Fas 604......

[tacfoley]

Getting way too hot out there right now here in rural Cambs, so I'm giving up shooting till the sun moves round a bit.

Spent the last couple of hours on and off shooting my 20-yo FAS 604. What a real delight it is! Not only does it look 99% the same as its cartridge-firing brethren, but the grip and sights are just the same as I remember from the way back then.

It makes me wonder why no manufacturer has really tried to make a serious 10m match pistol that actually looks like a 25m cartridge-firing pistol instead of something used by somebody from Planet Gleep. And yes, I have a 10m air pistol that looks like that, too.

The first air pistol that looked more or less like its rimfire counterpart was the Walther LP53, back in, uh, 1953, and then there were a couple of CO2 look-alikes - Daisy? Crosman? that looked just like the Smith & Wesson Model 41. Not serious target pistols tho'. Since then?

Zero.

Until the Italians had the idea of making a complete set of identical-size guns for all the pistol disciplines. Bravo indeed.

I realise that the size of the air store would be compromised by lack of space, but a Morini/Pardini/Walther GSP with the forward magazine position would surely be able to hold a compact air bottle for 50-60 shots - a full competition, IOW.

Howsabout it, gun-makers?

I've put £1000 to one side in case anybody ever comes up with one.

Anybody else interested in joining with me in this one?

tac

[Benelli B76]

Always found that air pistols copying rimfire or centre fire firearms are a bit of a compromise. I think the Schimel was the first CO2 copy emulating the P08 (Luger). Better performance is found in dedicated purpose designs, but I think that some UK shooters are frustrated not having handguns and want copies. I had 120 pistols and revolvers overseas but don't really miss them here in UK with the restrictive rules we had when they were around. I now prefer using proper target air and C02 pistols for accuracy and power output.

Baz

[tacfoley]

I shoot 10m ISSF air pistol, so my rationale was that while I have the FAS 604, I also have an air-conversion Steyr LP5. I'd just like something that is more firearm-like, as the FAS definitely is, than the Steyr, which looks a mite orthopedic, just like all of its ilk.

tac

[Bjacobs571]

Modern 10m target air pistols are made to be the best 10 target pistols they can be given the constraints of the rules and of engineering, rather than a copy of a .22LR target pistol. if you want a firearm replica then buy a co2 BB pistol as some of them are incredibly good copies.
I used to shoot a Pardini SPE and in many ways it was like a modern air pistol in feel and balance.
Modern .22LR target pistols have also moved on and don't look much like a FAS anymore.
SSP pistols are not used by top competitors anymore and since PCPs need a cylinder of a certain volume there isn't anywhere else to put it except under the barrel

[Nikkormat]

What Bjacobs571 says above covers it all, but I suppose the Drulov DU-10 Condor is about as close as you can get.

Matt

[subdvr]

Interesting thoughts Tac
Ive got a CO2 Twinmaster Trainer which is close to a Pardini SP, probably not far off the weight of the Pardini either. Whilst its not a brilliant target pistol, in single shot, its not bad!

[tacfoley]

Interesting thoughts Tac
Ive got a CO2 Twinmaster Trainer which is close to a Pardini SP, probably not far off the weight of the Pardini either. Whilst its not a brilliant target pistol, in single shot, its not bad!

Hmmm, I just had a look at it, you're right, it IS a bit Pardini-ish, cheap too.

Thanks for the pointment.

tac

[Benelli B76]

Tac, I also have a 604 and quite like its simplicity and shape, but it is let down by the power output. I like my air pistols to be launching a 7 grn pellet at 450 to 550 fps and the FAS struggles to get 400. This is only my personal preference as we use air pistols at quite long range at our club. Many on here will say 400 fps is fine. I have the Airmatch 600 which is like an extended 604 and gives better performance but is then losing its real firearm similarity. I was trying to think what powder burner I would like copied and I think it would be a PCP copy of the Thompson Contender in .30 calibre airgun pellet. We have something available all ready in the 8mm Giffard pistol, but being an antique at £2500 not readily accessible to us all !

Baz

[AC all day]

Hi all i went down this route a while ago on a different mission.....i have a FWB p44 and an Izzy and a large collection of Brococks. I wanted to see if it was possible to match shoot with an Orion 6 and actualy it is. When people have stopped laughing......
I tricked out the revolver the same as a match version with grips and barrel weights and trigger overtravel stops, a custom polish of trigger and barrel crown/ lead.Then using a special lube on the carts and a lot of time batching them i was able to actually get very good acuracy in fact one hole group standard....it will still out shoot me.
Not everyones cup of tea, but an interesting project for the cold winter months

[airgunnut]

I have an old fwb c10 co2 target pistol, the co2 cylinder holds 52g (bulk fill) and that will give 200 shots at 150 m/s (492 fps, 335.57mph) it's accuret but I miss my old Walther lp 300, I sold it back to the man who I bought it off (about 5 years later) the 300 bar cylinder was leaking through the cylinder it's self I did not want to have a potential hand grenade near me with the cash I got back from the lp 300 I bought the c10 from another club member.

[tacfoley]

Thanks, Gentlemen, for making my question into an interesting thread, to say the least. Some wise words and lot of useful information.

However, as I've mentioned a couple of times, I only shoot ISSF 10m air rifle and pistol - longer ranges and the ability to blow a hole in the backstop wall are of no interest ot me.

It seems that I've missed out on the most-like a firearm in general appearance pistol by the the recent sale of a compact version of one of the major brand's PCP air pistols, so I'm now going to look for one in right-hand form [I shoot equally badly with both hands, having no master eye].

Thanks again, bbs-ers!


tac

[airgunnut]

Thanks, Gentlemen, for making my question into an interesting thread, to say the least. Some wise words and lot of useful information.

However, as I've mentioned a couple of times, I only shoot ISSF 10m air rifle and pistol - longer ranges and the ability to blow a hole in the backstop wall are of no interest ot me.

It seems that I've missed out on the most-like a firearm in general appearance pistol by the the recent sale of a compact version of one of the major brand's PCP air pistols, so I'm now going to look for one in right-hand form [I shoot equally badly with both hands, having no master eye].

Thanks again, bbs-ers!


tac

Tac check out the last dasiy target pistol or the s &w http://www.co2airguns.net/Collection/index.htm#Target

[blooregard]

I was trying to think what powder burner I would like copied and I think it would be a PCP copy of the Thompson Contender in .30 calibre airgun pellet.

Good choice, one I've considered before as well.

Another PCP choice (but in rifle form) for me would be something like a Blaser B95. Doesn't have to be an exact copy but I am sure there is a market for a break (double) barrel recoiless rifle.

[clarky]

I'm inclined to agree with the viewpoint of the person that started this post...
I wonder why this 30 year old gun never set a std to start producing pistols which look ...well.....nice.
Yes we got 46m but the thing is like some agricultural implement for mucking out the pig barn.....guns just don't need to be that ugly surely , esp when they came out with Walter lp3 s and similar half Century ago ...
Also I wonder why umarex and the like keep on churning out vast numbers of multi shot revolver fed inaccurate Co2 pistols.....surely one which could break at the beech for single direct into barrel loading would provide so much more accuracy and power ...but also a choice...
Fed direct into barrel and gas tight sealing......why is it so hard .

[Bjacobs571]

if you get into 10m target shooting the modern PCPs look very good. I think my LP400 carbon looks very sexy and the LP53 looks agricultural in comparison. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
The first thing other manufacturers did when they produced their own SSP pistols was to make them longer so they had more power and a longer sight radius.
if you want a single shot pistol the CP1 is powerful and accurate. it is bolt action which is easier to manufacture.
All my PCP match pistols are single shot and load into the breach.
Break barrels are for springers.
What you appear to want is be allowed section 1 pistols again which is what we all want but air pistols cannot replicate them as they do not have the concentrated energy that a live cartridge has.