Walther rotex vs gamo phox

[mattylawrence]

Which would you choose out of these two. Both seem cracking packages for the price.

[secretagentmole]

The Phox has the added advantage of coming with a pump, hell buy it from Pellpax and the only thing they do not include is rabbits and pigeons!

The Phox is based on the Ultra, the trigger is a Gamo SAT, it works. I have one. Never got the pump, or the scope either, I had both so used them to get money off the package at the gun shop!

Had a Rotex, the first one was woefully underpowered, the second was ok, just did not feel right, the Phox does!

[mattylawrence]

The Phox has the added advantage of coming with a pump, hell buy it from Pellpax and the only thing they do not include is rabbits and pigeons!

The Phox is based on the Ultra, the trigger is a Gamo SAT, it works. I have one. Never got the pump, or the scope either, I had both so used them to get money off the package at the gun shop!

Had a Rotex, the first one was woefully underpowered, the second was ok, just did not feel right, the Phox does!

Saw the phox package today and couldn't believe the price. Been out of air gunning for about three years and on the lookout for a new rifle. Had a scorpion and an ultra in the past. But, had a lovely tx200, so in two minds what to go back to. Got to sell a couple of shotguns first, then the new rifle will be on the cards.

[secretagentmole]

The Phox is based on the Ultra SE. Uses a BSA magazine, but it is only available in .22!

[mattylawrence]

The Phox is based on the Ultra SE. Uses a BSA magazine, but it is only available in .22!

It's now out in. 177

[Lucky Luciano]

The Phox has the added advantage of coming with a pump, hell buy it from Pellpax and the only thing they do not include is rabbits and pigeons!

The Phox is based on the Ultra, the trigger is a Gamo SAT, it works. I have one. Never got the pump, or the scope either, I had both so used them to get money off the package at the gun shop!

Had a Rotex, the first one was woefully underpowered, the second was ok, just did not feel right, the Phox does!

What discount did you achieve removing the scope and pump from the package deal?

Cheers

[rancidtom]

Sorry to say the Gamo Phox shares very very few parts in common with the BSA Ultra or Ultra SE. They are completely different animals.

[markhb]

I have a gamo phox .22 bought from a member on here. I was in two minds as I have some quality weihrauch and air arm rifles and was not expecting too much. I did completely strip it down, plus the usual de-bur, polish all internals with the correct lubes applied, PLUS a £50 trigger from Charlie de tune in USA, and have to say I love the compact size, weight, and that trigger is now sooooo crisp it shoots very accurately, and is consistent over the chrono. All in it cost me about £330 for rifle and parts and I LOVE it. Well done who ever makes the dam thing.

[rancidtom]

I've tuned a few, fitted HuMa regulators and yes they can be made to be a very consistent gun, however in my opinion and (limited) experience they may have somewhat relaxed interpretation of Q.C. at Gamo, although the examples I have seen are likely to be the ones the owners weren't too happy with. As to what proportion of good to bad ones you get in a batch I have no idea.

[secretagentmole]

I've tuned a few, fitted HuMa regulators and yes they can be made to be a very consistent gun, however in my opinion and (limited) experience they may have somewhat relaxed interpretation of Q.C. at Gamo, although the examples I have seen are likely to be the ones the owners weren't too happy with. As to what proportion of good to bad ones you get in a batch I have no idea.

Well that will apply to all the BSA PCP rifles then, seeing as the Phox and Coyote are actually made by BSA in Birmingham!

[rancidtom]

Indeed it does.
Every company has the occasional or even regular crappy examples of their products.
Some products are poorly designed and no matter how much attention to assembly the workforce apply it still doesn't make it a good product.
I have tuned many BSA's, and many Gamo's both Brummie and Spanish assembled examples.
The fact remains that the Ultra SE is not a Gamo Phox even though it may have the same gauge on it and use the same magazine and fill probe.
Take a good close look. The air tube is different, the firing valve assembly is different, the hammer assembly is different, the breech block is different, the trigger... Oh! the stock stud is the same!
Does that make it a cheap Ultra SE?
No, it makes it a Gamo (made in Brum) Phox or Coyote or whatever other Gamo they are assembling in Brum this week...
In case you didn't know BSA have been owned by Gamo for many years. BSA build what Gamo tell them to build.

[secretagentmole]

Look at a new BSA Buccaneer then! Very very very similar! Like it or not, it is a BSA!

