12 foot pound Law Who's fault is it???

[Clanchief]

The mother didn't like B, and when B had a row with her daughter, the mother called the police and said that it was a domestic incident and B had a gun. Nice lady.

The firearms unit duly arrived and took away the Logun, which went to a lab for testing. The report said 12.4 ft.lb. D can't have his rifle back as he has no ticket

Row at home with a female = domestic incident x next door neighbour or relative calling it in = police attendance & any item of threat removed.
Collusion, event and liberal editing of details back to club for assistance priceless.

[lensman57]

Lensman wrote - 'I am sure that the gentry and the rich will still be able to keep their guns but the ordinary public .!'

Are you a communist? Or do you simply have a very low opinion of the British legal system?

The law applies to everybody equally, rich and poor.

tac

Neither. Precdence tells us more than we would like to. Look at what they have done in Scotland. Licence for anything over one Joule and then you would have to prove that you either belong to an approved gun club or have shooting rights over land. These two would preclude most of the English users of Air Rifle.
The ones in the country will always justify it with the usual reasons. The problem I see is that they start to take a yard when an inch is given.
I hope that it never happens.

A.G

[lensman57]

OK, another club anecdote. This time the member's name is D. D had a Logun and he loaned it to his brother who we'll call B. B was "in a relationship" with a young lady and he lived at the young lady's house, along with her mother.

The mother didn't like B, and when B had a row with her daughter, the mother called the police and said that it was a domestic incident and B had a gun. Nice lady.

The firearms unit duly arrived and took away the Logun, which went to a lab for testing. The report said 12.4 ft.lb. D can't have his rifle back as he has no ticket.

We (the club) managed to convince the police that D was not the sort of chap to want to increase the power of his rifle and they agreed that it would not be destroyed but could go back to Logun via the dealer who sold it, to be turned down comfortably below 12 ft.lb.

And that is what happened. In the end D lost all faith in the Logun and the dealer took it back in part exchange once Logun had fixed it.

So, you don't have to be doing something naughty to get your gun seized. Ill-advised perhaps, to lend your gun to your brother, when he lives in somebody else's house.

I am not going to get into the same argument as I did last year in a similar debate. But I feel that you have demonstrated it very well as to what might happen.

A.G

[lensman57]

how many here have been checked. and what happend to bring about having your gun taken from you and checked? and why not get everybody that shoots and get the limit changed??? how hard would it be to start treating shooters with respect? why not just make it if you want to drive a car. take a class about gun safety then take 2 test 1 paper test and 1 marksmen. i am sure the teachers can weed out 95% of the nutcases and you can go get it renewed every 5 years. or is it they only want to trust you driving a car that can kill so as to get to work and pay the taxes they so covet?

You just have to read through the sarcasm of some of the posts above to see that we do not respect ourselves so don't be alarmed to find out that the none shooting community won't either.
Last year all I suggested that we should push to have a standard Diablo pellet of a certain weight as the standard with which the gun's power should be set. what would be the worst case senario if a PCP set to produce 11.9 ft.lbs was then used with a heavy pellet? The gun will go up to 12.5 ft.lbs , not exactly a weapon of mass murder is it? What do you think the response was?

A.G

[Jerry Cornelius]

OK, another club anecdote. This time the member's name is D. D had a Logun and he loaned it to his brother who we'll call B. B was "in a relationship" with a young lady and he lived at the young lady's house, along with her mother.

The mother didn't like B, and when B had a row with her daughter, the mother called the police and said that it was a domestic incident and B had a gun. Nice lady.

The firearms unit duly arrived and took away the Logun, which went to a lab for testing. The report said 12.4 ft.lb. D can't have his rifle back as he has no ticket.

We (the club) managed to convince the police that D was not the sort of chap to want to increase the power of his rifle and they agreed that it would not be destroyed but could go back to Logun via the dealer who sold it, to be turned down comfortably below 12 ft.lb.

And that is what happened. In the end D lost all faith in the Logun and the dealer took it back in part exchange once Logun had fixed it.

So, you don't have to be doing something naughty to get your gun seized. Ill-advised perhaps, to lend your gun to your brother, when he lives in somebody else's house.

Has to be said though that once again Plod seems to have taken a perfectly sensible approach.

