New pcp, when is it not good enough ?

[Archer50]

Sorry, but some makes and models of guns shoot better groups than others under all circumstances while some are very pellet fussy and might be great with one pellet and rubbish with another. I'm afraid that anyone who has bought a poor quality make/model of gun is probably stuck with it - I just hope for their sake it's a cheap one, although in my experience, that's not always the case. The only way you could demonstrate that there was something wrong with a gun, based on its grouping alone is to compare it to exactly the same gun shot in exactly the same way by the same person with the same pellets and even then not all 'identical' guns like the same pellets and pellet batches can vary hugely. There are so many variables that in practice all you can do is compare your set up with others as near identical as possible to yours and, if you still think you have a problem, hope that the retailer/manufacturer or whoever will take a common sense, goodwill approach and try to get it fixed. In the absence of any external standard or specific claim from the manufacturer, and given the importance of the human input, your chance of going down the 'not fit for purpose' route simply on the basis of grouping would not be good.

Alan

[32:1]

Its not my rifle but a question concerning what is acceptable in this scenario, Im happy to tinker and others wouldn't touch their mew pcp so wondered how bad a rifle had to shoot before it was accepted as faulty by an rfd or manufacturer.

Would a s400 be returned if it grouped bigger than say 10p at 40yds, or a Brockock or even a Steyr. Is their an acceptable group, if not a manufacturer could just say it fires pellets so its doing its job, where they go is not important, with no reference its a mine field I guess

Chris

[robhw97k]

My aas400f was great accuracy straight out the box,i recently cleaned inside barrel,now it aint so accurate.i wont be cleaning it again ggrr.

[Geezer]

According to “Which”, their summary of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 is:

- Satisfactory quality Goods shouldn't be faulty or damaged when you receive them. You should ask what a reasonable person would consider satisfactory for the goods in question. For example, bargain-bucket products won’t be held to as high standards as luxury goods.

- Fit for purpose The goods should be fit for the purpose they are supplied for, as well as any specific purpose you made known to the retailer before you agreed to buy the goods.

- As described The goods supplied must match any description given to you, or any models or samples shown to you at the time of purchase.

Obviously, these are open to interpretation. The middle one is key, as 32:1 has suggested. I’d be happy to argue (and there’s plenty of evidence in mags and on forums etc) that there are broadly accepted accuracy standards for 35-40M hunting, FT, HFT.

I guess if you really want to insure yourself, tell the RFD (in writing, eg email) “I want to hunt rabbits at 40 metres” while enquiring about their best price or a combo deal.

In the real world, it seems to me that most (but not all) dealers are pretty decent when stuff does not work properly, but some distributors are truly painful in admitting they supplied a sub-standard item.

[Shed tuner]

depends rather on price.. c-c group sizes at 30 yards I'd say the below are acceptable...

£250 - 20mm (my very cheap AGS PCR-1 does about 15mm)
£450 - 10mm (my old S400 did way better)
£700 - 7mm (my Phoenix does about this and so does my Rapid)
£1200+ - 5mm (never paid that mutch, but my old pro target was about this level of accuracy - modern equivalent AA FTP ?)

Don't get me wrong, I may expect better, but if a new gun at those prices can't match that it'd be going back. I have a couple of (very well tuned) springers that will shoot 6mm groups at 30 yards all day long.
Chap at our club sent a £370 PCP back as it was shooting about 20mm c-c at 30 yards - they accepted it was faulty and refunded his money.

[MrChipShoulder]

There are countless videos on Youtube showing how fantastic XYZ gun is and lots of shooting grouping shots of XYZ gun.

If a gun is felt to be under performing, just gather up a handfull of Youtube videos showing an example of your gun and if your grouping is worse than the videos, then I'd say that's a fair test to compare to.

[krisko]

1 MOA, 1 inch @100 yards, half inch @50, quarter inch @25yards.

I would say if you can hit a large paintball long range or a small paintball short range repeatedly with it is fine.

In hft you have 15mm killzone at short range, long range is what 45mm diameter 40yard ish. This should get you the idea. Clamp The gun down to rule out parallax and shooter, in no wind situation it should be pellet on pellet or at least touching (cloverleaf)

[MrChipShoulder]

1 MOA, 1 inch @100 yards, half inch @50, quarter inch @25yards.

I would say if you can hit a large paintball long range or a small paintball short range repeatedly with it is fine.

In hft you have 15mm killzone at short range, long range is what 45mm diameter 40yard ish. This should get you the idea. Clamp The gun down to rule out parallax and shooter, in no wind situation it should be pellet on pellet or at least touching (cloverleaf)

I would totally agree with the above. HFT targets are not the size they are for no reason.
Good call

[Spitzer]

Would a s400 be returned if it grouped bigger than say 10p at 40yds, Chris[/QUOTE]


No, I very much doubt it, it would need to spatter them a good bit more than 10p size before most dealers would consider a return, me thinks.