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Thread: Oscar Will Venus-Waffenwek artwork?

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    Oscar Will Venus-Waffenwek artwork?

    Just purchased this from Germany cause it wasn’t much money and was part of the Venus-Waffenwerk story. Any idea what these were used for and the approximate age? I’m assuming very early 1900’s? I see a couple in the Vintage Airgun Gallery so I assume these aren’t rare?


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    ccdjg is offline Airgun Alchemist, Collector and Scribe
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    Extemely rare and desirable if original, but I doubt that this is original as it looks too pristine for a 100 year old print. I could be wrong of course, and you need to do the uv test on the paper to see if it is a modern copy or not. Good luck!

    Incidentally, the town Zella St Blasii ceased to exist as such in 1919, when it merged with the neighbouring town Zella to become Zella-Mehlis, so this helps date the label.

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    This is getting more interesting? I look in the Vintage Gallery and they had one identical. Well in looking at it, it is not identical it is the same one. There is a imperfection that matches? Little hole between the T and the B. Interesting? Wonder what’s the history of that one? Maybe Danny knows?

    https://forum.vintageairgunsgallery....nwerk-artwork/

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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    This is getting more interesting? I look in the Vintage Gallery and they had one identical. Well in looking at it, it is not identical it is the same one. There is a imperfection that matches? Little hole between the T and the B. Interesting? Wonder what’s the history of that one? Maybe Danny knows?

    https://forum.vintageairgunsgallery....nwerk-artwork/
    Afraid not. If you look at the two in the gallery, the 'E' of 'WAFFEN' has blue ink mark, so the fresh-looking one may be a copy of the dull one, perhaps?
    Vintage Airguns Gallery
    ..Above link posted with permission from Gareth W-B
    In British slang an anorak is a person who has a very strong interest in niche subjects.

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    Or it could be the same plate making the same mark? Still kind of halarious that I end up with a example that’s in your gallery? Even if it’s perhaps a copy. Lol. Do you remember where you got the image of the clean one?
    Last edited by 45flint; 20-03-2019 at 06:43 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    Or it could be the same plate making the same mark? Still kind of halarious that I end up with a example that’s in your gallery? Even if it’s perhaps a copy. Lol. Do you remember where you got the image of the clean one?
    I have a feeling they were both up for sale on one of the auction sites. For posts like this I tend to hold on to images until I have several connected ones and post them at the same time - sometimes even if it takes years.
    Vintage Airguns Gallery
    ..Above link posted with permission from Gareth W-B
    In British slang an anorak is a person who has a very strong interest in niche subjects.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Garvin View Post
    Afraid not. If you look at the two in the gallery, the 'E' of 'WAFFEN' has blue ink mark, so the fresh-looking one may be a copy of the dull one, perhaps?
    Look at the outter rim of dots between the two prints. They are very different, thus it certainly is not a copy of the duller one? Different size dots could come from how the stamp hit the paper? Another interesting thing is that mine is slightly off center. Seems to me if you were taking the time to make a copy you would center it? Hope springs eternal!
    Last edited by 45flint; 21-03-2019 at 01:12 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    Look at the outter rim of dots between the two prints. They are very different, thus it certainly is not a copy of the duller one? Different size dots could come from how the stamp hit the paper? Another interesting thing is that mine is slightly off center. Seems to me if you were taking the time to make a copy you would center it? Hope springs eternal!
    True.
    Vintage Airguns Gallery
    ..Above link posted with permission from Gareth W-B
    In British slang an anorak is a person who has a very strong interest in niche subjects.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ccdjg View Post
    Extemely rare and desirable if original, but I doubt that this is original as it looks too pristine for a 100 year old print. I could be wrong of course, and you need to do the uv test on the paper to see if it is a modern copy or not. Good luck!

    Incidentally, the town Zella St Blasii ceased to exist as such in 1919, when it merged with the neighbouring town Zella to become Zella-Mehlis, so this helps date the label.
    What does a UV test show? Found the answer below:

    http://www.cycleback.com/blacklight/optical.html
    Last edited by 45flint; 22-03-2019 at 01:26 PM.

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    ccdjg is offline Airgun Alchemist, Collector and Scribe
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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    What does a UV test show? Found the answer below:

    http://www.cycleback.com/blacklight/optical.html
    You can get a uv light pen off Fleabay for about 4 dollars, which work fine for this. Any collector worth his salt should have one in his armoury.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ccdjg View Post
    You can get a uv light pen off Fleabay for about 4 dollars, which work fine for this. Any collector worth his salt should have one in his armoury.
    Looks like it can prove it’s not but not that it is?

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    ccdjg is offline Airgun Alchemist, Collector and Scribe
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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    Looks like it can prove it’s not but not that it is?
    Yes, its not a perfect test, but not bad. This is how it pans out:

    A positive blue fluorescence This tells you that the paper or card substrate is post ca. 1950 with 100% certainty. So defnitely a fake.

    No blue fluorescence About 90% certain it is genuine
    A fake will only give a negative fluorescence result if (a) it was faked before 1950, or (b) was made after 1950 and the faker had access to non-fluorescent paper and knew about the uv test. A fake made before 1950 can almost certainly be discounted as faking did not become economically viable (at least for relatively low value items such as airgun ephemera) until ink jet and laser printing and colour photocopying were invented. A non-fluorescent fake made after i950 is going to be very unlikely (but not impossible) because non-fluorescent paper is no longer available to the general public (which is why bank notes are printed on non-fluorescent paper).
    Last edited by ccdjg; 22-03-2019 at 06:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ccdjg View Post
    Yes, its not a perfect test, but not bad. This is how it pans out:

    A positive blue fluorescence This tells you that the paper or card substrate is post ca. 1950 with 100% certainty. So defnitely a fake.

    No blue fluorescence About 90% certain it is genuine
    A fake will only give a negative fluorescence result if (a) it was faked before 1950, or (b) was made after 1950 and the faker had access to non-fluorescent paper and knew about the uv test. A fake made before 1950 can almost certainly be discounted as faking did not become economically viable (at least for relatively low value items such as airgun ephemera) until ink jet and laser printing and colour photocopying were invented. A non-fluorescent fake made after i950 is going to be very unlikely (but not impossible) because non-fluorescent paper is no longer available to the general public (which is why bank notes are printed on non-fluorescent paper).
    Interesting, probably forth the $5. But will I ever use it again?

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    Well UV light on its way to break my heart.

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    ccdjg is offline Airgun Alchemist, Collector and Scribe
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    Quote Originally Posted by 45flint View Post
    Interesting, probably forth the $5. But will I ever use it again?
    If you like original gun boxes, pellet boxes, literature or oil cans with your pre-war vintage pistols then the pens are worth their weight in gold. There are so many excellent copies of these around these days that one should never fork out heavy cash without a uv check. Good luck with your quest for the truth!

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