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Thread: Variation going in for first BP pistol!

  1. #1
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    Variation going in for first BP pistol!

    Despite having no interest in pistols over decade of firearm ownership ( mainly a hunter ) I allowed myself to be persuaded to try muzzle loading pistol shooting at my club and I have to grudgingly admit it is the most fun you can have on a range whilst remaining fully clothed.

    Even stranger is that I appear to have something approximating a talent for it, managing a score of 101/120 on a PL7 at 25 yards with a club Rogers and Spencer.

    I am entering my first competition this month and am in the process of putting together a variation form for this and one or two other bits.

    A chap at the club has a Euroarms Rogers and Spencer in good nick that he wants 150 quid for, seems a no-brainer?

    Any tips, observations or things to be aware of chaps?
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  2. #2
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    Welcome to the black side, and yes, there are a few things to watch out for.

    1. Remember when loading that it's POWDER first, THEN ball. A pound to a pinch of parrot poop says that one day you are going to do it the wrong way around. There are only two kinds of BP shooters where so-called 'dry-balling' is concerned - those who admit they've done it [like moi], and liars.

    2. Use loading phials, NOT directly from the spout of the powder flask - go to Wedgenock and try this and you'll be sent off instantly - it's generally prohibited in comps worldwide.

    3. Get used to getting very dirty, very fast.

    4. ALWAYS wear eye protection, even if you already wear eyeglasses.

    5. The R&S is my all-time favourite BP revolver from the grip POV - for me, nothing, not even my ROA, comes near. The one you mention sounds a bargain, but make certain that it does index correctly throughout the full range of rotation. Does it come with the right-sized ball mould? Or are you one of these 'bloated plutocrats' who can afford ready-made stuff?

    tac
    Several guns and trains.

  3. #3
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    1. Not managed yet but like shooting your chronograph, there's always time...

    2. Ah, why is this? People seem to do both with 777?

    3. Pah, if it doesn't need a course of antibiotics to deal with it's not dirty.

    4. I have ballistic spec spectacles as my normal eyeglasses, do you mean more than that?

    5. No mould, I would like to cast my own or ideally get someone to cast them for me whilst I drink coffee and have a smoke.*



    *big no-no when handling lead hence the need for the other guy
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  4. #4
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    Having shot BP once or twice myself I would recommend goggles over the top of specs even if they are impact rated. The goggles stop the bits of burning powder that seem to fly everywhere even if you are shooting percussion cap guns but when shooting flintlock or matchlock with a flashpan and your specs will get covered with black coals from the shower of sparks.
    BSA Super10 addict, various other BSA's, Original (Diana) Mod75's, Diana Mod5, HW80's, SAM 11K... The collection keeps expanding!

  5. #5
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    2. Ah, why is this? People seem to do both with 777? - 777 is NOT black powder, nor is it used in any form of MLAIC competition, which categorially states that BP only is permitted. 777 has a FAR higher flash temperature than BP - hence the name. It is not considered to be a Class 1 explosive like BP, but a flammable propellant, and can even be metered like regular nitro, according to Hodgdons loading manual

    4. I have ballistic spec spectacles as my normal eyeglasses, do you mean more than that? - Nope, if they are proper ballistic spectacles, then are good for protection against the inevitable BP cap fragments.

    5. No mould, I would like to cast my own or ideally get someone to cast them for me whilst I drink coffee and have a smoke. - I cast all my own bullet and ball simply because it's fun and cost-effective. Seeing the price of Pedersoli .451" ball at around 12 - 14/C just gets me annoyed - I can make them for about 1/8th of that.
    Several guns and trains.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rancidtom View Post
    Having shot BP once or twice myself I would recommend goggles over the top of specs even if they are impact rated. The goggles stop the bits of burning powder that seem to fly everywhere even if you are shooting percussion cap guns but when shooting flintlock or matchlock with a flashpan and your specs will get covered with black coals from the shower of sparks.

    Cheers tom, I have some god-awful yellow ones I bought a long time ago for clay shooting ages ago...
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacfoley View Post
    2. Ah, why is this? People seem to do both with 777? - 777 is NOT black powder, nor is it used in any form of MLAIC competition, which categorially states that BP only is permitted. 777 has a FAR higher flash temperature than BP - hence the name. It is not considered to be a Class 1 explosive like BP, but a flammable propellant, and can even be metered like regular nitro, according to Hodgdons loading manual

    4. I have ballistic spec spectacles as my normal eyeglasses, do you mean more than that? - Nope, if they are proper ballistic spectacles, then are good for protection against the inevitable BP cap fragments.

