Not a Giffard, suspiciously like a Greener though

[Mark D]

So....we need to know calibre and if the barrel has been sleeved - over to you Clank

[Benelli B76]

Looks like he has turned down the barrel diameter near the breach to allow room for the CO2 cylinder to screw in.

Baz

[oldcurmudgeon]

Correction that should read as Les Wesley.

[chieffool]

So....we need to know calibre and if the barrel has been sleeved - over to you Clank

Dear CLANK
Is this yours by the way? Just intrigued to find out more, and 'see' some more pics on the internals. Either way, many thanks for posting - seriously lovely.

[Clank]

So, now that I have had time to think about this, a Martini action it is. Almost certainly 577/.450 cal as it is unlikely to have been .303. They were Lee Enfields in the main.
I have taken some more pictures and first off, it is definitely .22 cal, the loading tap measures out at a little over as you can see in this picture below and the picture below that:




These next pictures, apart from showing the beautiful brown patina, also show how the action has been modified. It is clear, now that I have looked at pictures and diagrams of the Martini actions, that the CO2 cylinder attaches where the barrel would have been and the barrel and new breech block are on the top:




I have seen something like this and it was by Leslie Westley, it was a single barrel shotgun (I have a pic somewhere but it is from back in the day when we used Instamatic cameras and sent the films off at the Chemist!) I will dig it out and get the scanner out.

This is the barrel business end and it is a full tapered barrel, purpose built for the job:



Here is a view from the "underneath" with the for-end clipped off, nicely done and you can see how the barrel has been machined to accommodate the CO2 cylinder:



And yes, it is one of my collection. Only the weird and wonderful here

[le frelon]

Just wondering if this might not be an example of Martin Herrick's work. On here several years ago, 2014 and possibly later, posted as the 'Stockmaker' I think.
Any one else remember him?
This is exactly the sort of thing he makes. Usually a rimfire/centre fire converted to C02. The barrel repositioning and the Giffard mechanism, (he bought lots of Giffard bits at an antiques market, very cheaply, in Hungary. As you do!) have his name all over them.
Will try to dig out some photos that he sent me of one he made if I can remember which computer and where I left them!
A particularly well made pistol conversion also springs to mind with amazing finishes to the metal work.

There were several threads on the legality of what these would be classed as when he offered one for sale.

Or I could be wrong of course!!

Carl

[le frelon]

Addendum - look at vintageairguns.co.uk under 'mystery rifle' that is one of his based on the Paul Betts pneumatic/ butt reservoir and also search for 'Bittner', the pistol I was going on about.

Carl

[chieffool]

Just wondering if this might not be an example of Martin Herrick's work. On here several years ago, 2014 and possibly later, posted as the 'Stockmaker' I think.
Any one else remember him?
This is exactly the sort of thing he makes. Usually a rimfire/centre fire converted to C02. The barrel repositioning and the Giffard mechanism, (he bought lots of Giffard bits at an antiques market, very cheaply, in Hungary. As you do!) have his name all over them.
Will try to dig out some photos that he sent me of one he made if I can remember which computer and where I left them!
A particularly well made pistol conversion also springs to mind with amazing finishes to the metal work.

There were several threads on the legality of what these would be classed as when he offered one for sale.

Or I could be wrong of course!!

Carl

Carl - I have to admit to being really intrigued as to what some of Mr Herrick's conversions look like. Did you manage to find any of the photos you were referring to?

I love the whole concept of conversion, and repurposing. That's why this beautiful rifle kindly shared by clank has got me thinking about how or where i would even begin to build something like this.

If you don't know Theo Hegman's work - a man whose rifles are all 'ONE-OFF' unique builds - then check out the link below. His are all quite extraordinary:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/luft.htm

He also very kindly includes expanded details on each of the examples here (the expanded links are usually 'blue text')....
....with outline design drawings to show you how they work. I really like his work which is mostly pcp, although he does include one called The CHIPMUNK which is one of the few 'springers' he has shown here. Two springs... innovative design... just gorgeous:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/munk.htm

[chieffool]

I really like his work which is mostly pcp, although he does include one called The CHIPMUNK which is one of the few 'springers' he has shown here. Two springs... innovative design... just gorgeous:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/munk.htm

Whoops.... correction: NOT a springer.

