Used 12g cartridges wanted

[phil384]

I'm looking for used 12g 70mm cartridges please. Preferably all the same type. Willing to pay reasonable price and postage.

Many thanks

[enfield2band]

I'm looking for used 12g 70mm cartridges please. Preferably all the same type. Willing to pay reasonable price and postage.

Many thanks

If these are for reloading you need to try and find a suitable make/type.

Many of the cases are made from brittle plastic that splits on firing and cannot be re-crimped.
Some are more pliable and are reloadable.

[phil384]

Sheesh.....It's never simple is it

I Guess by sticking to well known makes I'll be OK? i.e. Hull, gamebore, lyalvale etc

[enfield2band]

Sheesh.....It's never simple is it

I Guess by sticking to well known makes I'll be OK? i.e. Hull, gamebore, lyalvale etc

If you don't mind paper cases Kranks do them by the 100 ready primed.

They can be reloaded a few times until the crimp mouth goes soft. The thing to watch for with paper cases
is small black burn marks like pinholes where the case meets the head.
If you see them scrap the case as it is on the verge of separating.

You could try clay shoots to find suitable cases,they usually have a problem disposing of them.
I know one shoot that has two jumbo bags spilling over with fired cases.

[DesG]

The easy option is to trim the star crimp off them and use a card and rolled turnover crimp. I load all my bp cartridges that way. The turnover tool fits in my pillar drill.

[phil384]

My intention was to buy new primed cases then re-use them. The guy at FES who I intend to get the kit from said the Lee Load-All II is not very good when it comes to crimping new cases and I was better off with used cases.

[pjinoz]

I'm looking for used 12g 70mm cartridges please. Preferably all the same type. Willing to pay reasonable price and postage.

Many thanks

If you want used 12G cases then:
1. Choose a brand that has reloading data published for them!
2. Do not mix case types.!
3. You cannot "work up a load for them" as pressures do NOT show up like rifle cases.
4. If you find a suitable PUBLISHED load then stick to it! For example changing primer type may cause adverse changes in pressure.
5. Is your gun proofed for such loads? How was your proof derived?
6. Do not be deceived into thinking "fast" loads will be of benefit; lead shot has the ballistic qualities of a heavy ping pong ball! E.g. if you don't believe this then
consider the extreme range of lead shot!
7. Some published factory data is "enthusiastic" to say the least.
8. All my reload data has been put through a pressure gun (piezo) and stacks up with my chrono data. No, I will not detail this as it suits my gun , choke and
pattern requirements. But I can tell what to look for.
9. Stay away from the higher pressure loads!!!!!!!!!!!!
10. And finally I still have about 10000 once fired Winchester AA 70mm cases; in my opinion the best for reloading (scarce as hens teeth now) and have just
finished reloading 4500 shells (32 gram @ 1250 f/s). Yes, I have seen factory ammo rated at high velocity but have you ever fired a one ounce load at 1500+
f/s (over the chrono?).
11. And finally please don't "screw around" altering cases (changing crimp to roll) UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PRESSURE DATA!

Cheers

pjinoz

[DesG]

If you want used 12G cases then:
1. Choose a brand that has reloading data published for them!
2. Do not mix case types.!
3. You cannot "work up a load for them" as pressures do NOT show up like rifle cases.
4. If you find a suitable PUBLISHED load then stick to it! For example changing primer type may cause adverse changes in pressure.
5. Is your gun proofed for such loads? How was your proof derived?
6. Do not be deceived into thinking "fast" loads will be of benefit; lead shot has the ballistic qualities of a heavy ping pong ball! E.g. if you don't believe this then
consider the extreme range of lead shot!
7. Some published factory data is "enthusiastic" to say the least.
8. All my reload data has been put through a pressure gun (piezo) and stacks up with my chrono data. No, I will not detail this as it suits my gun , choke and
pattern requirements. But I can tell what to look for.
9. Stay away from the higher pressure loads!!!!!!!!!!!!
10. And finally I still have about 10000 once fired Winchester AA 70mm cases; in my opinion the best for reloading (scarce as hens teeth now) and have just
finished reloading 4500 shells (32 gram @ 1250 f/s). Yes, I have seen factory ammo rated at high velocity but have you ever fired a one ounce load at 1500+
f/s (over the chrono?).
11. And finally please don't "screw around" altering cases (changing crimp to roll) UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PRESSURE DATA!

Cheers

pjinoz

Well that told me! I’ve been doing it wrong for the last forty years.

[GoodWILLHunting]

I've not long dumped a heap of spent 12g carts, mainly eley olympic blue.

I'll take better care of the next load I generate, likely to be a mix of fiocchi TT1's (67mm, that work well in my 3" chambered 525) and Eley Olympic Blue (70mm).

I've never re-loaded 12g, but I've been reloading .410 this last while and whilst these 12g carts aren't fancy high brass cases, IMO they'd take a reload especially if reforming the crimp on a press, but then I'm unsure of the type of original crimp on the TT1, because I don't have any left to check, the blues are a 6.

So if those are any good to you, let me know and I'll save what I can.

