NSRA Obligatory membership Proposal

[Artiglio]

The NRA and NSRA need to bury their respective hatchets and form a single body, the Lord Roberts centre is a ghost town for the most part, ( my crowd use it for the cafe), you rarely see it being used for any actual shooting.
From a position of complete technical ignorance, can the use of the Roberts not be expanded to include other disciplines, gallery rifle, black powder pistol, for example, could it be used by the CNC for some of their training, if not in its current form could it with some development?

I’m an NRA member and a a smallbore club member which is affiliated to the nsra, at club level the nsra comps are poorly supported, its seen as only being interested in smallbore target rifle , which was the majority of the clubs shooting 15 years ago but these days there will only be 3 members that don a jacket and sling. Air rifle is the biggest growth area my club has.

A single body covering all manner of target shooting and associated activities has to be the way forward and must surely offer the possibility of cost savings and consolidation.

The nsra looks as though its approaching the precipice that the NRA was when Mercer came on board, whilst he’s generally seen in a less than positive light the changes on the ground at bisley over the last 8 years are easily seen and from my pointmof view huge improvements. The whole issue of the club houses and leases has upset many and the target rifle crowd have for the most part a blinkered view that ignores anything outside their own interest. But to survive change is required, a similar approach as a joint body surely is the way forward and would hopefully give the ability for a joint organisation to make progress across the country rather than being so Bisley centric, as its pointless asking for everyone to support a body based on a surrey “clubhouse”.

In the modern world if you want a voice that has the ability to access the corridors of power and lobby for shooting sports it needs to be paid for , £35 ish a year to continue your hobby is nothing, but i expect most clubs are like mine where putting up the price on the label of the biscuit tin is enough to upset most of the members and elicit howls of imminent destitution which continue as they toddle off to their year old car bought on the latest 3 year deal.

[Rutty]

I would tentatively agree in places. The NRA and NSRA in principle make good bedfellows (except the NRA don't really want anything to do with the NSRA. There seems to be longstanding animosity there for reasons I'm not fully conversant with, though they're probably pathetic and hark back to some perceived slight in the 1970s).

It's been mooted on 3 occaisions durng my lifetime, I don't know the detail of the first one but on the second attempt it attracted vitriolic letters in the NRA Rifleman from their old guard.

There was an attempt to merge them and the CPSA ~2008 but it collapsed. NRA pulled out, CPSA is a Ltd not a Charity (and technically an England-level body, not GB).

The project to assess the feasibility of a merger was funded by UK Sport via British Shooting, research was carried out and group sessions were held. The creation of a single body comprising the NRA nad NSRA seemed possible but the CPSA did present some issues. In any event the matter stalled because the CPSA pulled out of the process without giving any reason. As funding was only available to facilitate the creation of a single shooting organisation the withdrawl of the CPSA stopped it in its tracks.

There's certainly room for consolidation but I suspect the target shooters and hunters are respectively best served by dedicated organisations who can then collaborate though the BSSC umbrella on shooting-wide matters along with the industry groups like the GTA.

This is pretty common on the continent - France has separate Tir and Chasseur Federations and even in the USA their NRA is not the be-all-and-end-all, being accompanied by USAShooting, the CMP, National Shooting Sports Federation and UKPSA amongst others.

I think the field sports contingent are pretty well served by BASC, but as usual not all are members and the majority of those that are are only there for the insurance. BSSC has no funding and lacks coordination but does at least give the impression of some sort of unity. As Hemmers notes, the NRA of America is certainly not the be all and end all, a good many US sport shooters loathe it. It is (nowadays) a political organisation that is focussed on constitutional rights pertaining to gun ownership, the Right to Keep and Bear Arms (RKBA). That's US domestic politics so I won't go there.

A merger or whatever of the NSRA\NRA would appear to be the best way ahead for UK sport shooting, but that is not about to happen. A read through the minutes of the NRA Council Meetings and those of the NSRA show that there are a good many points of contention between the associations. Even if some accomodation was reached, I firmly believe that something similar to what the NSRA are currently proposing would sooner or later be taken up by the NRA; probably sooner.

To summarise, mergers have been mooted before but to the best of my knowledge it has never been the NSRA that scuppered them. Shooting is too cheap and we shall have to accept that we need to pay more; £35/year is less than a £1/week and its introduction would bring us into line with other sports. A lot of the perceived under performance of the NSRA is down to a lack of resource, i.e. they just can't afford it because the punters aren't used to paying.

Unless anyone fancies investing the blood, sweat and tears starting a new body from scratch then the NSRA is what we have.

The NSRA is far from perfect but unless you are prepared to build a new body then it's all we've got and to make it any better we all need to start paying more.

Rutty

[Rutty]

The NRA and NSRA need to bury their respective hatchets and form a single body, the Lord Roberts centre is a ghost town for the most part, ( my crowd use it for the cafe), you rarely see it being used for any actual shooting.

I don't think anyone could disagree with that.

From a position of complete technical ignorance, can the use of the Roberts not be expanded to include other disciplines, gallery rifle, black powder pistol, for example, could it be used by the CNC for some of their training, if not in its current form could it with some development?

