Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Are Aa 510 xs regs efficient?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    cockermouth
    Posts
    231

    Are Aa 510 xs regs efficient?

    I'm thinking of getting one of the new regulated AA 510 xs in fac anyone experienced how efficient the regs are?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Leek
    Posts
    383
    Quote Originally Posted by adrian1 View Post
    I'm thinking of getting one of the new regulated AA 510 xs in fac anyone experienced how efficient the regs are?
    Probably not, I've seen in one review the carbine 12fpe .177 version has a 130bar reg and gets around 90 shots from a 250 bar fill.
    I've got an HFT500 that I've carbined to the same size cylinder and barrel, regged it and it gets 98 shots at 11.4 fpe from just a 200 bar fill. Got my 400 carbine reg up to 120 shots. The Lane regs are 105 bar. If the US is 130bar then it seems far too high and not enough R&D/Testing was done to get it to it's optimum air usage and shot count.
    So it's probably the same lack of R&D for the XS, takes a load of trial and testing to get an Air Arms spot on with a reg but you shouldn't have to with a production model.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    manchester
    Posts
    7,674
    Quote Originally Posted by bezzer View Post
    Probably not, I've seen in one review the carbine 12fpe .177 version has a 130bar reg and gets around 90 shots from a 250 bar fill.
    I've got an HFT500 that I've carbined to the same size cylinder and barrel, regged it and it gets 98 shots at 11.4 fpe from just a 200 bar fill. Got my 400 carbine reg up to 120 shots. The Lane regs are 105 bar. If the US is 130bar then it seems far too high and not enough R&D/Testing was done to get it to it's optimum air usage and shot count.
    So it's probably the same lack of R&D for the XS, takes a load of trial and testing to get an Air Arms spot on with a reg but you shouldn't have to with a production model.
    A 30 ft.lbs gun uses 4X~5X as much air as that of a sub 12. I have not seen the review you have mentioned but if the REG is set to 130 for a sub 12 then something is not right, it should really be around 95~105 bar depending on the hammer preload even for a carbine barrel.

    A.G

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    London
    Posts
    365
    efficiency is measured by unit of power made by unit of volume of air, that was the question.

    So you need to get information about what power per shot,
    how much air you can squeeze into the cylinder( volume and max pressure) and number of shots Total.

    It will be a .22 that’s for sure. If you want more shots per cylinder fill just turn the power down. The higher the power the higher the air consumption, actually it rockets.

    I don’t really understand the question about efficiency of regulator, it does not make sense. Do you mean how good is it at very high fill pressures or what.
    The xs has a transferport adjustment. So you can turn the power down and shotcount will go up. As air has nowhere to go so it won’t get wasted that much.

    You can check the specs on the manufacturers site about power and shotcount.
    Last edited by krisko; 12-11-2018 at 10:02 PM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Leek
    Posts
    383
    Quote Originally Posted by krisko View Post
    I don’t really understand the question about efficiency of regulator, it does not make sense. Do you mean how good is it at very high fill pressures or what.
    .
    It does make sense, when you set a reg up you don't just plug and play, you have to do a lot of testing with various components to get the optimum shot count at your chosen power. You can get the same power with different springs, preloads, weights etc but the shot count will vary, wasted air etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by krisko View Post
    The xs has a transferport adjustment. So you can turn the power down and shotcount will go up. As air has nowhere to go so it won’t get wasted that much.
    Totally wrong, AA power adjustment is just a screw that moves in and out of the airflow as it enters the transfer port disturbing the airflow. Further in it is more the disturbance so less power, screw it out and the power increases BUT it uses the same amount of air no matter where the adjuster is so shot count doesn't alter at all as the air enters from the firing valve before the adjuster comes into play.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Leek
    Posts
    383
    Quote Originally Posted by lensman57 View Post
    A 30 ft.lbs gun uses 4X~5X as much air as that of a sub 12. I have not seen the review you have mentioned but if the REG is set to 130 for a sub 12 then something is not right, it should really be around 95~105 bar depending on the hammer preload even for a carbine barrel.

    A.G
    Exactly, way too high, my guess is they haven't altered the transfer port size and need the extra reg pressure to get the required 12fpe power. When I first regged my 400 I tried to do it with the standard port and couldn't get the power up at reg's 105 bar pressure, 130 would let you do it. Increasing the port from the standard 2mm odd to the recommended 3.5mm let the 105 reg get the power easily so it was the first thing I did when I did the HFT afterwards.
    The revue I got the details from is http://www.airgunshooting.co.uk/news...rter-1-5541548

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Twickenham
    Posts
    264
    The reg was to meet demand for a reg! my HFT was really no better after fitting a HUMA than before.

    If you re going FAC then you can't beat the Crown currently, I would never reccomend it for sub 12FT with experience to match, but with the Crown you can "balance" everything perfectly, not so with the AA, this concerns me as you wont be able to tune to the sweet spot, just some different power settings and cross your fingers.

    Of course the AA is way cheaper than the FX.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Near Wimbledon, SW London, or Lusaka, Zambia
    Posts
    26,324
    Quote Originally Posted by bezzer View Post
    It does make sense, when you set a reg up you don't just plug and play, you have to do a lot of testing with various components to get the optimum shot count at your chosen power. You can get the same power with different springs, preloads, weights etc but the shot count will vary, wasted air etc.

    Totally wrong, AA power adjustment is just a screw that moves in and out of the airflow as it enters the transfer port disturbing the airflow. Further in it is more the disturbance so less power, screw it out and the power increases BUT it uses the same amount of air no matter where the adjuster is so shot count doesn't alter at all as the air enters from the firing valve before the adjuster comes into play.

    First point certainly correct, but I think you missed the subtleties in Krisko's question. Second you are correct in the mechanism, but it's not completely true as a reduced flow causes a slight reduction in the air actually used due to back pressure.

    Anyways, the real point here is that the question is flawed - it's not a question of "is a reg efficient" as a reg just regulates - it is neither efficient nor inefficient (unless it leaks or is otherwise broken). What really matters is the overall setup of hammer weight, hammer spring, valve properties, port size, return spring, air flow, and reg pressure. Balancing that little lot equates to efficiency (or not).

    having a 130BAR reg pressure doesn't make a gun inefficient per se, but it is likely to mean a reduced number of shots per (smaller - say 200>130 vs 200>100) fill. So do we care about shots per fill, or efficiency ?
    Always looking for any cheap, interesting, knackered "project" guns. Thanks, JB.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Leek
    Posts
    383
    I took the question to mean is the whole set up efficient i.e. is the whole set up( reg and all the other settings ) giving the best efficiency of air?, and from the Air Arms spec it obviously isn't . It wouldn't surprise me if everything is the same old standard bits and the reg set to 130 to get the power needed from what is a standard 4**/5** set up instead. I'd be ashamed to get their figures, I can equal and exceed them no problem and that's using a 50 bar less fill. When I've chrono'd strings after altering the adjuster I've never noticed any difference in overall shot count, any back pressure would be extremely minimal.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    London
    Posts
    365
    I don’t think there is anything wrong with the regulator, poor choice if you are into shotcount next time just pick a gun with larger cylinder. And longer barrel that also helps not only 16inch.

    https://www.air-arms.co.uk/news/9526...rifle-air-arms


    I would get a Vulcan instead. CZ barrel. But that would be me. Nice looking gun the AA still if you are into that more

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •