BASC and the airgun consultation

[Jerry Cornelius]

I tend to think whatever we do or say will count for nothing. We all know that the gun crime problem in this country is all our fault. The picture will be painted and decisions made regardless os what we do. The joke is it will have naff all effect on the figures because criminals don't tend to have legal firearms anyway.

If you write in, and they ignore it, and take your guns away, it’s their fault

If you don’t write in, so they don’t even need to ignore it, and take your guns away, it’s your fault

Your choice I guess.

[severnsider]

Is there an actual consultation paper ?

If we don’t all reply to this we will only have ourselves to blame when more restrictions come in.

Cats Protection are up to 78,800 signatures on their petition for air rifle licenses this morning

We snooze, we loose. Simple as that

I did e-mail the Home Office last week and asked for a copy of the consultation paper but have had no response at all. I suspect that there is NO paper, but instead the consultation will be limited to consideration of issues (whether or not rational, valid or honest) raised by "affected families", the so-called and largely-anonymous "Gun Control Network" and the "Cats Protection" crowd.

I am at a loss to understand why the Home Office have not responded to my perfectly polite e-mailed request; perhaps David (BASC) or Terry D may be better informed as to whether a consultation document exists or not?

[angrybear]

I did e-mail the Home Office last week and asked for a copy of the consultation paper but have had no response at all. I suspect that there is NO paper, but instead the consultation will be limited to consideration of issues (whether or not rational, valid or honest) raised by "affected families", the so-called and largely-anonymous "Gun Control Network" and the "Cats Protection" crowd.

I am at a loss to understand why the Home Office have not responded to my perfectly polite e-mailed request; perhaps David (BASC) or Terry D may be better informed as to whether a consultation document exists or not?

This is where you put your point of view for them to WRITE the paper, surely it's not that hard to grasp

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/h...pon-regulation

[severnsider]

This is where you put your point of view for them to WRITE the paper, surely it's not that hard to grasp

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/h...pon-regulation

I have already written in with my point of view. It's the "topics in the review" which I think could be spelled out better, but thank you so much anyway for your considerate and helpful response. Have you a part-time job at the Home Office by any chance?

[angrybear]

I have already written in with my point of view. It's the "topics in the review" which I think could be spelled out better, but thank you so much anyway for your considerate and helpful response. Have you a part-time job at the Home Office by any chance?

The article in the link lists the topics under consideration.

Sadly I don't have time for the Home Office, the Diplomatic Corps takes up too much time

[Rob Edge]

You can't use that excuse. The Scottish government listens to no one.

Neither do the English government or we would still have pistols, Brococks etc etc. All I have said is that I am reseigned to the fact that changes are coming.

[lensman57]

This cloaked softly softly approach taken up by the government is to make sure that once the ' ban ' comes in there is no way of challenging it. The Scottish government approach was crude and ' umdemocratic ', on the other hand these guys we are dealing with are slick operators.

If indeed they wished to tighten up any loose ends in the existing legislation the logical approach would have been to ask people who use ' firearms ' , which air rifle is classed as one,, in their pusuit of going about their legitimate lawful business and not open it to the public, cat lovers, tree huggers, bunny feeders, gun haters etc.

This is already heavily loaded against us to start with. The results are quite predictable. Still we should write to our MPs and the people who are supposed to be conducting this ' review '. It would be nice to know the views of the importers and the manufacturers and their responses to the proposed review. I have a funny feeling that money talks and their views carry much more weight than all of us air and powder burning gun users put together. What does our Terry think about all this?


A.G

[danco1987]

If licencing or a ban was on the cards, why would they be asking about security when that would be be dealt with as part of a licencing scheme?
I hope that the result of this review will purely be a confirmation of existing laws or strictening of the storage and security laws, but can't see licencing being suggested in any way, shape or form as it would kill the sport and industry and be an expensive, administrative nightmare. I'm still writing to the HO and going to keep it as concise and short as possible mainly listing facts and figures as I have a feeling, these won't be reviewed thoroughly by the junior workers at the HO

[bighit]

If licencing or a ban was on the cards, why would they be asking about security when that would be be dealt with as part of a licencing scheme?
I hope that the result of this review will purely be a confirmation of existing laws or strictening of the storage and security laws, but can't see licencing being suggested in any way, shape or form as it would kill the sport and industry and be an expensive, administrative nightmare. I'm still writing to the HO and going to keep it as concise and short as possible mainly listing facts and figures as I have a feeling, these won't be reviewed thoroughly by the junior workers at the HO

As I have quoted before. Up here in Scotland the safe storage is the same regulations as is in force at present. There was no change.

No cabinet required. Imagine if you have 20 airguns or as some on here in excess of 100. That's going to be some size of a cabinet.

