Hawke Bubble Level

[luckymjr]

Hi all.

I am thinking of adding the Hawke bubble level to the dovetails of my new HW99s Imp and I was just wondering If any of you guys use or have used a level like this? I have seen many cheaper versions like this Hawke bubble level on the bay of thieves, but have also read some reviews that these cheaper ones do not sit straight on the rails and are therefore useless.

Any Info will be greatly appreciated lads,

John

[IMG][/IMG]

[I. J.]

Personally - I prefer the ones attached to the scope.

ATB
Ian

[MartynB]

Personally - I prefer the ones attached to the scope.

ATB
Ian

I would tend to agree with this, with a rail mounted level, you have to be 100% it mounts perfectly square otherwise it won't be any use

[zephyr]

The one I have (Hawke) doesn’t sit on the dovetail right. I clamped it on then levelled the action, the bubble wasn’t centred between the lines; so stuck a piece of masking tape on and marked each side of the bubble.

Maybe just my eyes, but I can’t focus on the bubble when shooting as it’s too close. Now sits in my ‘tin of crap that you don’t throw away for some reason’!

[Portzy]

I have one, and if you really really want one, and if you really really must have one, and you have thought once-twice-three times about one and you still cannot live without one........

You can have it, take it, cast out this demon, be my exorcist, for the cost of postage it is yours.

[rhyslightnin]

Hi all.

I am thinking of adding the Hawke bubble level to the dovetails of my new HW99s Imp and I was just wondering If any of you guys use or have used a level like this? I have seen many cheaper versions like this Hawke bubble level on the bay of thieves, but have also read some reviews that these cheaper ones do not sit straight on the rails and are therefore useless.

Any Info will be greatly appreciated lads,

John

[IMG][/IMG]

Mine is rubbish, I had to level the gun & draw some new datum line's on the vial with a Sharpie to make it work right, which means you may as well buy super cheap copy & "calibrate" it like I have

[RobF]

Those bubbles 'kick' can out of level as you tighten them up. They need to be shimmed to keep level in the last part of tightening.

[gunstock]

You will be forever adjusting the thing

[I. J.]

This is the type I use. Cheap as chips. I shoot (targets only) leftie and can just see it through my non shooting eye (if you know what I mean.)

[luckymjr]

Thanks for all the replies and Info lads. It seems the general opinion that these levels are crap, so I don't think I'll bother,

John

[rhyslightnin]

This is the type I use. Cheap as chips. I shoot (targets only) leftie and can just see it through my non shooting eye (if you know what I mean.)

Now that's a good idea! Keeps it out of the way for hunting. Just bought two of these on the bay for around a fiver!! Thanks for sharing!

[Phil Russell]

Now don't mock, but I have sometimes wondered what these levels are for ... presumably to avoid cant when on aim? Interesting, but I find that the scopes I use have lines that run horizontal and vertical through the lens. The challenge is to ensure that the vertical line runs vertically through the action when the scope is mounted on the rifle. The first part of this challenge is to get the rifle truly centred such that the scope mounts are accurately placed. Not as easy as it sounds actually as you are relying on the action, and any flat surface on the action / stock being truly horizontally flat when you check it with a spirit level. I have rarely trusted a stock for this but generally trust flats on the action as being accurate. So now you can add the scope mounts and scope and adjust scope position/rotation to get the vertical scope line perpendicular to the action. Sounds more difficult than it is to do.
A trick I was once shown is to mount the scope but have it just able to turn in the mounts. If you hold the rifle at such a distance, maybe pointing muzzle a bit down, you can see the scope vertical line and the action together. It is then not very difficult to adjust the scope such that the vertical line can be seen to be passing through the centre of the action. Simples. Try it ... it works.
Once set it is then not too difficult to judge whether or not the scope horizontal line is lying with zero slope/cant using your mk1 eyeball while on aim.

I was also once told that a slight cant does not matter as long as it is constant for all shots.Is this so? Or maybe the error induced is too little to matter? I seem to recollect that Jim once did the maths for cant as well.

Cheers, Phil

[RobF]

I was also once told that a slight cant does not matter as long as it is constant for all shots.Is this so? Or maybe the error induced is too little to matter? I seem to recollect that Jim once did the maths for cant as well.

Cheers, Phil

Depends on how accurate you want to be. But it does matter as it's probably in light wind conditions as much, if not more, than the windage you get. If you're shooting at a fixed range then you can dial it out. But if not then your windage will be out for all the other ranges you shoot at.

5 degrees is arguable imperceptible in the field. 10 is where people start to notice it. 5 degrees is enough to push you an inch out at 55yds and something like a 1/2 to a cm at 25 (I forget exactly). It's worse the more loopy your trajectory is.

It's not affected by scope height for those that dial in, but for those that don't then scope height makes it worse the further away from the dialled in range you are.

9/10 times if you put a level against what you think is level it's not because the eye is easily fooled. One person's level is often not to another, Out in the field it will be drawn to what it thinks is level rather than what is... things like trees, posts and horizons are all thought of by the brain as being at 90 degrees intervals even though we know they are not... they have to be really bad for the brain to ignore them, and then there's optical illusions to bring into account which makes what is straight look out of kilter.

That's why we have levels. And that's why without them mystery windage effects with exotic theories cannot be refuted as anything but cant.

[Bellycrawler]

I have a Leupold one, can't remember where or how I got it. It clamps to the dovetail just fine, used only when mounting a scope to get things level. I've also got one that sits on top of a mount, built into the top strap, never used it yet. Are they worth getting, are they worth the money & an investment towards good shooting ?? a good one yes. only a personal opinion though.

[I. J.]

I have a Leupold one, can't remember where or how I got it. It clamps to the dovetail just fine, used only when mounting a scope to get things level. I've also got one that sits on top of a mount, built into the top strap, never used it yet. Are they worth getting, are they worth the money & an investment towards good shooting ?? a good one yes. only a personal opinion though.

£1.83 for a 25mm one. £2.15 for a 30mm one. I risked it.

I used to do a bit of 50m bench rest shooting and yes, I did notice a difference. It made my shooting improve from poor to well below average. Im a pistol man.

ATB
Ian