It would need a lot of building work and it might be better to start from scratch. The LRC was built for the 2000 Manchester Commonwealt Games and has been a financial burden ever since. It got the UK an "international" standard range but of the economy variety, unfortunately there has never been the funding to properly maintain or update it, along with the marked reluctance of shooters to pay a going rate. The electronic targetry is central to its purpose and function and is a core feature. Its not the sort of system that can be taken down and put up at will.

I’m an NRA member and a a smallbore club member which is affiliated to the nsra, at club level the nsra comps are poorly supported, its seen as only being interested in smallbore target rifle , which was the majority of the clubs shooting 15 years ago but these days there will only be 3 members that don a jacket and sling.

True everywhere, but what about 3P, Benchrest and LSR; all smallbore disciplines supported by the NSRA?

Air rifle is the biggest growth area my club has.

10m or something else?

A single body covering all manner of target shooting and associated activities has to be the way forward and must surely offer the possibility of cost savings and consolidation.

The nsra looks as though its approaching the precipice that the NRA was when Mercer came on board, whilst he’s generally seen in a less than positive light the changes on the ground at bisley over the last 8 years are easily seen and from my point of view huge improvements. The whole issue of the club houses and leases has upset many and the target rifle crowd have for the most part a blinkered view that ignores anything outside their own interest. But to survive change is required, a similar approach as a joint body surely is the way forward and would hopefully give the ability for a joint organisation to make progress across the country rather than being so Bisley centric, as its pointless asking for everyone to support a body based on a surrey “clubhouse”.

In the modern world if you want a voice that has the ability to access the corridors of power and lobby for shooting sports it needs to be paid for , £35 ish a year to continue your hobby is nothing, but i expect most clubs are like mine where putting up the price on the label of the biscuit tin is enough to upset most of the members and elicit howls of imminent destitution which continue as they toddle off to their year old car bought on the latest 3 year deal.

Wholeheartedly agree with that.

Rutty

[RobF]

I don't think anyone could disagree with that.

People do though. Otherwise it would have happened.

True everywhere, but what about 3P, Benchrest and LSR; all smallbore disciplines supported by the NSRA?

3p is a minority smaller than 10m. Benchrest is quite big, a lot of it outside of the NSRA rules.

[Artiglio]

Rutty , thanks for the input , especially on the LRC, as ever things are never simple.

Regarding my club ( no idea how it compares to others) its a bunch of people for whom its pretty much a social club bound together by an interest in shooting, no one as far as i know shoots benchrest via the nsra, i believe a few do the LSR, mostly 10m air rifle that may be relatively well supported as there seems to be plenty of shot cards in the racks. 3P has never to my knowledge been a club discipline.
But in general its club comps that get the most participation. I’ve joined the crowd and given up target rifle and sold my kit , restocked my anschutz barelled action and will be having a go at benchrest, if my scores are good enough maybe i’ll do an nsra league. Though really fullbore is my main interest by far, but i’m fortunate in that bisley is close enough to make going a 2/3 times a month not too much of a chore. My smallbore club is only 10 mins so can go there as and when it suits.

[Steyr]

It is without doubt a very bad idea. The NSRA have questionable competance in my opinion and if anything... outdated and backward looking outlooks. They did sweet FA as far as I am aware re the pistol ban selecting ducking under the parapets where they remain to this day.

If anyone should be absorbing anything.. it should be the NRA absorbing the NSRA..

As far as being able to think outside the box and adapting to the needs of airgun and HFT/FT etc.... I have been unimpressed..

If the organisation was dismantled and rebuilt afresh with disciplines properly represented and forward looking people then maybe... but as it stands... its putting the asylum into the hands of the patients.

[DedIdick]

The word 'National' should be removed from the title of both those bodies. They do naff all for most shooters & club.

[Powderfinger]

NSRA could have picked up thousands of members by embracing FT in the eighties. They could also have recognised that thousands of shooters just want to plink or hunt or dabble. Another source of thousands of members.
Bell target and collecting have seen massive growth in recent years.
Benchrest and LWSR have displaced prone at many clubs but NSRA have rules for these disciplines that are out of step and most benchrest shooters don't shoot NSRA comps. LWSR is being turned into free rifle by NSRA rules and a recent article in NSRA magazine did not even mention that air rifles can be used in LWSR. Instead they have clung to prone rifle. A discipline that is a hangover from when everyone did military service but which has been dying for years even at Olympic level. Politically the NSRA is inept. Witness their recent claim that the vast majority of members vote Conservative. Not true in my experience but even if it is, no politically astute organisation would make such a statement. BASC are very careful to appeal cross-party. Maybe it is a case that the NSRA should be careful what they wish for. Compulsory membership might result in a revolt of the airgunners at an AGM someday and the old prone shooters will be gone.
Most shooting clubs I visit seem to be growing or stable. It is questionable why thriving modernising shooting clubs should want to give more money to a shrinking organisation that has not been well run and has wasted opportunities.
NRA have done a lot of prominent work modernising Bisley.
BASC have a professional approach and engage well with members through a transparent democratic structure with regional meetings.
Telling my club members that they need to pay extra money to refurbish our primarily airgun club is feasible but telling them they need to pay 35.00 to an organisation in Surrey that focusses on prone 22LR will not go down well.