New HFT point scoring system.

[joseph]

After last weeks RAGC shoot, I went for a beer with an old mate who expressed interest in coming to the club. I explained it's a realistic virtual hunting scenario, with legitimate quarry silhouettes scattered around the woods which you knock down for points. No blood is lost, only paint chips.
Three score zones.
1. Kill zone, (the round bit) 2 points
2. Wound zone, (what else would you call it)? 1 point
3. Miss zone, (everywhere else) 0 points

Then the penny dropped.

The HFT discipline represents a small game hunting scenario. It is taken seriously by many ( I see those sheriffs with score cards)
If that's what it represents, then we shouldn't be awarding points for wounding, on the contrary, we should be deducting points.

New system.

1. Kill zone, 2 points
2. Wound zone, -1 point (yes, that's a minus)
3. Miss zone 0 points

Now hold up! And calm down.

Pros.

You're gonna take extra care when you take those shots, if you don't knock it down you'll lose points for wounding. You'll get better.
After all, you wouldn't shoot a rabbit up the arse 'cause you couldn't see its head, and then boast about it down the pub, would you! would you?

You may consider missing all together if you can't hit the kill zone. You'll lose less points, our quarry doesn't crawl away and die, and a latter day chivalrous person emerges.

The best bit.
Our sport is monitored,
That minuscule 2 point change will be recognised, see, we can be conscientious, and it would be good for our new shooters.
New legislations go with the times, so should we.

Cons.

Some may have to increase there Ex-Lax dosage.

Others may find there “one size fits all camo thong” too large.

All comments and expletives welcome.
Watch your spelling.

Joe

[Prone Shooter]

After last weeks RAGC shoot, I went for a beer with an old mate who expressed interest in coming to the club. I explained it's a realistic virtual hunting scenario, with legitimate quarry silhouettes scattered around the woods which you knock down for points. No blood is lost, only paint chips.
Three score zones.
1. Kill zone, (the round bit) 2 points
2. Wound zone, (what else would you call it)? 1 point
3. Miss zone, (everywhere else) 0 points

Then the penny dropped.

The HFT discipline represents a small game hunting scenario. It is taken seriously by many ( I see those sheriffs with score cards)
If that's what it represents, then we shouldn't be awarding points for wounding, on the contrary, we should be deducting points.

New system.

1. Kill zone, 2 points
2. Wound zone, -1 point (yes, that's a minus)
3. Miss zone 0 points

Now hold up! And calm down.

Pros.

You're gonna take extra care when you take those shots, if you don't knock it down you'll lose points for wounding. You'll get better.
After all, you wouldn't shoot a rabbit up the arse 'cause you couldn't see its head, and then boast about it down the pub, would you! would you?

You may consider missing all together if you can't hit the kill zone. You'll lose less points, our quarry doesn't crawl away and die, and a latter day chivalrous person emerges.

The best bit.
Our sport is monitored,
That minuscule 2 point change will be recognised, see, we can be conscientious, and it would be good for our new shooters.
New legislations go with the times, so should we.

Cons.

Some may have to increase there Ex-Lax dosage.

Others may find there “one size fits all camo thong” too large.

All comments and expletives welcome.
Watch your spelling.

Joe

Sorry to burst your bubble but we've been using that format for more than 10 years. We call it TAG or tactical air gun. No limit on kill zone sizes or the distance. Oh and we paint the kill zone the same colour as the plate

Bob

[joseph]

Obviously i'm out of touch, tell me more about TAG, all I could find was people in Hawaii running around with assault weapons

[bozzer]

The HFT discipline represents a small game hunting scenario. Joe

Let's stop you right there ...

No it doesn't.

The name Hunter Field Target has caused some controversy over the years. It is not simulated hunting. Shooters are required to take shots in HFT that a responsible hunter would not take in the field at live quarry. It was started as a complete alternative to Field Target that gave no advantage to having expensive high mag scopes that could be used to range, or having heavily customised stocks. So aimed at kit that was probably commonly used for hunting and probably aimed at plinkers/hunters that didn't want to pay out for expensive rifles/stocks/scopes to have a decent chance at Field Target ... they could just use what rifles/scopes they plinked or hunted with and do very well at Hunter Field Target. The kit has evolved over the years but the basics that made it different to, as opposed to a slightly different version of, Field Target have remained ... No scope adjustments, no sitting, limits on depths of stock and no stock adjustments etc.

The main position was prone, as opposed to sitting in FT. This gave a stable stance ( either low down prone or using the peg ) so that new shooters or youngsters could take part and do reasonably well right from the start. Most shooters will find that shooting sitting, off a bag, FT style can take a year or two before they are getting consistently good results.

