Advice re fitting scope rail to pre-war BSA

[slow_runner]

Hi,

I'm the proud owner of a BSA Standard Pattern .22 (1925/26) and a nicely restored Improved Model D Light Model .177 (1913/14).
The Standard Pattern came in a well made reproduction case (many thanks to Mac). .

So what I would like to share with you is my idea to fit a scope rail on the Improved Model D Light Model. Quite a few people will disapprove of this. I am prepared to get a few "don't do it, you pagan" 's. But I know that this has been done before, and I am just very curious to know what kind of results I could get accuracy wise from this 1913/14 piece of quality engineering.

Hello Louis, check out this solution created for Trevors BSA.
See it on Flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tjm_45k/

It allows the BSA to be put back to original with no effect to the originality of the BSA

[frakor]

This is my "vintage sniper"

There are 2 grooves milled into the main cylinder, only did this because the barrel and cylinder wher badly corroded on the inside and beyond repair.




----------------------------
Frank

[Muskett]

This is my "vintage sniper"

There are 2 grooves milled into the main cylinder, only did this because the barrel and cylinder wher badly corroded on the inside and beyond repair.




----------------------------
Frank

frakor's vintage sniper is my preferred way of conversion of these old rifles. The "long" style period scope on permanent made and fixed scope mounts.
The issue is to use old style scope; old style base and mounts.
In my experience the result only gives minor improvement in sight picture over the open sights. FOV with these old scopes are usually pretty narrow and the cross hairs very thin. They won't turn groups from 1/2" to pellet on pellet at range.

Just putting a modern scope on an old vintage only proves what the particular rifle can do with no sight error. The sight doesn't make them more accurate.

Lastly, for most spring rifles they all are badly behaved when tide to the benchrest. The spring makes them "live" rather than "dead" like PCPs.

Nice idea but in practice these old rifle shoot best standing with their iron sights. Practice with them and they will hold it there. Take them beyond their natural ability and it gets disappointing. We have all tried and there is a hobby in trying to get rifles to shoot beyond the farmyard. To do that really requires a mousetrap that is designed to do so, which generally means loads of weight and spring, port, compression, tuned to achieve the end. Just the way it is.

I knew someone who could bring down a wood pigeon in flight with one of these pre war BSA's. Close range and all in the swing. No one had told him it couldn't be done!

[Shed tuner]

Hello Louis, check out this solution created for Trevors BSA.
See it on Flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tjm_45k/

It allows the BSA to be put back to original with no effect to the originality of the BSA

now that's the best solution to maintain originality....

[Garvin]

Hello Louis, check out this solution created for Trevors BSA.
See it on Flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tjm_45k/

It allows the BSA to be put back to original with no effect to the originality of the BSA

What a great solution! It looks really nice too - very attractive the way it's tapered so as not to obstruct the cocking slot. You could imagine this being sold as an add-on for new rifles, had scopes been as popular then as they are now.

[andrewM]

What a great solution! It looks really nice too - very attractive the way it's tapered so as not to obstruct the cocking slot. You could imagine this being sold as an add-on for new rifles, had scopes been as popular then as they are now.

Magnificent engineering and innovation combined and some splendid rifles there, too. Equally impressive were the period scopes.

I would be rather keen to submit mine for the same treatment, if someone was prepared to do it.

[jirushi]

+ 1 for a Trevor scope holder haha.
I am amazed by all the great ideas that have been put into practice.
Will start looking for someone who can make something like that.
Then I could perhaps start a business. Just joking of course.
Trevor's solution takes my worries away of having to irreversibly modify my antique guns.

[daveh]

Hi All , I have a 1909 Improved Model D to which aprevious ownerhas silver soldered or braised asmall bar profiled to mimic the profile of milled slots. I have fitted an old Diana x4 scope andthe setup works very well. If anyone is interested I can email photos. Regards Daveh

[Josie & John]

Hello Louis, check out this solution created for Trevors BSA.
See it on Flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/tjm_45k/

It allows the BSA to be put back to original with no effect to the originality of the BSA

I agree - this is the most sympathetic way of mounting a scope that I have seen. I once bought an early 1920s No 2 Standard with visible etching, where some former owner had mounted a scope ramp over the etching. Truly sacrilegious in my view. To cap it off, the ramp was not really strong enough to handle a recoiling scope for more than a few shots.

I do quite like this set up though as it appears to be completely reversible.

John

[andrewM]

I agree - this is the most sympathetic way of mounting a scope that I have seen. I once bought an early 1920s No 2 Standard with visible etching, where some former owner had mounted a scope ramp over the etching. Truly sacrilegious in my view. To cap it off, the ramp was not really strong enough to handle a recoiling scope for more than a few shots.

I do quite like this set up though as it appears to be completely reversible.

John

A competent blacksmith should be able to carry out this operation and I believe Louisvanhovell is searching for someone to achieve this. Probably, there could be quite a demand if a competent person could be found to produce the parts. I would almost certainly purchase these but would like a vintage period scope.

[slow_runner]

I have relayed your praiseworthy comments to Jeff on the scope mount he created. He reacted in his usual quiet practical manner and is pleased that it has met with approval.

[slow_runner]

Hello Louis.
I understand that Trevor supplied you with clean images ( and dimensions?) of the scope attachment that Jeff made for him.
How did you make out with having reproductions of Jeffs sympathetic scope attachment for early BSA's?
I would be interested to see what was produced and hearing your assessment and opinion on it.
Jeff is curious also

[JB101]

i recall seeing on a blog somewhere (can't find it) that a chap did it by using a modern clamp just in front of the trigger guard such as some can be found by an image search & maybe with the use of an extra rail on top for length

google search - barrel clamp scope mount (images)

ATB
James

[andrewM]

I would also be interested to know how you have got on.

[jirushi]

Hello Louis.
I understand that Trevor supplied you with clean images ( and dimensions?) of the scope attachment that Jeff made for him.
How did you make out with having reproductions of Jeffs sympathetic scope attachment for early BSA's?
I would be interested to see what was produced and hearing your assessment and opinion on it.
Jeff is curious also

Good morning, sorry for my very late response. I must admit that it slipped my mind, and I suddenly thought about it yesterday.
I am 30 but my memory seems to be a bit older than that.
Yes Trevor sent a few good photos. I will upload them. AndrewM and I have been in touch with Protek Supplies a few months ago, but they weren't too sure and then I didn't really look for other options. Since then, vintage Crosmans pumpers and CO2 airguns have gripped my interest more than anything else. Two Crosmans Town & Country 108, a first variant Sears & Roebuck 180, a second variant 160, a first variant 400, a boxed first variant 140. Woops.
To be honest, I'd like to pass the baton on this one.
Protek might be convinced by someone who pays them a visit with photos and a solid plan.
Or someone could try to replicate the design. I don't have the tools, nor the skills, and I'm in Amsterdam most of the time.
Have a nice weekend, Louis