Period Scopes?

[45flint]

Just made a purchase of two older scopes (1940’s, 1950’s?) on the bay here. Just want to match them up to the same vintage rifles for fun and see how they perform. These would be for my vintage pumpers since springs would kill them I’m sure. These are so cheap here because they are taken off old 22 rifles and sold by the gross.

Period scopes for spring guns would be interesting but I’m at a total loss here. Don’t know when they started making scopes that would stand up to the jolt.

[chieffool]

That sounds oddly illogical. Unless they are more toy like (ie plastic) I would have assumed most scopes of that period were more likely to be made for firearm (eg .22 LR, and larger calibres) than specifically made for air rifle

[DSidelever]

You live in the country most likely to have some FABULOUS period scopes at reasonable prices!

However not many are 'Airgun Scopes'.

I believe they (early US riflescopes) would be a fantastic area to invest in,

most "early optical" stuff has a wide appeal.

As said earlier most of the 50-60's airgun scopes where pretty poor quality (esp. the Boxed with Rifle type).

Of course later products from names like Hakko, RWS, some 'Doc Beeman' rebadged jobs etc. where very good (tending more to the 80's though).

[Mach 1.5]

I love the old period scopes and finding them to match stuff in my collection is great fun. I managed to get a Hertel & Reuss scope the other week which I have been after for 28 years !! and yes well worth the wait. Mach 1.5

[45flint]

That sounds oddly illogical. Unless they are more toy like (ie plastic) I would have assumed most scopes of that period were more likely to be made for firearm (eg .22 LR, and larger calibres) than specifically made for air rifle

Yes they would be made for 22 LR but I have some vintage mounts that attach to the tubes of old pumpers. To use an example, my Crosman 108 was made in 1949 and is made with a military style. There were many military rifles with scopes during that time frame. Scoping a 108 with a 1940-50s scope doesn’t look odd and could have been done then. My goal is really to see what accuracy these rifle are capable of. Don’t know that I will keep them on? But these old scope are blued and kind of fun, and cheap!

[chieffool]

Yes they would be made for 22 LR but I have some vintage mounts that attach to the tubes of old pumpers. To use an example, my Crosman 108 was made in 1949 and is made with a military style. There were many military rifles with scopes during that time frame. Scoping a 108 with a 1940-50s scope doesn’t look odd and could have been done then. My goal is really to see what accuracy these rifle are capable of. Don’t know that I will keep them on? But these old scope are blued and kind of fun, and cheap!

I can't fault your objective at all. I think your approach is great...
...just saying I don't think you need to worry about 'rattling them apart'.

What type of order of magnitude are they typically?

[45flint]

I can't fault your objective at all. I think your approach is great...
...just saying I don't think you need to worry about 'rattling them apart'.

What type of order of magnitude are they typically?

4X and 6X were very typical all are 3/4 inch straight tubes. The coolest one would be a Weaver 330 which was 3X developed in the 1930’s. So well made the Army bought them up during WW2 to make sniper rifles. Given that fact these are so collectable they are more serious money. The other Weavers you can get for $20+. I assumed any of these would be destroyed by a spring gun? I have a BSA MK2 with ring mounts but just didn’t think I could put these on that?

[Lakey]

4X and 6X were very typical all are 3/4 inch straight tubes. The coolest one would be a Weaver 330 which was 3X developed in the 1930’s. So well made the Army bought them up during WW2 to make sniper rifles. Given that fact these are so collectable they are more serious money. The other Weavers you can get for $20+. I assumed any of these would be destroyed by a spring gun? I have a BSA MK2 with ring mounts but just didn’t think I could put these on that?

Steel bodied Weavers are perfect for air rifles in my opinion. Anything that is designed to handle the repeated recoil of a .30-06, is more than enough scope for an air rifle. I have a BSA Mercury, with a Weaver K3 on it, and it was putting in some respectable 3/4" groups at 25 metres, at the range tonight. I love the old steel "El Paso" Weaver scopes. Sadly getting more difficult to find this side of the pond, and E-bay mostly prevents US sellers from posting to the UK.

Lakey

[eyebull]

That sounds oddly illogical. Unless they are more toy like (ie plastic) I would have assumed most scopes of that period were more likely to be made for firearm (eg .22 LR, and larger calibres) than specifically made for air rifle

...The other Weavers you can get for $20+. I assumed any of these would be destroyed by a spring gun? I have a BSA MK2 with ring mounts but just didn’t think I could put these on that?

You'd do well to be cautious, just because something is fit for firearm use doesn't mean it would stand up to the odd back-and-forth recoil of a springer. AFAIA at least a few of the top scope makers will void warranties if their firearm scopes are used on airguns.
At $20 it may be worth the risk, but I'd balk at putting anything particularly rare or valuable on a springer.

[Muskett]

The old scopes had wire cross hairs. Time and spring harmonics can break them; its luck and price isn't any guarantee that its won't break.
Military rifles used open sights, and air rifles were used around the farmyard or bell targets, so open sights were the norm. Optics were expensive and rarely that fantastic. Even rarer to be fitted to air rifles, but not unheard of. The tricky bit is to have scope ramps, and the period mounts to finish the whole package.
The HW50 and 35 started production a good while ago. Also look at BSF another German manufacturer. I think the Webley MKIII didn't get its scope ramp until the mid 70's?? Some air rifles had some customisation done to have a scope fitted; some top notch gunsmithing, some outright crude.

There is something quite fun to scoping a vintage rifle. Those long skinny vintage scopes look fun even if not very clear a sight picture. Sadly, I don't think scoping makes them any more accurate. As the tales of the early 80's showed the Jap scopes just showed up how limited most rifles were. Most really shouldn't have been allowed to shoot further than within the farmyard.

Its fun, so go for it.

[45flint]

The old scopes had wire cross hairs. Time and spring harmonics can break them; its luck and price isn't any guarantee that its won't break.
Military rifles used open sights, and air rifles were used around the farmyard or bell targets, so open sights were the norm. Optics were expensive and rarely that fantastic. Even rarer to be fitted to air rifles, but not unheard of. The tricky bit is to have scope ramps, and the period mounts to finish the whole package.
The HW50 and 35 started production a good while ago. Also look at BSF another German manufacturer. I think the Webley MKIII didn't get its scope ramp until the mid 70's?? Some air rifles had some customisation done to have a scope fitted; some top notch gunsmithing, some outright crude.

There is something quite fun to scoping a vintage rifle. Those long skinny vintage scopes look fun even if not very clear a sight picture. Sadly, I don't think scoping makes them any more accurate. As the tales of the early 80's showed the Jap scopes just showed up how limited most rifles were. Most really shouldn't have been allowed to shoot further than within the farmyard.

Its fun, so go for it.

I think the American tradition of pneumatic pump rifles lend themselves a little better to vintage scoping experiments? No recoil, thus vintage scopes are less likely to be damaged, less risk than continuing to shoot them on a cartridge rifle. Crosman made “vintage” mounts, in the 1960’s? but capable of working on any of their rifles made back to the 1930’s, by attaching to the rifle barrels. I bought a new, old stock one of these, last year. Yes it’s crude, made to work only with 3/4 tube scopes, but they say they worked. I’ll know in a couple weeks?

[Josie & John]

I have recently been testing early BSA telescope sights including the elusive Mk III and am due to publish a write up in Airgun World over the next couple of months. I've also been testing a 1960s Diana G29, which I acquired with its original box. These are the first 'scopes I have used for probably 10 years!

John M