[lensman57]

If licencing or a ban was on the cards, why would they be asking about security when that would be be dealt with as part of a licencing scheme?
I hope that the result of this review will purely be a confirmation of existing laws or strictening of the storage and security laws, but can't see licencing being suggested in any way, shape or form as it would kill the sport and industry and be an expensive, administrative nightmare. I'm still writing to the HO and going to keep it as concise and short as possible mainly listing facts and figures as I have a feeling, these won't be reviewed thoroughly by the junior workers at the HO

Call me a cynic if you wish but the trouble and expense of conducting a review do not correlate with finally making a few suggestions as to the safe storage of the guns.
I already have 8 air rifles and 5 air pistols of different shapes or sizes and well before all this came around was looking to find a suitable cabinet to house them in. I can not find one despite some of them being marketed for 8~10 rifles. A bulky scoped air rifle is actually much larger and longer than even a beefy CF.

Having looked at the recent activities of some those fringe anti gun/hunting pressure groups convinces me that other agenda is at work here. As I said the approach is softly softly. I hope I am wrong, for all our sakes.

As to our sport, in one of my discussions with Terry Doe he kindly reminded me how small and unifluential the air gun community is. That is why we have no clout to influence decisions. No one really cares what we think I regret to say.

Only if these guys had just watched a few amateur videos on U tube about FT/HFT events and how peacefully, professionally and safely most people go about pursuing and enjoying their sport none of these onslaughts or reviews on air gunners would have come about.
Instead they have concentrated on a handful of gut wrenching accidents leading to loss of life and the activities of a few individuals who will never abide by any regulation or legislation to paint all air gunners and our sport as dangerous and a menace to public safety.


A.G

[danco1987]

We really need to respond in real numbers to this review to have any clout. Only when the government realise the numbers (number of voters) and the amount of money spent in our industry (and shooting as a whole) will they listen. Surely businesses and clubs, as well as the 1000s of members across multiple forums can have an some influence? The only reason to listen to the antis is because they're voters. So why don't we show them how many of us there are?
I think it's worth doing a poll on here whereby everyone who has sent their response off votes so we can get an idea of how many positive airgun responses from this forum have arrived in the HO's inbox. And when we need to push for more members to do so. I'm not on any Facebook groups, but surely it's worth posting on them too to boost numbers.
Has anyone got any contacts in the industry (Airarms, Brocock etc)? They can fire off figures, sales, employee numbers etc to show the value of the industry and how a knee jerk reaction to a couple of tragic accidents against a back drop of falling offences involving airguns, is really not the answer.

[danco1987]

As to our sport, in one of my discussions with Terry Doe he kindly reminded me how small and unifluential the air gun community is. That is why we have no clout to influence decisions. No one really cares what we think I regret to say

I don't understand this myself and will be arguing that airguns are vital entry level "firearms" for beginners to safely learn how to shoot and enter the sport. Without this unlicenced form of shooting, so many newcomers will simply not start shooting and shooting in the UK, instead of being a multi billion pound industry, will strink greatly.

[MikeHW45]

I have written my piece to the home office regardless of whether or not it will help influence things. As stated below if no-one does anything we cant complain. If people don't voice their opinion they may as well not have one. This is my letter to them.

Dear Sir/madam,

I am writing to you to express my un-biased view with regards to the law and regulation of air rifles and pistols. I am myself a keen airgun shooter be it from garden plinking to club shooting. I personally feel that the requirements for keeping said items from the reach of children is currently adequate and it is all down to a matter of common sense. The problem is although the majority of responsible airgun shooters will use this common sense and good practise there are a minority as with everything who will not. These people will generally not be genuine collectors, shooters or enthusiasts but a handful that have the airguns for the sake of having them or people that own them for the wrong reasons ie: vandalism, illegal use etc.
With regards to licensing such as the scheme in place in Scotland, while this will inevitably reduce the number of people in possession of airguns those people will majoritably be honest shooters that can no longer be bothered with their hobby due to the extra hassle involved. Also persons in possession of airguns for the wrong reasons will no doubt carry out a crime whether an airgun is available to them or whether they have to use another item to commit the crime.
Also if you look into the statistics on personal harm and injury with regards to other sports, hobbies and daily activities it will be obvious that air weapon injuries are a drop in the ocean in comparison. My point is that I feel it unnecessary to once again penalise the innocent person for another persons wrong doing as it will achieve nothing other than unwanted expense, hassle and yet more drain on government resources.

[redrobbie]

Here is a recent case from my neck of the woods where this guy was swat teamed by armed officers http://www.shetlandtimes.co.uk/2017/...aid-foula-home

[lensman57]

I don't understand this myself and will be arguing that airguns are vital entry level "firearms" for beginners to safely learn how to shoot and enter the sport. Without this unlicenced form of shooting, so many newcomers will simply not start shooting and shooting in the UK, instead of being a multi billion pound industry, will strink greatly.

I agree 100%, but where are the listening ears?

A.G