The idea behind the 1 point for a plate, as opposed to a 'x' ( score 1 ) for a kill and a zero for everything other than hitting the kill ( knock the target down ), as used in FT, was to give youngsters and newbies a chance to get a less embarrassing score on their first few times out. Most folk will hit a faceplate lying prone out to 45 yards, especially in the early days when plates were all virtually full sized plates ( the lollipops and small plates with just a small amount of plate around the kill came later ). This wasn't a new thing by the way. Many FT clubs would do that type of scoring on club practice days to keep newcomers interested.

So re your idea ...

It simply isn't simulated hunting. It's a shame it was ever called Hunter Field Target. "Field Target with the basic kit that you use for plinking or hunting" was probably too big a title.

The other thing you need to learn is ...

You need to just shoot HFT or don't ... but never question it, or anything about it, especially on an internet forum. You may as well poke a long stick at a red ants' nest and then lie down with your genitals exposed and enjoy the consequences. When you shoot more than a certain number of HFT shoots, especially including the odd National, you have to secretly pledge your soul to the dark lords of the forest, and if anyone on an internet site suggests anything that may improve things, you must chant the HFT prayer over and over until the upstart is shouted down ... " If it aint broke ... why try and fix it ... If it aint broke ... why try and fix it ". It's a subliminal form of hypnosis that is used during the safety briefs.

[Steve C.]

I would dispute that it represents a hunting scenario, to me it's a target shooting discipline having in many cases targets represented by lollipops, triangles, squares, doughnuts, spiders-webs, tanks etc, etc. plus the unknown shapes (ie randomly chopped targets that we use at Kingsley) as well as animal shapes.
It is a good measure of your skills out to a maximum of 45yrds (normally!)

Steve C.

[rogb]

After last weeks RAGC shoot, I went for a beer with an old mate who expressed interest in coming to the club. I explained it's a realistic virtual hunting scenario, with legitimate quarry silhouettes scattered around the woods which you knock down for points. No blood is lost, only paint chips.
Three score zones.
1. Kill zone, (the round bit) 2 points
2. Wound zone, (what else would you call it)? 1 point
3. Miss zone, (everywhere else) 0 points

Then the penny dropped.

The HFT discipline represents a small game hunting scenario. It is taken seriously by many ( I see those sheriffs with score cards)
If that's what it represents, then we shouldn't be awarding points for wounding, on the contrary, we should be deducting points.

New system.

1. Kill zone, 2 points
2. Wound zone, -1 point (yes, that's a minus)
3. Miss zone 0 points

Now hold up! And calm down.

Pros.

You're gonna take extra care when you take those shots, if you don't knock it down you'll lose points for wounding. You'll get better.
After all, you wouldn't shoot a rabbit up the arse 'cause you couldn't see its head, and then boast about it down the pub, would you! would you?

You may consider missing all together if you can't hit the kill zone. You'll lose less points, our quarry doesn't crawl away and die, and a latter day chivalrous person emerges.

The best bit.
Our sport is monitored,
That minuscule 2 point change will be recognised, see, we can be conscientious, and it would be good for our new shooters.
New legislations go with the times, so should we.

Cons.

Some may have to increase there Ex-Lax dosage.

Others may find there “one size fits all camo thong” too large.

All comments and expletives welcome.
Watch your spelling.

Joe

"their"

As has been stated, it's not hunting, it's target shooting and most HFTers know that.
Learning range-finding and wind-judging, though, from various positions would surely help any hunter.

The rules are different around the country but the main rule set from UKAHFT has been tweaked through the years to reflect the current wishes, technical standards, styles and practices of those who shoot it.

Shooting metal plates with holes = no need to be chivalrous, but nice *&^%$* try.

[Phil Russell]

Interesting thread but: the replies concentrating on the 'simulated hunting' comment are, I believe, missing the key point (no pun intended). The 'simulated hunting' argument is irrelevant; the key issue is whether or not the scoring system should be changed and, as many comments above say, 'don't change what is not broken'.
The system proposed; one that introduces an element of gambling on your shot, is not new and has been used in many side shoot scenarios or what may be also called 'fun shoots' held at various times by various clubs. Yes, they are fun ... as are the variants e.g. score 1 for a prone shot knock down, score 2 for a kneeler knock down, score 3 for a stander knock down. In all cases score 0 for a plate. Yes ... good fun but not really adequate for competition use as too much depends on the tactics used by the shooter. The current HFT scoring format rewards the shooter for being a good shot with all shooters shooting the designated course as set out by the organisers. As it should be.
So ... nice thoughts, but the scoring idea is just for a fun tactical shoot not for the competitive HFT course.
Cheers, Phil

[Rich]

Our club puts on some events now and then with several disciplines to shoot, and your version with a penalty for a faceplate is adopted into what we call Humane HFT. We deliberately portray it as a simulated hunting environment, just for that event.

