed bullets (it may exist, but it is exceedingly rare)? Personal experience is that un-lubed lead will leave lead deposits inside the bore, and lube reduces it muchly. Not much experience with jacketed bullets so no comment on that front.

[Renegade Master]

Many thanks for all the replies.

I guess I will have to try with/without wads and lubed/unlubed to see what gives me the best result on the target.

[tacfoley]

The wash down is to remove/neutralise unburnt BP and the grease which gets everywhere. H&S allege that both will accumulate to become a fire hazard. I am a little dubious on this but if you are responsible for the running of a range any organisation is open to grief if they don't follow best advice, so there it is. Not deemed necessary for indoor ranges using only nitro powders, but following an accident where a vacuum cleaner (gently) exploded from accumulated unburnt nitro, the H&S advice is to use vacuum cleaners which are designed to work with combustible powders - Dyson and Henry being examples. We live in a risk averse culture.

WRT lead being self lubricating in steel, I wonder why pretty much every lead bullet has lubrication cannelures, even those designed for use with BP, most commercially available bullets are ready lubed, and I have never seen commercial lead ammunition with unlubed bullets (it may exist, but it is exceedingly rare)? Personal experience is that un-lubed lead will leave lead deposits inside the bore, and lube reduces it muchly. Not much experience with jacketed bullets so no comment on that front.

I'm not too bright these days, old age and infirmity having taken a toll of my sensibilities, such as they were. But I find it very strange to think of people on their hands and knees,scrubbing the floor of a gun range.

Luckily, I spend a great proportion of my time not living here, where such embarrassments are inflicted on law-abiding citizens at the behest of a bunch of nannies in grey suits.

I personally would have paid money to have seen the exploding vacuum cleaner. However, I'm guessing that this was a one-time event, rather than an every-night conclusion to an otherwise relatively safe evening of shooting. Nothing like setting a prohibition after a single, one-off incident. However, I'm cheered up immensely by the mental image of your fellow gun club members on their hands and knees scrubbing away at the floor of your range.

Good luck with that, and don't forget to wear gloves, right? We don't want chapped 'housewife handies', do we?

Apropos your last point, you might care to take a break from spreading the contents of a bucket over your floor, and examine any lead ball for canelures. I have yet to see ANY pre-lubed ball on sale here, or anywhere else. But, like most other folks of a similar mindset, I'm not here just to pass on the good news, but also to learn from the better-informed. I've only been shooting unlubed ball from BP revolvers since the middle 1960's, as detailed by Messrs Colt, Remington and others, so I would expect my revolvers from that time to have a bore that would barely permit a sewing needle to pass down it. Needless to say, this is not the case.

tac

[Turnup]

I'm not too bright these days, old age and infirmity having taken a toll of my sensibilities, such as they were. But I find it very strange to think of people on their hands and knees,scrubbing the floor of a gun range.

Luckily, I spend a great proportion of my time not living here, where such embarrassments are inflicted on law-abiding citizens at the behest of a bunch of nannies in grey suits.

I personally would have paid money to have seen the exploding vacuum cleaner. However, I'm guessing that this was a one-time event, rather than an every-night conclusion to an otherwise relatively safe evening of shooting. Nothing like setting a prohibition after a single, one-off incident. However, I'm cheered up immensely by the mental image of your fellow gun club members on their hands and knees scrubbing away at the floor of your range.

Good luck with that, and don't forget to wear gloves, right? We don't want chapped 'housewife handies', do we?

Apropos your last point, you might care to take a break from spreading the contents of a bucket over your floor, and examine any lead ball for canelures. I have yet to see ANY pre-lubed ball on sale here, or anywhere else. But, like most other folks of a similar mindset, I'm not here just to pass on the good news, but also to learn from the better-informed. I've only been shooting unlubed ball from BP revolvers since the middle 1960's, as detailed by Messrs Colt, Remington and others, so I would expect my revolvers from that time to have a bore that would barely permit a sewing needle to pass down it. Needless to say, this is not the case.

tac

Me too. I understand that you originate in one of the former colonies, but over here we have a variety of mechanical cleaning aids available, not least the pressure washer.

I agree

Pretty common here and elsewhere where politicians get involved. Not a prohibition though, "advice", which an organisation would disregard at the peril of an infestation of lawyers - something we seem to have imported from on of the ex-colonies.

We do not do that - in fact I don't know anyone who does that - hence the prohibition of BP and lube on our range. I find you careful misunderstanding of my posts and deliberate baiting offensive.

It is truly amazing that the best minds of the day managed to get it exactly correct, incapable of any improvement, right from the outset. I thought that much of civilisation was about learning from the past and making improvements. I stand corrected. These fangled "cartridge" thingies will never catch on.

Plain silly and you know it. The cannelures on bullets are for decorative purposes?

You don't clean them?

[tacfoley]

Me too. I understand that you originate in one of the former colonies, but over here we have a variety of mechanical cleaning aids available, not least the pressure washer.

I agree

Pretty common here and elsewhere where politicians get involved. Not a prohibition though, "advice", which an organisation would disregard at the peril of an infestation of lawyers - something we seem to have imported from on of the ex-colonies.

We do not do that - in fact I don't know anyone who does that - hence the prohibition of BP and lube on our range. I find you careful misunderstanding of my posts and deliberate baiting offensive.

It is truly amazing that the best minds of the day managed to get it exactly correct, incapable of any improvement, right from the outset. I thought that much of civilisation was about learning from the past and making improvements. I stand corrected. These fangled "cartridge" thingies will never catch on.

Plain silly and you know it. The cannelures on bullets are for decorative purposes?

You don't clean them?

Well, Sir, I'd like to say that I'm truly sorry for my 'careful misunderstanding' of your posts. But that would be a lie.

I'd also like to apologise for causing you offence by my 'deliberate baiting', but I'd be lying there, again.

I just find the whole thing so deadly serious and mind-numbingly affronting to common-sense that I just have to try and make a little jest out of the whole deal, and with that in mind, my advice to you is to lighten somewhat, and find something real to get offended over, not an old man's attempts to cheer up a dark evening in a lonely land.

tac