Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Pedersoli Flint Lock Mortimer Rifle

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Leicester
    Posts
    43

    Pedersoli Flint Lock Mortimer Rifle

    I have brought a Pedersoli Flint Lock Mortimer Rifle .54 Cal yesterday from Henry Kranks.
    Never owned or shot a Flint Lock before.
    The rifle came quite greased up out of the box, when wiped down I fitted a flint with a piece of thin leather I cut from the inside of an old wallet & she sparked first time.
    There is no loading data info in the box.
    On Pedersolis Website is says to use between 60 & 110 grn of Black Powder, seems excessive for a 535 ball?
    I will be shooting at either 25 or 50m with it, I have some of Peter Starleys Medium Black Powder to use and some 10 thou lubed patches.
    Online I saw a post where a guy was shooting at 50 yards with 49 gns Swiss No. 3 powder and got good results.
    I think I will try some with 40, 45 & 50 gns and see what results I get.
    Unless someone out there has the same Flint Lock Rifle & has done the ground work for me.
    Is it worth packing the charge out with semolina?
    When cleaning it looks like you put the gun in half cock, remove the ram rod & tap out the two wedges to remove the barrel.
    Is it always worth while removing the barrel to clean it?

    Stuart

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Sittingbourne
    Posts
    55
    Hi Stuart,

    110 grain does sound excessive, but I think these rifles are designed to shoot quite a distance, my father has one.

    If you're shooting 25/50 yards I think you're wise to keep the load below 60 grains, and medium BP should do just the trick.

    I use a thick felt Wad in my .45 Cal kentucky deluxe, in the thought that it will push some of the fouling back down the barrel and make the ball & patch easier to load down the rifling,

    Semolina wont have that effect, but it's up to you really though what you want to do. Some people like to put the ball and patch straight on top of the powder.

    Barrel removal is always handy, and If it's possible, I usually do it. If you clean with boiling hot water then barrel removal is a good idea to stop the stock from getting hot. (Dont want warped wood)

    Just make sure you get a cloth to hold the barrel when you pour the kettle water down it! - Easy mistake to make!

    Barrel removal on modern kentuckies requires removing pins, so it's more effort and possibly splintering wood unless you're careful...

    I dont bother removing the barrel when cleaning that...

    The old antique ones had barrel wedges though!

    Oh, and, get plenty of flints!

    - Tom

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    3,519
    I wouldn't bother packing the charge out with semolina. There is no harm using a wad over the powder if you want to but it is probably not necessary.
    I use 60 grains of powder to propel a .575" Minnie bullet (560gr) 100 yards so a lower charge at the distance you are shooting would probably be adequate.
    I know that in a flintlock pistol firing a .650"patched ball over 38gr of powder at 25 yards is more than enough powder.
    Don't fill the flash pan with powder it has to burn through before its sets off the main charge and it causes a delay in ignition.
    Use as little powder as possible in the flash pan so ignition of the main charge is quicker.
    If you don't get good groups with the intended charges try going up 1/2grain at a time.
    The patches and lube can also affect the accuracy. I know someone who took two years to get an antique rifle to shoot tight groups at 100 yards.
    I had a Charles Moore percussion pistol by Pedersoli. They recommended .006" patches. The target looked like it had been hit with a shotgun.
    I swapped to a thicker softer patch of .010" and it shot well. I tried a .015" patch thinking that the ball being tighter in the bore would make it more accurate, nope, it would not group with the thicker patch, I had to go back to the .010" patch.
    Flintlocks are addictive and are good to shoot but they do try your patience sometimes.Some guns like to be swabbed out after each shot. Its all trial and error. All part of the interest I suppose.
    Good luck with it.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Huntingdon
    Posts
    6,634
    Quote Originally Posted by enfield2band View Post
    I wouldn't bother packing the charge out with semolina. There is no harm using a wad over the powder if you want to but it is probably not necessary.
    I use 60 grains of powder to propel a .575" Minnie bullet (560gr) 100 yards so a lower charge at the distance you are shooting would probably be adequate.
    I know that in a flintlock pistol firing a .650"patched ball over 38gr of powder at 25 yards is more than enough powder.
    Don't fill the flash pan with powder it has to burn through before its sets off the main charge and it causes a delay in ignition.
    Use as little powder as possible in the flash pan so ignition of the main charge is quicker.
    If you don't get good groups with the intended charges try going up 1/2grain at a time.
    The patches and lube can also affect the accuracy. I know someone who took two years to get an antique rifle to shoot tight groups at 100 yards.
    I had a Charles Moore percussion pistol by Pedersoli. They recommended .006" patches. The target looked like it had been hit with a shotgun.
    I swapped to a thicker softer patch of .010" and it shot well. I tried a .015" patch thinking that the ball being tighter in the bore would make it more accurate, nope, it would not group with the thicker patch, I had to go back to the .010" patch.
    Flintlocks are addictive and are good to shoot but they do try your patience sometimes.Some guns like to be swabbed out after each shot. Its all trial and error. All part of the interest I suppose.
    Good luck with it.

