Missing the pan! 😞

[Jamie]

My flintlock has been getting more and more unreliable of late, turns out the case hardening on the frizzen had worn so the sparks weren't particularly sparky. I've sorted that now, but in the course of fiddling with it I've discovered that the sparks are often missing the pan! They land too far forward and end up under the tail of he frizzen! Any ideas what can be done to remedy this?

It's a Navy Arms Harpers ferry 1803.

TIA, Jamie

[Turnup]

Far from expert here, but some thoughts offered in deference to those more knowledgeable who will be along later.

At first thought it would seem to be a defect in the lock geometry - not much you can do about that and anyway seems unlikely .....

Second thought - does it make a difference which way round the flint is fitted (chamfer up or chamfer down). I've seen both orientations used and I'm thinking this will change the interception angle and might change the trajectory of the sparks?

Third thought - setting the flint a little lower or higher will alter the point at which it strikes the frizzen and would slightly change the timing of the lock, which might change where the sparks end up ?

Fourth thought - was the frizzen simply re-hardened or was the face first built up to compensate for wear (which would of course affect the lock geometry) ?

By the time you have tried all these the frizzen will need re-facing again.....

[Jamie]

I have tried the flint tother way up and I get fewer sparks which still miss!

Flint height may be something to play with - presumably a thin spacer in the jaws is the way to adjust that?

I didn't build the Frizzen face up - could be a factor, though I only polished it as much as I had to to remove the gouges. I would think it would have to have lost a lot of steel to put the sparks as far away as they are

Thankyou for the reply

[tacfoley]

I have tried the flint tother way up and I get fewer sparks which still miss!

Flint height may be something to play with - presumably a thin spacer in the jaws is the way to adjust that?

I didn't build the Frizzen face up - could be a factor, though I only polished it as much as I had to to remove the gouges. I would think it would have to have lost a lot of steel to put the sparks as far away as they are

Thankyou for the reply

I'm betting that Mr Turnup has hit it right. Sounds like you've lost a good deal of the hardened surface of the frizzen, remember that polishing = removal of material and if you could polish it away then it's way too soft to effectively spark. How do you hold the flint in the jaws? Do you use a leather or lead wrap?

tac

[loiner1965]

I'm betting that Mr Turnup has hit it right. Sounds like you've lost a good deal of the hardened surface of the frizzen, remember that polishing = removal of material and if you could polish it away then it's way too soft to effectively spark. How do you hold the flint in the jaws? Do you use a leather or lead wrap?

tac

most bp people will use a hardened hack saw blade and silver solder it on to the face of the frizzen

[Jamie]

I'm betting that Mr Turnup has hit it right. Sounds like you've lost a good deal of the hardened surface of the frizzen, remember that polishing = removal of material and if you could polish it away then it's way too soft to effectively spark. How do you hold the flint in the jaws? Do you use a leather or lead wrap?


tac

thanks Tac, it is now sparking, I case hardened it after I polished to remove the gouges, it's just that the sparks are missing the pan! Flint is held in leather.

Loiner - I did think about that and may yet go down that route but I'd rather not if I don't have to.

Thanks gents

[Turnup]

I have tried the flint tother way up and I get fewer sparks which still miss!

Flint height may be something to play with - presumably a thin spacer in the jaws is the way to adjust that?

I didn't build the Frizzen face up - could be a factor, though I only polished it as much as I had to to remove the gouges. I would think it would have to have lost a lot of steel to put the sparks as far away as they are

Thankyou for the reply

WRT flint position, I was thinking about the distance by which the working edge of the flint projects from the jaws, which would affect how high/low it first strikes the frizzen, but spacing the lower side (nearest the cock pivot) might also be beneficial to restore the original relationship between the flint and the face of the frizzen.

More I think about it the more I favour the issue as loss of material from the frizzen face. This moves the face further forwards in the lock, and your sparks are arriving further forwards in the pan........

[Jamie]

Thanks for all the suggestions. Apparently the NA 1803's were known for poor lock geometry, so I've been playing with spacers to alter the angle of the flint. I seem to have made some progress but have now used up all my flints

I've ordered some more from Kranks, will report back when they arrive!

Thanks again, Jamie

[Jamie]

Well, I wore out the case hardening on the frizzen with all my playing about!

Cut a piece of saw blade, bent it to shape and hardened it, and she now sparks like a goodun, and they go where they're needed !
Hopefully will annoy some squirrels this week!
Thanks very much for all the help!

[Turnup]

Well, I wore out the case hardening on the frizzen with all my playing about!

Cut a piece of saw blade, bent it to shape and hardened it, and she now sparks like a goodun, and they go where they're needed !
Hopefully will annoy some squirrels this week!
Thanks very much for all the help!

Glad it's back in fettle - I am sure you would rather shoot the thing than tinker with it.

It's always nice when people report back on a thread with the outcome - we all learn a bit that way.

It would appear that the mere thickness of a saw blade has a significant effect on where the sparks end up. Interesting and something to remember.

[Jamie]

Yeah, I'm surprised how much difference it made to where the sparks are landing. It's a wood saw blade rather than a hacksaw, but still not thick by any stretch of the imagination