[sarge4318]

If you can get to East Herts before the recycle man we have half a dozen tonne bags full, loads of makes, sizes and bore. Take your pick.

[phil384]

Thanks guys

Yesterday as it happens I picked up about 400 used carts from a very helpful guy at Gatwick Clay School. Mostly Eley 1st 67mm but a good 100 or so 70mm Lyalvale English Sporter 70mm which I think are the ones I'll use.

I know the Eley 1st are a cheap cartridge. Does that mean they are less suitable for reloading?

As for load, I found a place called Folkestone Engineering Supplies who supply all the stuff I need and also give suggested loads. I'll be looking at the fibre wad, 34g No6. They suggest:

70mm Case
1.7g Maxan CSB3
4mm card
16mm Fibre Wad
34g #6 shot
Star Crimp

I guess if I go for the shorter 67mm carts I'll have to reduce the shot and powder?

[enfield2band]

If you want used 12G cases then:
1. Choose a brand that has reloading data published for them!
2. Do not mix case types.!
3. You cannot "work up a load for them" as pressures do NOT show up like rifle cases.
4. If you find a suitable PUBLISHED load then stick to it! For example changing primer type may cause adverse changes in pressure.
5. Is your gun proofed for such loads? How was your proof derived?
6. Do not be deceived into thinking "fast" loads will be of benefit; lead shot has the ballistic qualities of a heavy ping pong ball! E.g. if you don't believe this then
consider the extreme range of lead shot!
7. Some published factory data is "enthusiastic" to say the least.
8. All my reload data has been put through a pressure gun (piezo) and stacks up with my chrono data. No, I will not detail this as it suits my gun , choke and
pattern requirements. But I can tell what to look for.
9. Stay away from the higher pressure loads!!!!!!!!!!!!
10. And finally I still have about 10000 once fired Winchester AA 70mm cases; in my opinion the best for reloading (scarce as hens teeth now) and have just
finished reloading 4500 shells (32 gram @ 1250 f/s). Yes, I have seen factory ammo rated at high velocity but have you ever fired a one ounce load at 1500+
f/s (over the chrono?).
11. And finally please don't "screw around" altering cases (changing crimp to roll) UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PRESSURE DATA!

Cheers

pjinoz

Are the "AA" Winchester the ones that are tapered inside?
If so they need the special "AA" wad. (I'm sure you know this but the OP probably does not).

Phil384:-
As said, keep to the load data.
If there is a bit too much shot in a case adjust the wad column. Don't force it to crimp, it will swell the section of the case where the shot is.
If the crimp dips in, again adjust the wad column.

If you start with a soft wad do not swap if for a hard wad it will put your pressures up, and vice versa, if you start with a hard wad and swap it to a soft wad it will lower the pressure.
Don't play about with the wad column by trying different things, stick to recommended wads.
Many years ago a gun at a clay shoot blew up.
The gun and cartridges were sent to the proof house.
It turned out the the person that had reloaded the cartridges had put a layer of rice between the wads to act as a cushion.
When the gun was fired the pressure compressed the rice and forced it outwards against the barrel wall and it acted as a brake.

Reloading shotgun cartridges is safe if you stick to known data.

[pjinoz]

Are the "AA" Winchester the ones that are tapered inside?
If so they need the special "AA" wad. (I'm sure you know this but the OP probably does not).

Phil384:-
As said, keep to the load data.
If there is a bit too much shot in a case adjust the wad column. Don't force it to crimp, it will swell the section of the case where the shot is.
If the crimp dips in, again adjust the wad column.

If you start with a soft wad do not swap if for a hard wad it will put your pressures up, and vice versa, if you start with a hard wad and swap it to a soft wad it will lower the pressure.
Don't play about with the wad column by trying different things, stick to recommended wads.
Many years ago a gun at a clay shoot blew up.
The gun and cartridges were sent to the proof house.
It turned out the the person that had reloaded the cartridges had put a layer of rice between the wads to act as a cushion.
When the gun was fired the pressure compressed the rice and forced it outwards against the barrel wall and it acted as a brake.

Reloading shotgun cartridges is safe if you stick to known data.

Hi,
Yes they are the tapered AA cases and I do have plenty of suitable wads (circa 20K along with 6-700 kilos of lead shot). Again, just a short warning; PLEASE STICK EXACTLY TO REPUTABLE LOADS AND THAT INCLUDES THE CASE!!!! Also I strongly suggest that you also adhere to loads that have attached pressure data; in this day and age piezo is the way to go. Perusing pressure data loads you will often see very small increments in powder, shot weight primer type etc will often result in large spikes in pressure. Some years ago a friend of mine was reloading 1 1/4 ounce using some published load data (no names) which did not include pressure data. It was tested in a Webley lead slug pressure gun and nearly removed the yoke over the slug port. It was certainly in excess of 6 ton! Funny thing is when he complained to the powder manufacturer they "quietly" dropped this load. Curious ha ha.
Cheers
pjinoz

[phil384]

"When the gun was fired the pressure compressed the rice and forced it outwards against the barrel wall and it acted as a brake"

Rice wasn't part of my plan

Semolina, on the other hand........