Open sights ... am I asking too much ?

[Phil G]

Just a thought, to avoid a bulky scope. Why not try a small Red Dot sight? Not one of the tube type, just the single screen. Very light weight.

You only have to concentrate on one point, not front and rear sight. You focus your eye on the target and let the dot float into view, you should be able to figure out any 'hold over' needed at distance.

Keep both eyes open when using and choose a small moa dot,

Good luck, Phil

[petethemap]

There are a few open sight shooters doing hft up here in Scotland, The preferred option is either a HW 77 or 99s, or AA springers with a 3D printed foresight adaptor and a dioptre rear sight .

[StellaArtois Sr]

I love using open sights upto 35 yards, but I do wonder what you plan on hitting at 50 60 or even further.

[Geezer]

This has got me thinking. I am imagining some sort of adaptation of the No4 Lee-Enfield/P-14 rear sight, or the M-1 Garand/M-14 one to an airgun. Something that has enough adjustment range to work from 10 yards out to 100, ideally (M-1) with good windage adjustments. That would be cool.

[rhyslightnin]

This has got me thinking. I am imagining some sort of adaptation of the No4 Lee-Enfield/P-14 rear sight, or the M-1 Garand/M-14 one to an airgun. Something that has enough adjustment range to work from 10 yards out to 100, ideally (M-1) with good windage adjustments. That would be cool.

Or something like this?

https://youtu.be/kLP1s0IeIWw

[Geezer]

I think in that film, I'm probably Alan Rickman, not Tom Selleck.

Seriously, 782 yards offhand?

Now, to return to the issue at hand. Lowest-profile 11mm to Weaver converter rail, and M16A2 national match sight. That might work.

How much vertical adjustment do you get on a PH-16, as often fitted to e.g. the Webley Mk3?

But, tang sight on a 77 is an interesting idea.

[Beretta303]

Just a thought, to avoid a bulky scope. Why not try a small Red Dot sight? Not one of the tube type, just the single screen. Very light weight.

You only have to concentrate on one point, not front and rear sight. You focus your eye on the target and let the dot float into view, you should be able to figure out any 'hold over' needed at distance.

Keep both eyes open when using and choose a small moa dot,

Good luck, Phil

I'm liking this, kinda halfway house, it would mean that I wouldn't need to buy a new gun or modify the HW90 to take a foresight, a stroke of genius me thinks.

Any recommendations on a decent red dot sight with a small fine dot guys ?

[Beretta303]

I love using open sights upto 35 yards, but I do wonder what you plan on hitting at 50 60 or even further.

I'd start off with an 8" shoot-n-see on a white board and work down from there having already zero'd the gun at 40 yards, I reckon its possible to be able to get down to a 40mm disc at 70 yards. The consistency of the rifle isn't a problem, but wind and the obscuring of the target by the foresight is. Obviously you aint gonna hit it every time, but I'd be happy to be able to hit the kill disc on a knockdown target 3 out of 5 times at 60-70...after a fair bit of setting up and practice of course.

The mention of a red dot might just be the answer, deffo gonna look into that.

[SRV1]

Mmmm...yes, go for the open sights and an old classic springer! Those at the club with their sophisticated and out of my price league exotica rifles and scopes worth a year old secondhand Lexus, with wooden cases that would put a top class coffin maker to shame, put pellet after pellet through the same hole and get bored after 10 minutes then go for tea and biscuits for the rest of the night. I am still there enjoying myself trying to get within the outer circle. It may look like I have used a 410, but, at least I didn't waste the paper target.....


All the best.....

[max headroom]

With a Lee Enfield MK4 the best I was able to achieve with open sights was 1MOA out to 600m. It took young eyes and application to keep it under 3 or 4 MOA.
There are open iron sights and target open sights, the latter designed to the target roundel. The former for field and military use in all weathers. Military open sights were able to get a solid hit on a man sized target, not nat shoot. To screw down groups then either the range has to be kept short or targets and sights have to be manipulated to work together.