[bighit]

Neither. Precdence tells us more than we would like to. Look at what they have done in Scotland. Licence for anything over one Joule and then you would have to prove that you either belong to an approved gun club or have shooting rights over land. These two would preclude most of the English users of Air Rifle.
The ones in the country will always justify it with the usual reasons. The problem I see is that they start to take a yard when an inch is given.
I hope that it never happens.

A.G

You forgot collectors

[lensman57]

You forgot collectors

I do apologise, it is the old age and the painkillers .

A.G

[svendogg]

If anyone who genuinely cares about our sport wants to know what AT is about, please get in touch and we can have a proper conversation.

All the best.

Why not explain to us all Terry? I for one would be interested to know, surely educating a group is better than educating an individual?

[maxtich]

Why not explain to us all Terry? I for one would be interested to know, surely educating a group is better than educating an individual?

Took the words right out of my mind,Why all this cloak and dagger!!

[BTDT]

Why not explain to us all Terry? I for one would be interested to know, surely educating a group is better than educating an individual?

If you take up Terry's offer, you will also have the answer to the above question.

Back to the OP. The person responsible was the idiot who, annoyed by the noise from a construction project, decided to shoot at the plant and vehicles. He was caught, the air rifle in question (an American pump-up rifle capable of considerably more than 12 ft. lb.) identified and, due to the damage it had created, the Police, press and politicians decided 'something had to be done'. That something was a Statutory Instrument by James Callaghan declaring airguns capable of producing in excess of 12 ft. lb. being 'especially dangerous' and Section One firearms.

[Arthur John Smithsplease]

Some American airgunners have actually reduced the power of their springers to around the 12fpe level, because their guns are nicer to shoot and more accurate at that power.

These are mainly target shooters, it is true.

I see no problem with say 14 fpe, but, personally, I wouldn't want to shoot a 20 fpe springer.

They must make your teeth rattle, and they don't actually take the accuracy range that much further out. Perhaps about 10-15 yards.

If you want more, better to go rimfire, which is easy to get in the USA, but not so easy here.

Don't get me wrong. I hate government imposing limits.

I wish we had American gun laws here.

However, a spring piston air rifle is still a springer, and a springer functions better at lower power.

[lensman57]

If you take up Terry's offer, you will also have the answer to the above question.

Back to the OP. The person responsible was the idiot who, annoyed by the noise from a construction project, decided to shoot at the plant and vehicles. He was caught, the air rifle in question (an American pump-up rifle capable of considerably more than 12 ft. lb.) identified and, due to the damage it had created, the Police, press and politicians decided 'something had to be done'. That something was a Statutory Instrument by James Callaghan declaring airguns capable of producing in excess of 12 ft. lb. being 'especially dangerous' and Section One firearms.

Thank you for providing the detail of the person who helped bring this about. I just wonder if the Police needed a limit on the rifle output to be sure of reducing the gun crime. Another word how does putting a limit on an air rifle can stop a lunatic abusing the weapon?

A.G

[charlie350]

there is a lot of detuneing going on over here but as said it is mostly for target and FT and my 350's and 48's and 54 is not maxed out on power but all are over the 20flb mark . and if you tune them proper they do not rattle your teeth and are very smooth shooters that i enjoy greatly! and are no harder to shoot then my Hw77-superstar-34's that are in the 14-17 range. im sure with no tophat and loose spring guides and no buttons they would twang like a toothless hillbillys banjo. but the first thing i do when getting a new to me airgun is strip it down and fix all the short comings. if you don't you just throw more cash away replacing scopes and the springs dont last half as long

[TonyL]

......"..twang like a toothless hillbillys banjo.

Love it!

[TonyL]

Back to the OP. The person responsible was the idiot who, annoyed by the noise from a construction project, decided to shoot at the plant and vehicles. He was caught, the air rifle in question (an American pump-up rifle capable of considerably more than 12 ft. lb.) identified and, due to the damage it had created, the Police, press and politicians decided 'something had to be done'. That something was a Statutory Instrument by James Callaghan declaring airguns capable of producing in excess of 12 ft. lb. being 'especially dangerous' and Section One firearms.

Thank you for posting this, Jim.

Upsetting though that, as is often the case, the actions of one prat has a restrictive and long term effect on millions of the law abiding, responsible users.

Would have been better to string him up by his knackers!