The best backyard rifle. European vs American tradition

[45flint]

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u...ps7wnbinis.jpg

This thread is a kind of a summary of my airgun rifle journey so far. I bought my first airgun rifle 20 years ago the Beeman R1, bought it at a time when I was the target market for Mr. Beeman, adult airgunner with money to buy a good rifle. I am a backyard plinker and the Beeman was a stellar gun.

Now I'm into vintage airguns and I bought a 1930s Crosman 102. I always looked down of the American multipump peumatics. To me it made no sense to pump 8 times when I could break a barrel once. These were the cheap American product for the masses.

I bought the 102 cause it was just a intriguing addition to a vintage collection, made in 1930 it is my oldest airgun, and it looked charmingly quirky to me. Also the investment was so minimal, $100. It came in the winter so this Spring I have had both the R1 and the 102 out in the backyard putting each through their paces.

I find that my 102 is now by far my favorite backyard rifle. I know the DT Flecther was called the 101 the best field rifle ever made. I guess I'm not the hunter but I might call it the best backyard airgun ever made. Here is my case for it and it has actually come as quite a surprise.

1. The variable power in the backyard is a huge advantage. I never pump beyond 3 pumps in the backyard often 2. I have a large lot over an acre but I have neighbors, I can adjust for tighter ranges.

2. Variable power means variable noise levels, in the backyard with neighbors, 3 pumps is about silent. Yes in my jurisdiction airguns are legal to shoot, but it's best if your neighbors never even have to think about it.

3. The peumatics is much easier to shoot with no recoil, or maybe I should add fun to shoot. The Beeman has to have a artillary grip, you certainly feel the recoil.

4. The 102 is compact and light, the Beeman is long and very heavy.

5. Both guns are very accurate with the Beeman having the edge, but the 102 is much easier to shoot accurately.

6. Lastly I am no mechanic but I easily changed out the seals in a 101 to repair it. The Beeman would certainly not be a job I would do.

[landymick]

The lower power HW30 might be a good choice for a spot of plinking.

[DT Fletcher]

I started in about the same place; purchasing a number of modern european springers: FWB 124, HW 45, BSA Scorpion. Then, just like you, on a whim, went to the local airgun repair shops and purchased ($24) from the back of the shop, a beat up old Crosman. Happened to be a model 107 Town and Country that I spent the next month figuring out how to fix. Once finished, out shot anything else I had by a large margin. All the springers were beasts and the T&C was sweetness personified.

Another model that is really worthwhile tracking down, imo, is a Town and Country Jr. models 109/110. Exactly the same pneumatics as the larger models but in a tiny package. The slab sided stock is nothing to brag about but the entire gun is all brass construction and is second to none as a shooter.

The model 120 came in both brass and steel; with a brass one being just as good as the model 110.

Another prize for any Crosman collection would be an early pre-1929 (101) model in excellent condition, with an emphasis on excellent condition. These guns were not closet queens. They were used and, from what I've seen over the years, only maybe 1 in 50 come close to being in excellent condition.

You got very lucky with that 102.

[45flint]

The lower power HW30 might be a good choice for a spot of plinking.

I haven't tried lighter springers, I like everyone else at the time got caught up in a R1 that could do 1000 fps. The R1 given its power is I'm sure not a "easy" springer. There is something nice about using the same gun for plinking with 2-3 pumps and giving it 7-8 pumps if I want to take a squirrel. 95% of the time I will be plinking with 3. There really is almost a cultural divide between the two continents. I personally would love to see a finely made German pneumatic but it would never sell in Europe and no one in America would pay the price. I guess PCP have really taken this market, but again were power mad and your out of the backyard.

[landymick]

I see where your coming from with the Crosman but I wouldn't fancy going through a tin full of pellets in one session with all that pumping, this is the domain for the light weight springer.

Another nice option for a few more dollars is the Diana/RWS 27 which I'm sure are abundant around your way.

I love the R1/ HW80 but its not the best in the garden.

[cinedux]

the BSA CADET MAJOR....177 of course.

[Airsporter1st]

I've dabbled with the odd pump-up over the years, but always found them a lot of trouble for the end result. By the time you've pumped it and then gone through a totally separate sequence of actions to load it (and sometimes another set to cock it), you could get several shots off from a springer.

I'm not saying that rate of fire is everything, but when plinking I just want to throw a few bits of lead downrange with minimum fuss and effort.

Equally, when hunting, there often is not the time to go through all the motions required of a pump-up, while your quarry sits patiently waiting and in the hopefully unlikely need of a second shot, an inordinate delay is unacceptable.