    5. No mould, I would like to cast my own or ideally get someone to cast them for me whilst I drink coffee and have a smoke. - I cast all my own bullet and ball simply because it's fun and cost-effective. Seeing the price of Pedersoli .451" ball at around 12 - 14/C just gets me annoyed - I can make them for about 1/8th of that.
    1. Ok, so it's fine to use a powder flask straight into a cylinder if one is using 777?

    4. Okey-dokey, I'll wear the bitch specs.

    5. I have bought some casting gear and will probably give it a go, need to do some research.

    Cheers guys.

    2
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Lord Flashheart View Post
    1. Ok, so it's fine to use a powder flask straight into a cylinder if one is using 777?
    I don't, nor do I know anybody else who does. Get the habit of phial-loading and you won't make a dwong of yourself if and when you go elsewhere to shoot and get funny looks, at least, or a 'b*gger orf moi range'.

    BP DOES go bang in a flask, a proven experience for some, one of whom posted the experience over on muzzleloadingforum.com last week. Around a quarter pound of FFg going off in your hand is quite an experience - enough, in a cannon, to send a one pound ball about half a mile.

    I'm not brave enough to prove that 777 can't be ignited by a stray spark in the bottom of the chamber.

    tac
    Several guns and trains.

  9. #9
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    You can buy the phials for next to nothing on the bay. Make yourself a little board with fifteen or so double rows of holes/indentations to load up with powder phial/ball. Most comps are 13 shots with ten to count though some are 15 shots. This way it's very easy to keep a track of how many you've fired. I only ever use proper BP. Kranks for playing with and the more expensive Swiss for comps and the smaller calibres.
    DesG
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  10. #10
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    Amir, if you decide to go for 777 it's worth reading the thread here regarding safety of loads
    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....light=Pressure

  11. #11
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    And DON'T SMOKE While handling exposed black powder.

    I thought I would mention it. Just in case.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by pnuk View Post
    Amir, if you decide to go for 777 it's worth reading the thread here regarding safety of loads
    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....light=Pressure
    An opposite reminder, Sir. Good post.

    tac
    Several guns and trains.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacfoley View Post
    I don't, nor do I know anybody else who does. Get the habit of phial-loading and you won't make a dwong of yourself if and when you go elsewhere to shoot and get funny looks, at least, or a 'b*gger orf moi range'.

    BP DOES go bang in a flask, a proven experience for some, one of whom posted the experience over on muzzleloadingforum.com last week. Around a quarter pound of FFg going off in your hand is quite an experience - enough, in a cannon, to send a one pound ball about half a mile.

    I'm not brave enough to prove that 777 can't be ignited by a stray spark in the bottom of the chamber.

    tac

    Good to know the etiquette and I will do it as it makes sense, thanks Zeyda!
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by DesG View Post
    You can buy the phials for next to nothing on the bay. Make yourself a little board with fifteen or so double rows of holes/indentations to load up with powder phial/ball. Most comps are 13 shots with ten to count though some are 15 shots. This way it's very easy to keep a track of how many you've fired. I only ever use proper BP. Kranks for playing with and the more expensive Swiss for comps and the smaller calibres.
    An explosives license is a possibility for the future if i get truly hooked but for now I think I'll just play around with 777 as it's so convenient overall.

    Is there much difference between Kranks' stuff and the Swiss?
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

  15. #15
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by pnuk View Post
    Amir, if you decide to go for 777 it's worth reading the thread here regarding safety of loads
    http://www.airgunbbs.com/showthread....light=Pressure
    Thanks PN.


    Funny you should mention that as I was recently involved in a minor kerfuffle on another forum that lead to me contacting Hodgdon themselves to find out about loading it as a BP substitute in ML pistols,

    Have a look at the email I got sent back to update that very good link: https://www.full-bore.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=31288
    "An infinite number of monkeys banging away at type writers for an infinite period of time will eventually reproduce Hamlet" Thanks to discussion forums we now know this to be untrue.

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