[Geezer]

Carl - I have to admit to being really intrigued as to what some of Mr Herrick's conversions look like. Did you manage to find any of the photos you were referring to?

I love the whole concept of conversion, and repurposing. That's why this beautiful rifle kindly shared by clank has got me thinking about how or where i would even begin to build something like this.

If you don't know Theo Hegman's work - a man whose rifles are all 'ONE-OFF' unique builds - then check out the link below. His are all quite extraordinary:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/luft.htm

He also very kindly includes expanded details on each of the examples here (the expanded links are usually 'blue text')....
....with outline design drawings to show you how they work. I really like his work which is mostly pcp, although he does include one called The CHIPMUNK which is one of the few 'springers' he has shown here. Two springs... innovative design... just gorgeous:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/munk.htm

That guy's stuff is great, isn't it? I even like the ones that I don't like, if that makes sense. Amazing some of the craftsmen working in this little world.

[ccdjg]

[QUOTE although he does include one called The CHIPMUNK which is one of the few 'springers' he has shown here. Two springs... innovative design... just gorgeous:
http://www.hegmans.de/theo/munk.htm[/QUOTE]


Can it really be a springer? His cross section is not very informative, and I just can't see how you can get 50 joules energy from a springer with such a short cocking lever and cocking stroke.

[Geezer]

So, now that I have had time to think about this, a Martini action it is. Almost certainly 577/.450 cal as it is unlikely to have been .303. They were Lee Enfields in the main.

Minor point of gunspotter trivia.

There were a lot more Martini-Enfields than most people think. At least a couple of hundred thousand, probably more, mostly converted from M-Hs. They did unglamorous duty in non-infantry roles, reserve units, Cadet forces, etc. Some bits of the Indian armed forces were still issued them in WW2.

The Martini-Enfield (and its rarer first iteration, the Martini-Metford) is Britain's forgotten service rifle.

Of course, everyone wants the M-H, not the Enfield variant. No licence now required, and if you are like me you watched Zulu on TV every Boxing Day growing up. "Front rank, FIRE! ......"

[Hsing-ee]

Minor point of gunspotter trivia.

There were a lot more Martini-Enfields than most people think. At least a couple of hundred thousand, probably more, mostly converted from M-Hs. They did unglamorous duty in non-infantry roles, reserve units, Cadet forces, etc. Some bits of the Indian armed forces were still issued them in WW2.

The Martini-Enfield (and its rarer first iteration, the Martini-Metford) is Britain's forgotten service rifle.

Of course, everyone wants the M-H, not the Enfield variant. No licence now required, and if you are like me you watched Zulu on TV every Boxing Day growing up. "Front rank, FIRE! ......"

The Martini is a brilliant design for a military rifle for raw recruits. Single shot, so deliberate fire only, and so much safer than a semi-auto, a simple mechanism for jam-free firing, and takes about 5 minutes to train in its basic use. Strong and sturdy for use in hand-to-hand.

If there is an 'emergency' and the population must be quickly armed to drive off invading hordes this rifle would be the best thing, not a modern assault rifle, to issue to the local militias. I think it would be great in 7.62x39 for cheapness, knockdown power and the tapered case would make extraction certain. Grannies and schoolboys could wield it to great effect.

[Geezer]

The Martini is a brilliant design for a military rifle for raw recruits. Single shot, so deliberate fire only, and so much safer than a semi-auto, a simple mechanism for jam-free firing, and takes about 5 minutes to train in its basic use. Strong and sturdy for use in hand-to-hand.

If there is an 'emergency' and the population must be quickly armed to drive off invading hordes this rifle would be the best thing, not a modern assault rifle, to issue to the local militias. I think it would be great in 7.62x39 for cheapness, knockdown power and the tapered case would make extraction certain. Grannies and schoolboys could wield it to great effect.

The experience of the Volkssturm suggests that untrained personnel with rubbish weapons are at most a minor irritant to a professional army. Their most effective weapon was not even a gun - the Panzerfaust.

If you need to arm folks quickly with a vaguely useful weapon, in the absence of an established mass-production arms industry, you want something like a Sten. Witness the various SMGs turned out during the Yugoslav civil wars of the 1990s.

AKs would be better.