On the other hand, if you enjoy the experience of using a pump-up, the who are we to disagree?

[Geezer]

The pneumatics do make good garden plinkers on 2-3 pumps. Easy to charge, light, handy, fairly accurate (though I wish some of the sights and triggers were better).

But I too would give the nod to something like a Diana 25D, 27, or 240 (or the HW, Webley and BSA equivalents).

[45flint]

I've dabbled with the odd pump-up over the years, but always found them a lot of trouble for the end result. By the time you've pumped it and then gone through a totally separate sequence of actions to load it (and sometimes another set to cock it), you could get several shots off from a springer.

I'm not saying that rate of fire is everything, but when plinking I just want to throw a few bits of lead downrange with minimum fuss and effort.

Equally, when hunting, there often is not the time to go through all the motions required of a pump-up, while your quarry sits patiently waiting and in the hopefully unlikely need of a second shot, an inordinate delay is unacceptable.

On the other hand, if you enjoy the experience of using a pump-up, the who are we to disagree?

All good points but for plinking I find 2-3 pumps are so easy I prefer it to the long hard pull of the barrel. In this country these tended to be the preferred hunting gun. It's biggest advantage is you can go into the field fully charged and stay that way all day, ready for a quick shot. Your shot also has the release of a pcp no special grip. It is just easier to shoot accurately especially in a hunting situation. It is a one shot pcp and I do hear you on the issue of a quick follow up. It to me was a cultural divide which was ended by the pcp, in the hunting mode, but maybe not for plinking?. The Mohawk Titan were interesting English models that were probably ended by the pcp.

[Geezer]

All good points but for plinking I find 2-3 pumps are so easy I prefer it to the long hard pull of the barrel. In this country these tended to be the preferred hunting gun. It's biggest advantage is you can go into the field fully charged and stay that way all day, ready for a quick shot. Your shot also has the release of a pcp no special grip. It is just easier to shoot accurately especially in a hunting situation. It is a one shot pcp and I do hear you on the issue of a quick follow up. It to me was a cultural divide which was ended by the pcp, in the hunting mode, but maybe not for plinking?. The Mohawk Titan were interesting English models that were probably ended by the pcp.

I agree. But, for plinking - and even short-range pest control - a light, easy-cocking springer like a Diana 27 is a very different proposition from a big old cannon like an R1.

[Garvin]

Steve that 102 is just gorgeous. If I'd started out with that, I may never have looked at another airgun. But in the '70s Crosman pump-ups were pretty big in the UK - cheap, recoilless and powerful - and when I was about 16 I had Crosman 766 and 2200 rifles and a 1300 pistol. The power on maximum pumps was impressive, the accuracy good, and I was young enough to do the pumping for an extended plinking session without complaint.

But... the quality of materials and finish just couldn't compete with the [German and, later, vintage springers] for me.

I got hold of a new FWB 127 when I was 17 and never looked back. Plinking was never the same - excellent power, a match-quality barrel, just one 'pump' to cock, and blued steel with a hardwood stock. Fantastic! And I could hunt with it too when the opportunity arose. The recoil never bothered me and it was fiendishly accurate over quite long distances.

After that, I could never go back to plastic, where I started, however wonderful the gun. Over the years I lost interest in modern airguns and in middle age picked up where I left off in my late teens - which was my first 'collecting phase'.

[45flint]

No question the quality of these German guns was unsurpassed. But a 1930s Crosman pump has a build quality that surprised you. It did me and bronze parts are kind of cool. I have no desire for any Crosman built after the 1949 Town and Country. I would love to see a quality pumper made by someone like FWB, but it will never happen.

[coburn]

Last time I was in upstate New York, well Westchester County to be exact, your back yards were about the size of a small farm here in the UK. US I'd go for a Beeman R1/HW80 but in my small postage stamp of a garden a HW30 or HW 55 makes more sense.

[Mark D]

No question the quality of these German guns was unsurpassed. But a 1930s Crosman pump has a build quality that surprised you. It did me and bronze parts are kind of cool. I have no desire for any Crosman built after the 1949 Town and Country. I would love to see a quality pumper made by someone like FWB, but it will never happen.

A quality pumper FWB did indeed make - just that it's a SSP - The FWB range of quality match SSP are great for plinking, just buy a 'Junior' version and they are light enough to shoot all day.

[Garvin]

A quality pumper FWB did indeed make - just that it's a SSP - The FWB range of quality match SSP are great for plinking, just buy a 'Junior' version and they are light enough to shoot all day.

So true, Mark, and if you want the satisfaction of spring plinking, the short 300S Junior is probably the ultimate plinker!