It's quite a challenge for some regular HFT shooters to decide actually not to take the shot if they are not confident of a knock down.

In the end it's just another take on a target shooting sport.

[mr dink]

Let's stop you right there ...

No it doesn't.

The name Hunter Field Target has caused some controversy over the years. It is not simulated hunting. Shooters are required to take shots in HFT that a responsible hunter would not take in the field at live quarry. It was started as a complete alternative to Field Target that gave no advantage to having expensive high mag scopes that could be used to range, or having heavily customised stocks. So aimed at kit that was probably commonly used for hunting and probably aimed at plinkers/hunters that didn't want to pay out for expensive rifles/stocks/scopes to have a decent chance at Field Target ... they could just use what rifles/scopes they plinked or hunted with and do very well at Hunter Field Target. The kit has evolved over the years but the basics that made it different to, as opposed to a slightly different version of, Field Target have remained ... No scope adjustments, no sitting, limits on depths of stock and no stock adjustments etc.

The main position was prone, as opposed to sitting in FT. This gave a stable stance ( either low down prone or using the peg ) so that new shooters or youngsters could take part and do reasonably well right from the start. Most shooters will find that shooting sitting, off a bag, FT style can take a year or two before they are getting consistently good results.

The idea behind the 1 point for a plate, as opposed to a 'x' ( score 1 ) for a kill and a zero for everything other than hitting the kill ( knock the target down ), as used in FT, was to give youngsters and newbies a chance to get a less embarrassing score on their first few times out. Most folk will hit a faceplate lying prone out to 45 yards, especially in the early days when plates were all virtually full sized plates ( the lollipops and small plates with just a small amount of plate around the kill came later ). This wasn't a new thing by the way. Many FT clubs would do that type of scoring on club practice days to keep newcomers interested.

So re your idea ...

It simply isn't simulated hunting. It's a shame it was ever called Hunter Field Target. "Field Target with the basic kit that you use for plinking or hunting" was probably too big a title.

The other thing you need to learn is ...

You need to just shoot HFT or don't ... but never question it, or anything about it, especially on an internet forum. You may as well poke a long stick at a red ants' nest and then lie down with your genitals exposed and enjoy the consequences. When you shoot more than a certain number of HFT shoots, especially including the odd National, you have to secretly pledge your soul to the dark lords of the forest, and if anyone on an internet site suggests anything that may improve things, you must chant the HFT prayer over and over until the upstart is shouted down ... " If it aint broke ... why try and fix it ... If it aint broke ... why try and fix it ". It's a subliminal form of hypnosis that is used during the safety briefs.

What a great post this is ,spot on Bozzer a pity Chrise is not here to add to it would certainly put new shooter off coming back with zero points.

[Zomboid]

If it was simulated hunting there should a silent approach rule to the post and nobody is allowed to talk for the entire duration of the shoot. Also I'd limit everyone to 4x scopes too.

[ian321]

I see what you are saying but I think if things was to change it should be either kill-(1 point) or miss (0 points) , not taking away points! One thing I’d of liked to see change when I was shooting is more realistic ranges, ie take the ranges to 15-40 yards but have the kill zones of a maximum of 20mm

[bezzer]

I see what you are saying but I think if things was to change it should be either kill-(1 point) or miss (0 points) , not taking away points! One thing I’d of liked to see change when I was shooting is more realistic ranges, ie take the ranges to 15-40 yards but have the kill zones of a maximum of 20mm

1 and 0 is the FT method of scoring, HFT distanced themselves from FT when it was started they aren't going to go align themselves with them now. HFT isn't broke so why "fix it", it caters for all standards of shooters, as said you don't want newcomers/casual shooters put right off. Nothing to stop anyone doing FT instead if that's the way you want to go.

[rogb]

What a great post this is ,spot on Bozzer a pity Chrise is not here to add to it would certainly put new shooter off coming back with zero points.

I shot SFT once and came back with 4 points Mind you, it was 2 until the last lane where I doubled my score. Must of got the hang of it by then.

What a laugh we had and that day has now entered into air rifle legend, according to some

[Baxterbasics]

...witness the birth of HFT-started as an antidote to the arms-race that Field Target (FT) was rapidly becoming........ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuxnuDdQSik

[Prone Shooter]

...witness the birth of HFT-started as an antidote to the arms-race that Field Target (FT) was rapidly becoming........ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuxnuDdQSik

Funnily enough, I was reading through the above posts and thinking, "wonder if I can find that old video of Rob and the Nomads?".

Any older Graham and that would have been in black and white Circa 1993/4 IIRC.

That rat in the ditch by your feet was a common placed target back then. I remember one at Buccaneers which was literally, 2 yards in front of the barrel, not quite enough to poke it down using the barrel

As said, a diversion from "true" FT to help level the playing field. Great days they were


Bob