Air rifle rat shooting within the farm yard is quite effective with good iron sights. Beyond that then its a big ask. Some can hit spinners out quite a distance but they wouldn't try on live quarry. Mastering open sights is a great thing to do, and a lot of fun. Very rewarding once you realise how great they are, but also the limitations.

Vernier. i used to shoot lee enfield too. 3 point open sights. on the thumb. the big un was for a long way. the likkle un was for when they were closer. the vernier was for targets or snipers.
best i done, half a crown. two maggies and three bulls. but at 1000 yids. only earned crossed rifles.

[Rickenbacker]

Vernier. i used to shoot lee enfield too. 3 point open sights. on the thumb. the big un was for a long way. the likkle un was for when they were closer. the vernier was for targets or snipers.
best i done, half a crown. two maggies and three bulls. but at 1000 yids. only earned crossed rifles.

Good shooting Max I couldn't even get on the target frame with the club's No.4 at 1000 yards when we went to Bisley. Piece of crap that gun was.

To the OP - Long range with iron sights - If you can see it well enough, you can hit it just as easily (or not) as you could with a scope.

Seeing the target well is the problem.

If you have a large well defined circle to aim at - You could do well at hitting the center of it.

But a steel 'knockdown' with a 40mm KZ that isn't in the center of mass - not so easy.

Aiming off for wind - not so easy either.

I don't know of a red-dot sight that would be fine enough. The dots are often huge.

Also, a thought on using a '77, I'm sure it's fine with a peep sight, but the regular rear sight is (I found) useless because it won't go far enough forwards.

HTH

[Beretta303]

Good shooting Max I couldn't even get on the target frame with the club's No.4 at 1000 yards when we went to Bisley. Piece of crap that gun was.

To the OP - Long range with iron sights - If you can see it well enough, you can hit it just as easily (or not) as you could with a scope.

Seeing the target well is the problem.

If you have a large well defined circle to aim at - You could do well at hitting the center of it.

But a steel 'knockdown' with a 40mm KZ that isn't in the center of mass - not so easy.

Aiming off for wind - not so easy either.

I don't know of a red-dot sight that would be fine enough. The dots are often huge.

Also, a thought on using a '77, I'm sure it's fine with a peep sight, but the regular rear sight is (I found) useless because it won't go far enough forwards.

HTH

Rooti, I'm toying with the idea of one of these...

http://www.vortexoptics.com/product/...-dot-3-moa-dot

It has a 3moa dot, so at 100 yards the dot covers a 3 inch circle. I'm looking to shoot 50-70 so I reckon I'm covering the target at 1.5-2 or so inches. Bear in mind I'm hoping to hit a 40mm disc, then its ballpark. Its accurate enough without spending shed loads on a new rifle and top end peeps and turrets. This Vortex jobbie also allows 130moa of vertical adjustment (!!!) so should cover my .22 gas ram comfortably at the ranges I'm looking at, or at least thats how my brain sees it.....fingers crossed !

[Phil G]

I'm liking this, kinda halfway house, it would mean that I wouldn't need to buy a new gun or modify the HW90 to take a foresight, a stroke of genius me thinks.

Any recommendations on a decent red dot sight with a small fine dot guys ?

This design has single 1moa within a 65moa ring. The ring can help you get a better perspective of the target.

This is a American site, but should be available in the UK


http://www.hiairsoft.com/xps-red-and...0mm-p-903.html



Interesting to read.

Red Dot Sights and Scopes Buyers Guide and Reviews

http://sportingdealnews.com/red-dot-sights-and-scopes-buyers-guide-and-reviews/

[Mr A]

I did some plinking at the weekend with a vintage open sight .177 and thoroughly enjoyed it so I understand your desire to shoot open sight rifles. I have never tried to hit targets at 70 metres - 50 metres with a PCP and scope is about my limit. Good luck.

[max headroom]

i see some are referring to red/green dot. something to remember here. do you were specs? the light reflects on your specs. instead of one dot you loads.