Aimed mostly at the journalistic type bods out there.....

[Unframed Dave]

But anyone else feel free to chip in.

I've been asked to do a talk on the history of airguns to our local archive group, which is fine, I'm reasonably equipped for that. I anticipate however the thornier side of our sport is likely to come up in discussion at some point.

I'd like to be prepared with some facts and figures to support everything positive about it. How many airgun users there are in the UK? How many hft / ft / 10mtr / bell target / bench rest shooters there are. If I've missed out any other disciplines let me know.

Any interesting snippets which I could include.

Will also post this on the agf.

Cheers

Dave

[Phil Russell]

Jolly good of you to take this on. With regard to the statistics, I do not remember seeing any figures for HFT / FT/ Bell Target shooters so a bit of guesstimation may be needed.
Maybe start with the number of clubs in each discipline and multiply that figure by say 50 members to get a club membership, then double that figure to get an estimate of those actively engaged in the sport. Maybe bell target clubs have fewer members so adjust accordingly.
This may give only a very rough estimate but I think it will be of the right magnitude. Unless there are more accurate figures available that is.
Of course some people belong to more than one club but generally I tend to think the effect of this will not alter the results greatly. Maybe the result will give a figure accurate to +/- 50%? But it is a start.
Plinkers are another matter and must run into thousands. How many people own an airgun as a % of population? 1%? I have no idea. Does the Gun Trades Association (do they still exist?) have figures on airgun sales?
Hunters maybe another group but, I think, in a minority compared to club membership ... and bear in mind that many club members also hunt. Maybe take club membership and add 20% for those hunters who are not club members.
Overall this approach may give an approximation. It is wide open to challenge but I think it can give a figure that puts airgun shooting numbers in perspective.
I guess it all depends on how accurate you want the figures to be and how important they are to your talk.
Good luck
Cheers, Phil

[Fronteria]

This might be of interest to you.
https://researchbriefings.parliament...mmary/CBP-7654

[Phil Russell]

Quite intrigued by the numbers game. A quick search reveals about 37 HFT clubs and 71FT clubs in the UK, although some may combine both disciplines.
Bell target surprised me as there seem to be approx 25 leagues each with maybe 8 teams each of maybe 8 shooters = 1600 shooters, not counting team members not shooting on the day. OK, great approximations again because the number of teams per league varies, but I used 8 as a workable guide.

Not sure about airgun clubs for 10m discipline; maybe somewhat less than for bell target.
Cheers, Phil

[angrybear]

Simple points to argue;
What would the anti do if their house or garden became overrun with rats ? most would probably say, call 'rentokill' at which point you can argue the instant clean kill of a shot, verses the slow lingering death caused by poison.

Cats, of course you point out that's it's already illegal to shoot any pet & that often it's the retired house proud gardener type, trying to stop them sh*tting in their flower beds as opposed to some little thug.

Birds & animals, again the legal side of things, everything is protected unless on some form of general licence, But when it comes to vermin control some people will never be convinced there's a need to control/kill them, don't argue - simply agree they're entitled to their opinion but state the law has a different opinion & as with rats a quick clean kill is better than a slow lingering one.

The easiest anti licencing argument is the comparison with un-licenced/un-insured drivers.

[Phil Russell]

Simple points to argue;
What would the anti do if their house or garden became overrun with rats ? most would probably say, call 'rentokill' at which point you can argue the instant clean kill of a shot, verses the slow lingering death caused by poison.

Cats, of course you point out that's it's already illegal to shoot any pet & that often it's the retired house proud gardener type, trying to stop them sh*tting in their flower beds as opposed to some little thug.

Birds & animals, again the legal side of things, everything is protected unless on some form of general licence, But when it comes to vermin control some people will never be convinced there's a need to control/kill them, don't argue - simply agree they're entitled to their opinion but state the law has a different opinion & as with rats a quick clean kill is better than a slow lingering one.

The easiest anti licencing argument is the comparison with un-licenced/un-insured drivers.

All the above are valid as far as they go; but you must be prepared to defend your point of view:
Rats: Yes, shooting is a good option but as far as real control in a domestic situation goes I suggest it is not a complete answer. Poison bait traps can be set and left and judging by the number I see around buildings (e.g. B&Q, a local hospice) they are the means of control favoured by pest controllers. I suggest shooting is not the diy option available to the vast majority of people.
Cats: Is there any evidence to support that it is mostly retired people who shoot cats rather than youngsters? My opinion, for what it is worth, is that it is most likely the tennage thug, but I have no evidence. Just stress it is already illegal to shoot cats and do not dilute your argument by stating facts you cannot support. Or can you ....

General licence ... agree, that is the best stance, maybe stressing public health issues, contaminated grain etc, magpies and attacks on new borne lambs etc.

Cheers, Phil

[Muskett]

The Austrians defeated the French in the 18th century with air rifles!

Number of clubs, plus Army Cadets still using them.

Responsible use of.
Safey drills including a safe range with backstop.
Marksmanship, no one is born a Davey Crockett, its a learnt skill like riding a bicycle.