    Good post, Sir.

    As noted, there is absolutely no point in using a filler in a rifle. Also, for the OP, a simple 'clean-up' is really not enough for a new flintlock rifle. It will need a total clean-out with some vigorous elbow motion in the bore - most Pedersolis I've seen from new had very hard-to-see rifling from the gunk used a a preservative grease. YMMV.

    Lots of stuff on Youtube, especially from my old pal dungspreader in BC and in particular, Pedersoli's #1 front man in Hungary, the former national champion shot Balász Németh on capandball channel.

    Enjoy, and don't forget to wear eye protection.

    tac
    Several guns and trains.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Leicester
    Posts
    43
    Thanks for all the helpful advise guys.
    I have brought a small brass flash pan priming tool.
    I have some safety glass's.
    I will give the barrel another clean, I don't use boiling water when cleaning my other guns just hot water & wads with Muzzle Magic Cleaner on then a wad with Brunox on just to protect the barrel till the next use.
    I am hoping to shoot it for the first time next week or the week after,as soon as I get the opportunity.

    Stuart

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    nr burnley ,lancashire
    Posts
    1,312
    Is it worth packing the charge out with semolina?
    i only pack the revolvers up to bring the ball higher up same as using a wad,
    and in single shot and rifles i use so theres no air gap/no moisture from my patch touching the bp load thats my reason s other will be there choice ,
    hope it helps
    wanted.......303 fl die

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Leicester
    Posts
    43

    First shoot

    Finally got to the range today to shoot my Flint Lock Mortimer Rifle for the first time.

    The weather was really blustery with occasional showers so had to shoot under cover at the 25m line, not the 50m line I wanted to use.

    Took 25 shots of 50 , 55 & 60 grns of Peter Starleys Medium Black Powder, as not sure what load to use with my 10 thou patch & 535 ball and fine powder for the pan.
    The shots were taken shooting off a rest.
    This is the first time I have used a Flint Lock so was quite nervous, I had done some research on the internet, but sometimes you get contradictory advise so had just see how things went.
    The first group of shots I fired with the 50grn in, the shots were a few inch's lower than were I was aiming and were over to the right. So I made a small adjustment to the front sight to bring the shots back to the left.
    I had a couple of Flash in the Pans with no ignition. Worked out you need to get the powder in the pan closer to the Vent Hole.
    The second group of shots with 55grn in was a slightly tighter group but still a couple of inch's low.
    The third group with 60grn in was a tighter group still (see photo) but still about an inch lower to where I was aiming.
    The Rifle has a really nice trigger and has a heavy barrel so even with 60grn in there is not a lot of recoil. The open sights have a very fine view.
    I only used two Flints, the first one blunted after about 10 shots. The second was still going strong after 15 shots.
    I need to get a better pair of pliers so as I can Knapp the Flint to keep the edge sharp when it starts to fail.
    Firing a Flint Lock Rifle for the first time was great fun. You see the flash from the pan when you pull the trigger and then a split second later the main charge in the Rifle goes off.
    It takes a little bit longer to shoot than my Parker Hale Enfield Rifle, because you have to wipe the pan down and make sure the Vent Hole is clear after each shot. I swabbed the barrel down after about 8 shots each time.
    The Rifle is pretty accurate, I'm sure with more practice I will get better with it.
    I think the Rifle needs 60grn for shooting at the 25m line, will probably need 70 or 75 grn to shoot at the 50m line.
    Cleaning the Rifle was easy, remove the ramrod put it on half cock, tap out the two wedges with a brass drift and the barrel just lifts up and off the stock (has a metal hook that goes into the metal tang block at the rear of the barel.) Used a mop with a bucket of hot soapy water to pull the water up and down the barrel, ran a couple of patch's with Muzzle Magic on, then a clean couple of patch's before a patch with Brunox to lube the barrel.The Vent Hole unscrews easily for a drop of lube. Went back together easily enough.
    Daniel Day-Lewis (Last of the Mohicans) here I come, wonder if his "Silk" Patch's "for an extra 50 yards" really works?