[rancidtom]

The BSA Buccaneer (the latest incarnation) is badged BSA using some Gamo parts. Those parts may or may not be made in Spain, even if the rifle is assembled in Spain it has a BSA badge rather than a Gamo badge, who cares? It is what it is. The badge doesn't make it shoot better or worse. It doesn't necessarily say that the design or the assembly quality is any better either. I am not privy to any information regards warranty return rates per guns sold, only BSA and Gamo know this.
I have tuned and repaired lots of rifles from many manufacturers and can point out poor workmanship, quality control or design issues with many manufacturers. Every manufacturer has made mistakes at some point in their lives. I stated my experience with Gamo Phox and Coyote.
The original statement made by you that I wished to clarify was: "The Phox is based on the Ultra" and then you followed it with "The Phox is based on the Ultra SE" neither of these statements are true, the Ultra and Ultra SE have very few interchangeable parts with the Phox or Coyote.
The Phox, Coyote and Buccaneer are cheaper rifles, built to a price bracket lower than the BSA Ultra and Scorpion models. They are not identical.
The Phox, Coyote and Buccaneer are all acceptable guns for the price but don't mislead people (unintentionally?) into thinking the Phox is a bargain Ultra SE.

[secretagentmole]

Tom, look, I know it is hard for you to accept, but the Phox and Coyote are made in Birmingham. BSA have even admitted it.
http://www.airgunshooting.co.uk/the-...phox-1-4751111

Copied from article below....

SPECIFICATIONS

Manufacturer: Gamo

Distributor: BSA Guns

Country of origin: England

Model: Phox

Type: Pre-charged pneumatic

Action: Multi-shot bolt action

Length: 39 3/4” (101cm)

See? Now they are not going to develop Gamo specific parts when it is made in Britain. Gamo do not make PCP rifles, they concentrate on spring or gas powered spring rifles. PCP rifles are left to the UK subsiduary, BSA! So, British gun, Spanish trigger.

[rancidtom]

Argue all you like about where it is made or designed, it's different to a BSA Ultra and different again to a BSA Ultra SE. Not as you stated earlier so stop talking around the subject as though you know anything at all about BSA's or the way they are made. It's a Gamo. Even if assembled in Birmingham under the roof of BSA (property of Gamo) it is badged a Gamo and not a BSA.
I will quote from your previous statement:

SPECIFICATIONS

Manufacturer: Gamo

Distributor: BSA Guns

Country of origin: England

Model: Phox

Type: Pre-charged pneumatic

Action: Multi-shot bolt action

Length: 39 3/4” (101cm)

The parts that the Gamo Phox are made from (specifically the all important valve assembly) don't fit BSA guns apart from the Buccaneer. Not even the air tube is interchangeable with the BSA line.

Now they are not going to develop Gamo specific parts when it is made in Britain. Gamo do not make PCP rifles, they concentrate on spring or gas powered spring rifles. PCP rifles are left to the UK subsiduary, BSA! So, British gun, Spanish trigger.

So who designed the new parts? It says Gamo on the label.
If you had ever stripped any of the guns you would know this simple fact: the parts are not identical or interchangeable with BSA Ultra or Ultra SE.
That is not shown in the advertising publicity. Now when you stop talking (typing) out of the back of your neck then you can maybe type some sense. The fact is you have no experience of stripping, rebuilding, modifying or tuning these guns. Your opinion that it is a cheap BSA Ultra/SE is unfounded.
As further proof (if any is needed) the HuMa regulator for the Ultra SE does not fit the Gamo Phox/Coyote, Huub had to design a new regulator to fit these Gamo guns ( which also fits the BSA Buccaneer).
As for

"Gamo don't make PCP rifles, they concentrate on spring or gas powered spring rifles. PCP rifles are left to the UK subsiduary, BSA!"

what's this then?
http://www.gamo.com/wp-content/uploa...ual-Chacal.pdf
Among other PCP models they are built in Barcelona, see "Technical information" on the above .pdf
Here's a parts diagram of the Coyote (the Phox in another guise)
http://www.gamo.com/wp-content/uploads/Coyote1.pdf
You may notice that it is in no way similar to the parts diagram of an Ultra or an Ultra SE. Can you spot the differences?
The Gamo Phox is a Gamo assembled in the Birmingham plant of the Barcelona Small Arms Company.
Now when you make statements in the future it might be worth researching/confirming the factual basis of such statements rather than quoting rumour or other misinformed opinions.
I should also like to add that I have not used a single unnecessary exclamation mark.