1856 Tower Musket proof marks

[tacfoley]

The two opposing arrowheads - looking like this * show that the arm was sold out of service to a dealer. The other marks are those of the proofing.

[Huttles94]

I have read up on the internet that the 21 is most likely the mark for the caliber? Now I thought they were all .577 but I am probably wrong, the same comment was saying that a .577 was marked as 25.

So I wonder what 21 would be? Were these guns made in many different calibers?

[tacfoley]

I have read up on the internet that the 21 is most likely the mark for the caliber? Now I thought they were all .577 but I am probably wrong, the same comment was saying that a .577 was marked as 25.

So I wonder what 21 would be? Were these guns made in many different calibers?

The 21 is not the bore, it is number of lead balls of the same diameter as the bore that weigh one pound. Your 21 bore musket works out at .60cal. It is therefore not a converted Brown Bess - that's .69cal.

Can you post images of the lock, please?

[Huttles94]

The 21 is not the bore, it is number of lead balls of the same diameter as the bore that weigh one pound. Your 21 bore musket works out at .60cal. It is therefore not a converted Brown Bess - that's .69cal.

Can you post images of the lock, please?

ahhh ok I get it now. I do have images of the lock but it was way back and they are not good quality, ill send a link anyway but I am there again on Wednesday so ill get some better pictures then.

Also what nipple thread are these? or does it vary between guns?

Here are the images of the lock, like I said, it is pretty dark and not the best images but i will get more:

https://i.imgur.com/gSBYxZo.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/vvfUcoA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/DICYGOR.jpg

Also as a bonus, here it is on my grandfather wall along with two shotguns:

https://i.imgur.com/Prl4mrs.jpg

[tacfoley]

ahhh ok I get it now. I do have images of the lock but it was way back and they are not good quality, ill send a link anyway but I am there again on Wednesday so ill get some better pictures then.

Also what nipple thread are these? or does it vary between guns?

Here are the images of the lock, like I said, it is pretty dark and not the best images but i will get more:

https://i.imgur.com/gSBYxZo.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/vvfUcoA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/DICYGOR.jpg

Also as a bonus, here it is on my grandfather wall along with two shotguns:

https://i.imgur.com/Prl4mrs.jpg

Many thanks for the images, and yes, they ARE pretty awful. The piece is a Pattern 53 musket or rifled musket, with a 1856-dated lock. For some reason it was sold out of service, and reproofed after boring out to a smoothbore shotgun. The lack of backsight is because shotguns do not need a backsight. Enfield-style nipples can be bought from Peter Dyson, as noted before, but you can only get the Musket or Top Hat caps as they are called, by showing your SGC to the dealer. I'm not familiar with shotguns, and I'm not sure if you have to note it on the SGC - more experienced advice is on the way, I'm sure.

A word of caution - do NOT try and shoot it without getting it looked at first by a competent gunsmith, and gentle loads of BLACK POWDER only are needed.

[Huttles94]

Many thanks for the images, and yes, they ARE pretty awful. The piece is a Pattern 53 musket or rifled musket, with a 1856-dated lock. For some reason it was sold out of service, and reproofed after boring out to a smoothbore shotgun. The lack of backsight is because shotguns do not need a backsight. Enfield-style nipples can be bought from Peter Dyson, as noted before, but you can only get the Musket or Top Hat caps as they are called, by showing your SGC to the dealer. I'm not familiar with shotguns, and I'm not sure if you have to note it on the SGC - more experienced advice is on the way, I'm sure.

A word of caution - do NOT try and shoot it without getting it looked at first by a competent gunsmith, and gentle loads of BLACK POWDER only are needed.

Just found a similar one on gunstar, that one is a 1857 Tower so only a year difference. That too is a 0.60 caliber.

I know you said you think it was re bored but I would of thought there would be traces of the old inspection mark for the gauge if it was re proofed. So could it be that some were indeed made to 0.60 caliber from the factory? Maybe a certain unit requested this specific caliber? Either way I dont plan on shooting it anytime soon and it very much a S58 wall piece. Might be different in the future but yes, I rather like not being blown up so i would get it checked out before hand

[tacfoley]

Just found a similar one on gunstar, that one is a 1857 Tower so only a year difference. That too is a 0.60 caliber.

I know you said you think it was re bored but I would of thought there would be traces of the old inspection mark for the gauge if it was re proofed. So could it be that some were indeed made to 0.60 caliber from the factory? Maybe a certain unit requested this specific caliber? Either way I dont plan on shooting it anytime soon and it very much a S58 wall piece. Might be different in the future but yes, I rather like not being blown up so i would get it checked out before hand

There has never been a .60 smoothbore gun in British service. No unit would have requested a different bore or calibre arm than the rest, except the Light Division who were equipped with the Baker rifle in the late 1790's and early 1800s - and they were flintlocks.

David Minshall notes -

A government rifle will NOT carry the commercial marks of the London or Birmingham Gun Barrel Proof Houses with their usual marks and double 25 bore size marks. However these can sometimes be found IN ADDITION to the defaced original government proofs showing that the rifle has been correctly (and as required by law) submitted for proof prior to civilian sale.