Information for sellers

[Rob Edge]

Absolute rubbish!... No-one is forcing the seller to post the item!
The only thing getting the item in the post is the desire of the seller to obtain a sale.
Many start off preferring a F2F and who could blame them, but when no-one wants to drive over to Middle Dogdirt to collect it - the seller has 2 choices : withdraw the item and maybe try again later or accept an offer including postage.
Either way it's the sellers decision to post and the seller is responsible for the item until its reached the buyer.
This supported by law.

The only exceptions to this would be a clear acceptance in writing BEFOREHAND by the purchaser that any loss or damage would be theirs to bear or if the buyer arranged their own collection.

Correct. I might add that adequate insurance cover for the replacement or refund would be recommended because it is the sellers item until it is received and the purchaser is protected by law.

[Rapidnick]

I'm glad this has come up. I've often been amazed at adverts where the seller seems to assume that his item is SO desirable that a buyer will move heaven and earth to acquire it. Of course we all want the buyer to do everything. Pay first, drive to pick it up etc etc and that is what happens most of the time. In the case of heavy items and those of exceptional value travel to pick up is clearly the preferred option. However if you do post it is up to you to pack well and post by a method agreed by the buyer.
If it is any comfort I have posted and received hundreds of items over the years and-touch wood-I have never had any problems with items I have sent.

[lensman57]

I'm glad this has come up. I've often been amazed at adverts where the seller seems to assume that his item is SO desirable that a buyer will move heaven and earth to acquire it. Of course we all want the buyer to do everything. Pay first, drive to pick it up etc etc and that is what happens most of the time. In the case of heavy items and those of exceptional value travel to pick up is clearly the preferred option. However if you do post it is up to you to pack well and post by a method agreed by the buyer.
If it is any comfort I have posted and received hundreds of items over the years and-touch wood-I have never had any problems with items I have sent.

A round trip from Manchester to London area and back is the equivalent of 10 gallons of petrol with all the mororway hold ups. That will easily add another £55.00 to the cost of the item plus the fact that nowadays unless a peson is well retired there is really no such thing as a weekend so finding a suitable time to arrange the viewing and the sale is another obstacle. I really have no solution to this TBH but I am just highlighting the difficulties of getting from A to B.
I have a small lathe that I am going to sell but even this small lathe with all its accessories weights more than 40 Kilos so pick up really is the only choice .

A.G

[CrystalPistal]

Good debate but lets agree to disagree not gonna rant on but the only consumer law that applies to private sales is "as described" and if some heavy handed numpty smashed your expensive rifle or whatever you wouldnt be pleased and as for the cost of fuel blah blah ....pshhhhh, if you want it go get it, if not dont.... the seller is not responsible for the buyers logistical problems

[LESS THAN FORTUITOUS KENNETH]

I'm always wary of using the post either to buy or sell. It's not the money if it goes missing, it's the hassle involved. If it's a very long way, I always suggest a meet halfway. I've done this several times. Often though, you just have to take a chance and use post if it's something you really want. I've missed many a gun because the seller would not post, but eventually, something always turns up.

Regarding the law. What if you buy off a private seller on evilbay and you don't receive the goods? I'm sure there is a way you can get your money back (via paypal if you use that method of payment). So if you buy a gun on here and use paypal to pay, I'm sure you should be covered and get your payment back off paypal. Or is it not covered if you send it "family and friends"?

[harvey_s]

Regarding the law. What if you buy off a private seller on evilbay and you don't receive the goods? I'm sure there is a way you can get your money back (via paypal if you use that method of payment). So if you buy a gun on here and use paypal to pay, I'm sure you should be covered and get your payment back off paypal. Or is it not covered if you send it "family and friends"?

I'm surprised this has come up given the amount of coverage its had on here...

PayPal does indeed cover the seller for egay purchases - BUT you cannot buy guns there and PayPal says you shouldn't use their service to purchase them privately - so they are specifically NOT covered.

If you send any money as a 'gift' to friends or family then its treated as that - i.e. you haven't bought goods or services therefore there is no comeback as there was nothing to get lost or broken

[LESS THAN FORTUITOUS KENNETH]

I'm surprised this has come up given the amount of coverage its had on here...

PayPal does indeed cover the seller for egay purchases - BUT you cannot buy guns there and PayPal says you shouldn't use their service to purchase them privately - so they are specifically NOT covered.

If you send any money as a 'gift' to friends or family then its treated as that - i.e. you haven't bought goods or services therefore there is no comeback as there was nothing to get lost or broken

Sorry for the confusion. When I was talking about buying off evilbay, I meant anything, not guns in particular.

[Rob Edge]

Good debate but lets agree to disagree not gonna rant on but the only consumer law that applies to private sales is "as described" and if some heavy handed numpty smashed your expensive rifle or whatever you wouldnt be pleased and as for the cost of fuel blah blah ....pshhhhh, if you want it go get it, if not dont.... the seller is not responsible for the buyers logistical problems

Remind me never to buy from you then. For your information you could still be sued if the goods where not as described or fit for purpose even if it was a private sale. It would be a civil case and would result in a CCJ.