Hunting only once the basics have been mastered.
Y tube has the good and the bad. Different countries have different power limitds and different attitudes.

With all school presentations keep it straight forward and broken into distinct chunks. All too easy to get into a rambling mess. Questions at the end.

What everyone really wants is to have a go!

[Chippendale]

Regarding the issue, if it does come up, the criminal use of guns, perhaps you could take along some of the modern air weapons that look like the real thing to show how people can be mistaken as to the type of weapon that are used in some crimes.

I think I have explained what I mean Dave but as you well know i'm not a very eloquent person

Cheers

Melv

Chippendale (with clothes on)

[angrybear]

All the above are valid as far as they go; but you must be prepared to defend your point of view:
Rats: Yes, shooting is a good option but as far as real control in a domestic situation goes I suggest it is not a complete answer. Poison bait traps can be set and left and judging by the number I see around buildings (e.g. B&Q, a local hospice) they are the means of control favoured by pest controllers. I suggest shooting is not the diy option available to the vast majority of people.
Cats: Is there any evidence to support that it is mostly retired people who shoot cats rather than youngsters? My opinion, for what it is worth, is that it is most likely the tennage thug, but I have no evidence. Just stress it is already illegal to shoot cats and do not dilute your argument by stating facts you cannot support. Or can you ....

General licence ... agree, that is the best stance, maybe stressing public health issues, contaminated grain etc, magpies and attacks on new borne lambs etc.

Cheers, Phil

The OP's talk is about airguns not what pest controllers do, so all that needs stressing is the instant kill from shooting, rather than the slow death by poison, (controllers use poison because it acts 24/7-365).

The cat thing is a personal observation, I have seen 2 or 3 reported on the local news over the years, all have been 'respectable' older gentlemen, 'protecting' their garden I don't recall a single case of it being a young 'yob',
maybe they just don't make the news.

[TonyL]

I've often wondered how many airgun users there are myself and I think it is a really tricky one to try and guesstimate.

I would have a guess that the number of "casual users / informal target shooters" represents a pretty significant slice. I bring airguns into conversation with as many people as I can and I'm often surprised at how many people I meet own airguns. Many for casual use. Many who still own one from their more youth. Also I've come across a great many people who may have owned one for years but don't currently use, as the rifle was bought for a specific purpose, like clearing rats from a garden and then the rifle sees no further use.

We have no club anywhere close to the small town where I live. The airgun magazines seem to be well represented in Smith's, smaller newsagents and also in the supermarkets. They seem to move from the shelves okay and I guess that the shops wouldn't stock them if there was little or no demand. But I'd also guess that many of the casual users / long time "dormant" owners probably aren't even aware of the magazines' existence?

Airgun ownership "pool" I'd guess to be far larger than what could be approximated by monitoring shop sales, due to many people owning multiple guns, these "dormant" owners, private sales etc etc

Very tough one!

[Rich]

What is the ABC circulation figure for the mags? I'm guessing around 25,000. If you weren't keen on airgun shooting I submit you are unlikely to buy one spontaneously. If you were keen then you might read somebody else's magazine when they'd finished with it rather than shell out for your own.

In Devon and Cornwall I estimated we have around 600 club members in a population of 1.5 million.

That's about 2 percent of the UK population, so multiplying 600 by 50 (the reciprocal of 2%) that suggests 30,000, and that's just club members.

Working up from how many take part in FT and HFT is a serious way is a bad starting point as that number is far too small.

On the matter of cat shooting, when I was looking for grant funding for my club I interviewed by phone every vet's practice within about 30 miles of where I live, which admittedly is not an inner city area. The numbers that came back suggested that a vet would see on average one shot cat in their entire working career, far from the urgent and sinister problem that the RSPCA trumpets. Of course one is too many but there is no fear of cats becoming extinct and it's quite irresponsible of the RSPCA to pour tarnish in this way.

I've mentioned elsewhere the valuable life skills that young people can acquire at a formative age if they are taught to shoot in a structured way. Concentrate on the positives and let the hecklers raise the negatives.

[T 20]

But anyone else feel free to chip in.

I've been asked to do a talk on the history of airguns to our local archive group, which is fine, I'm reasonably equipped for that. I anticipate however the thornier side of our sport is likely to come up in discussion at some point.

I'd like to be prepared with some facts and figures to support everything positive about it. How many airgun users there are in the UK? How many hft / ft / 10mtr / bell target / bench rest shooters there are. If I've missed out any other disciplines let me know.

Any interesting snippets which I could include.

Will also post this on the agf.

Cheers

Dave

Hi Dave.

As per Melbourne's village idiot's suggestion, an email to Terry could be your easiest way of obtaining facts and figures.




All the best Mick

[Unframed Dave]

Hi Dave.

As per Melbourne's village idiot's suggestion, an email to Terry could be your easiest way of obtaining facts and figures.




All the best Mick

You're probably right, I thought he might chip in on here.

Dave

[T 20]

You're probably right, I thought he might chip in on here.

Dave

I'll give him a little nudge for you, Dave.



All the best, Mick

[Unframed Dave]

Tanks.

Dave