    Stuart


    http://imgur.com/a/ghC2V

    http://imgur.com/a/vLReH
    Last edited by Frag Muppet; 03-08-2017 at 04:14 PM.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    3,519
    I'm glad you enjoyed it. I told you they were addictive.

    Thanks for letting us know.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    chelford
    Posts
    546

    Vent hole

    Try putting a pin made from stiff wire in the vent hole.shape it into a "p" .
    You will get better results with Swiss powder.
    Kranks and homemade powders are full of impurities and will burn inconsistently.
    Use lead Instead of leather as the flint chatters down the face when leather is used.
    I used to get 50 ignition's before changing flints.Also I used Swiss 2 in the pan,No need for expensive fine powders.
    ALSO try using small loads. Believe it or not my friend uses 25 grain in his. Reason being you have to match the twist rate to the powder.too much powder will make the ball act as a Smoothbore and not catch the rifling.Start low and keep adding till your group gets smaller.
    Last edited by series2a; 06-08-2017 at 09:46 AM.
    Hw100. Hw97kt Hw45 Haenel 303 Match. Webley RATCATCHER V2, Kentuckian.45 cal BP Haenel 303, Webley & Scott Ranger. Webley Hawk Mk 3. BSA Airsporter VI, Webley Falcon.
    Anschutz 250. AirArms S410f. S400 classic.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    3,519
    Quote Originally Posted by series2a View Post
    Try putting a pin made from stiff wire in the vent hole.shape it into a "p" .
    You will get better results with Swiss powder.
    Kranks and homemade powders are full of impurities and will burn inconsistently.
    Use lead Instead of leather as the flint chatters down the face when leather is used.
    I used to get 50 ignition's before changing flints.Also I used Swiss 2 in the pan,No need for expensive fine powders.
    ALSO try using small loads. Believe it or not my friend uses 25 grain in his. Reason being you have to match the twist rate to the powder.too much powder will make the ball act as a Smoothbore and not catch the rifling.Start low and keep adding till your group gets smaller.
    I think the jury is out about using leather or lead for the flint.
    Personnaly I prefer leather, it works if it is tight. I found that the flint slipped when using lead. Each to his own.

    I use a thick hatpin for clearing the vent hole. You can also use tungsten wire that is inside some washing lines.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    chelford
    Posts
    546

    Leave pin in

    Quote Originally Posted by enfield2band View Post
    I think the jury is out about using leather or lead for the flint.
    Personnaly I prefer leather, it works if it is tight. I found that the flint slipped when using lead. Each to his own.

    I use a thick hatpin for clearing the vent hole. You can also use tungsten wire that is inside some washing lines.
    Leaving the pin in creates a void for spark expansion hence greater area to ignition.
    Leather has been proven in tests in US as inferior to soft lead .
    Hw100. Hw97kt Hw45 Haenel 303 Match. Webley RATCATCHER V2, Kentuckian.45 cal BP Haenel 303, Webley & Scott Ranger. Webley Hawk Mk 3. BSA Airsporter VI, Webley Falcon.
    Anschutz 250. AirArms S410f. S400 classic.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •