Latest re: Steyr LP50

[tacfoley]

You are missing the fact that others are as capable of reading the written word as you are.

You are also trying to apply your own definition of what constitutes a firearm (i.e. anything requiring a certificate) whereas you should be using the definitions in the relevant legislation, especially given the importance of your role in the legislative system.

Hmmmmmmmmm.

I have to say that thus far my role in the legislative system has only been tried by -

1. firearms that really ARE the terble banned handguns of the kind that we lost back in '97.

2. firearms of the kind that have been prohibited in UK since the mid-1920s - ie, the Thompson SMG, the German Erma MP38, the MAC10, the Skorpion and so on.

3. replications of any of the above that are indistinguishable from the real thing at VERY close proximity - pellet-firing, Airsoft, some ornamental cigarette lighters.

4. gun-like objects that appear to be guns to the untrained/unfamiliar eyeball [as in most of the above, TTTT]

5. 'revived' de-acts, converted blank-firers or Brocock revolvers and pistols.

I have to admit that I've never encountered anybody using a £1500 Olympic-style air pistol to facilitate the commission of a crime.

Call me a pedant, but if it's called a firearm, then according to that it has to have a firearms certificate.

You are saying that it can STILL be a firearm, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it needs a firearms certificate?

That does not make much, if any, sense.

tac

[Airsporter1st]

Call me a pedant, but if it's called a firearm, then according to that it has to have a firearms certificate.

You are saying that it can STILL be a firearm, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it needs a firearms certificate?

Yes that is correct.

That does not make much, if any, sense.

tac

I agree, but there is a great deal in the current legislation which governs our hobby, that makes even less sense.

[lensman57]

Interesting take on the law by our friend Tac. I was always under the impression that a lethal barrelled weapon of more than 1 Joule of ME is classed as fire arms. The exceptions to requiring an FAC would then determine that we could have sub 12s air rifles and sub 6 none self loading air pistols without an FAC.
The bottom line is that the law regarding the firearms is in a right royal mess and sooner or later needs calrifying, not for the lawyers and police officers but for the genral public that is the user and therefore responsible to the law.

A.G

[Brian.Samson]

Hmmmmmmmmm.

I have to say that thus far my role in the legislative system has only been tried by -

1. firearms that really ARE the terble banned handguns of the kind that we lost back in '97.

2. firearms of the kind that have been prohibited in UK since the mid-1920s - ie, the Thompson SMG, the German Erma MP38, the MAC10, the Skorpion and so on.

3. replications of any of the above that are indistinguishable from the real thing at VERY close proximity - pellet-firing, Airsoft, some ornamental cigarette lighters.

4. gun-like objects that appear to be guns to the untrained/unfamiliar eyeball [as in most of the above, TTTT]

5. 'revived' de-acts, converted blank-firers or Brocock revolvers and pistols.

I have to admit that I've never encountered anybody using a £1500 Olympic-style air pistol to facilitate the commission of a crime.

Call me a pedant, but if it's called a firearm, then according to that it has to have a firearms certificate.

You are saying that it can STILL be a firearm, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it needs a firearms certificate?

That does not make much, if any, sense.

tac

the Firearms Act 1968.

Section 57 (i) contains the legal definition of a firearm :
In this Act, the expression “firearm” means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged...

That most certainly includes sub 12 air rifles and sub 6 air pistols.

A Shotgun is also a "firearm" - but it doesn't require a firearms certificate

The requirements (and exceptions) for a firearms certificate are contained in Section 1 of the act.

[Airsporter1st]

the Firearms Act 1968.

Section 57 (i) contains the legal definition of a firearm :
In this Act, the expression “firearm” means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged...

That most certainly includes sub 12 air rifles and sub 6 air pistols.

Correct. And in Section 3 (b) it excepts the requirement to hold a firearms certificate.

[Brian.Samson]

Correct. And in Section 3 (b) it excepts the requirement to hold a firearms certificate.

It does indeed - it's so much better to be able to quote the actual statute law than to just make stuff up isn't it

[Cocksure]

As ever Bri, you're the bestest! I'm off to get myself a shotgun...no certificate needed!

So why bother with airguns when 12 bore sounds so much fun, and if I get stopped on the way from my shooting club with my shotgun and the copper says, do you have a licence for that, I will laugh in his face...all the way to magistrates, then crown! We do mean licence when we say fire arms certificate I assume?

I am amazed that such powerful firearms can be owned without recourse to license etc, my local gun shop, Henry Kranks won't sell me one without...should I sue?

Thanks

Tom

[Airsporter1st]

As ever Bri, you're the bestest! I'm off to get myself a shotgun...no certificate needed!

So why bother with airguns when 12 bore sounds so much fun, and if I get stopped on the way from my shooting club with my shotgun and the copper says, do you have a licence for that, I will laugh in his face...all the way to magistrates, then crown! We do mean licence when we say fire arms certificate I assume?

I am amazed that such powerful firearms can be owned without recourse to license etc, my local gun shop, Henry Kranks won't sell me one without...should I sue?

Thanks

Tom

You, too, would do well to read the act. You do not need a Firearms Certificate for a 'regular' shotgun ( read the act if you need to know which), but you do need a Shotgun Certificate.

[Cocksure]

You too, would do well to read the act. You do not need a Firearms Certificate for a 'regular' shotgun ( read the act if you need to know which), but you do need a Shotgun Licence.

And you should read my post properly before falling into the same pedants language trap Bri set....clever clogs!! You are assuming other people are not as able to read basic English as you are...etc etc.

That's why I only used the word license in relation to a shotgun......

[tacfoley]

You too, would do well to read the act. You do not need a Firearms Certificate for a 'regular' shotgun ( read the act if you need to know which), but you do need a Shotgun Licence.

'certificate' not license.

And thanks to all for putting me right about it. The legislation really IS a load of total shite, isn't it?

tac

[tacfoley]

Interesting take on the law by our friend Tac. I was always under the impression that a lethal barrelled weapon of more than 1 Joule of ME is classed as fire arms. The exceptions to requiring an FAC would then determine that we could have sub 12s air rifles and sub 6 none self loading air pistols without an FAC.
The bottom line is that the law regarding the firearms is in a right royal mess and sooner or later needs calrifying, not for the lawyers and police officers but for the genral public that is the user and therefore responsible to the law.

A.G

That's the very first time in well over 10000 posts [yes, I've been here before] that anybody has referred to me as a 'friend'. I'll remember that you wrote that.

tac

[Airsporter1st]

'certificate' not license.

And thanks to all for putting me right about it. The legislation really IS a load of total shite, isn't it?

tac

Yes- certificate. Sorry!

[Airsporter1st]

And you should read my post properly before falling into the same pedants language trap Bri set....clever clogs!! You are assuming other people are not as able to read basic English as you are...etc etc.

That's why I only used the word license in relation to a shotgun......

Licenense? Good thing you edited it before I got the quote nailed!

[Cocksure]

'certificate' not license.

And thanks to all for putting me right about it. The legislation really IS a load of total shite, isn't it?

tac

Just 'cause it's the law doesn't make it 'right'.....you are correct in your slaggin' of the law and your assumptions would meet with approval from the man on the Clapham omnibus ( for those that enjoy law stuff..)

Stand by what you said and march, march on town hall!!!

[Cocksure]

Licenense? Good thing you edited it before I got the quote nailed!

You mean certificatement surely.....