[CrystalPistal]

Remind me never to buy from you then. For your information you could still be sued if the goods where not as described or fit for purpose even if it was a private sale. It would be a civil case and would result in a CCJ.

Not a problem no need to be personal tho have sold several items to people who have been very pleased and yes they were packed as securely as possible but they were relatively low cost items, the Prosport is still in the rack because i wont post it and an Ultimate Sporter was sold FTF but you obviously have not read the entire thread i did say that the as described rule applies and if it gets damaged it will probably still be fit for purpose unless its a write off or lost and the thread starter did say about the "posted at buyers risk aspect" of your so called contract so if that was the contract why are people flaming other people for sticking to their agreed contract sheesh loads of contracts

[harvey_s]

Not a problem no need to be personal tho have sold several items to people who have been very pleased and yes they were packed as securely as possible but they were relatively low cost items, the Prosport is still in the rack because i wont post it and an Ultimate Sporter was sold FTF but you obviously have not read the entire thread i did say that the as described rule applies and if it gets damaged it will probably still be fit for purpose unless its a write off or lost and the thread starter did say about the "posted at buyers risk aspect" of your so called contract so if that was the contract why are people flaming other people for sticking to their agreed contract sheesh loads of contracts

.... understood the bit about not posting the Prosport and selling the U. Sporter.
Next bit is confusing though - say you did post something that got lost...
Would you refund the purchaser the whole price paid - even if that was greater than the compensation you got from Royal Mail?

[charub]

A round trip from Manchester to London area and back is the equivalent of 10 gallons of petrol with all the mororway hold ups. That will easily add another £55.00 to the cost of the item plus the fact that nowadays unless a peson is well retired there is really no such thing as a weekend so finding a suitable time to arrange the viewing and the sale is another obstacle. I really have no solution to this TBH but I am just highlighting the difficulties of getting from A to B.
I have a small lathe that I am going to sell but even this small lathe with all its accessories weights more than 40 Kilos so pick up really is the only choice .

A.G

Paletforce will be able to move the lathe. They will take anything that fits on a pallet. Last time I moved something, it weighed over 100kg and cost me £70

[speedthing]

Really for an expensive Air Rifle your looking to send through an RFD to be safe. Think the last time i sent RFD to RFD it was £25 and the guy had to pay £25 his end so it cost him £50 in total.
The last time i bought a Rife i drove to Reading for a really nice AA S400 nearly new paid £200 for it and was well worth the 80 mile round trip.

[bozzer]

Only skimmed through the thread.

Surely it's down to any agreement by the seller/buyer?

If someone is selling with posted as an option then they must have some responsibility to pack it well and do everything they can to make sure it arrives with the seller. They are offering posted in the original advert.

If someone is saying they prefer face to face but they will post and pack it well but it's at the buyer's risk, then that's then up to the buyer. If the buyer chooses to still buy the item and pay for post and it goes missing or arrives damaged, then surely it isn't right that the buyer then starts claiming that it's the seller's problem.

If someone advertises as face to face only, but gets pestered by a buyer to post it ( this happens ), then the buyer is having a laugh if they then want the seller to sort it out if it's gone missing.

I'd sell like that. Ad reads something like ... "Prefer face to face so the item can be checked over and tested". If a buyer contacted me and said they were very interested but insist that it's posted then I'd agree to that as long as they paid for the postage and accepted that it was being posted at their risk if it goes missing or gets damaged.

The seller does have to make an effort to pack it well and that can probably hit grey areas. I bought a camera off that bay place and it arrived loose in a plastic bag with the case cracked. Seller refused a refund as he claimed it was adequate and in good condition when he posted it.

[LESS THAN FORTUITOUS KENNETH]

The seller is still the person who has done the posting. It is he who has the tracking info slip from the PO. It is his responsibility to chase it up as to why the parcel HE sent has not been delivered.. I can imagine the post office's reaction if the buyer rolled up with no proof of posting other than a scribbled tracking number! The receipt from the PO would be needed, and the seller has that.

[bighit]

Only skimmed through the thread.

Surely it's down to any agreement by the seller/buyer?

If someone is selling with posted as an option then they must have some responsibility to pack it well and do everything they can to make sure it arrives with the seller. They are offering posted in the original advert.

If someone is saying they prefer face to face but they will post and pack it well but it's at the buyer's risk, then that's then up to the buyer. If the buyer chooses to still buy the item and pay for post and it goes missing or arrives damaged, then surely it isn't right that the buyer then starts claiming that it's the seller's problem.

If someone advertises as face to face only, but gets pestered by a buyer to post it ( this happens ), then the buyer is having a laugh if they then want the seller to sort it out if it's gone missing.

I'd sell like that. Ad reads something like ... "Prefer face to face so the item can be checked over and tested". If a buyer contacted me and said they were very interested but insist that it's posted then I'd agree to that as long as they paid for the postage and accepted that it was being posted at their risk if it goes missing or gets damaged.

The seller does have to make an effort to pack it well and that can probably hit grey areas. I bought a camera off that bay place and it arrived loose in a plastic bag with the case cracked. Seller refused a refund as he claimed it was adequate and in good condition when he posted it.

im sure there was a post on here a number of years back where the seller posted a rifle in a BINBAG