Valuation

[norris]

I wouldn't describe a trade offer as an insult,to state the the obvious, they have to be able to pay themselves.
Were you in the Ellesmere Port store at the time?.
Last time I asked for a trade offer the shop refused to give me a price for a gun I'd bought from them new.

Yes and yes it was an insult, I braved a low risk area and ventured into a higher risk area.

As someone else stated on this post the first Kral Puncher Breakers had issues and changes have been made since. They kept calling it a mark one and also stated they were “in the know”.
Doing a little research it’s unclear if Kral have ever made or stated a MK1/2/3/4 designation for Puncher Breaker however that needs conformation from Kral.

There’s four airguns that I might be buying, one of which is no longer in the list (changed for a dearer rifle) and I might have walk out of there with two of them.

Just need to find a dealer to deal with and I get on with that’s in a low covid risk area, difficult times.

What annoys me is when you order an air rifle and collect your about 999th person to get your paws on it!

[piggy589]

Your last sentence has me a little confused,but if a dealer can't be bothered to wipe over new or used stock it's a poor state of affairs.
Is your purchase urgent enough to warrant driving that distance?

[norris]

Your last sentence has me a little confused,but if a dealer can't be bothered to wipe over new or used stock it's a poor state of affairs.
Is your purchase urgent enough to warrant driving that distance?

I specifically went for an air rifle that isn't stocked by many dealers and there aren't many dealer's close to me.
I have to drive about 50 miles to one, so around trip of a 100 miles is the norm.
Last sentence is in reference to when I order a new air rifle by the time have collected it, the shop staff have had a play it with and a number of customers have also use it. It's like buying a second hand gun but paying the full amount for a new one!
There's no reason at all for the dealer to have a new ordered out if the box before the customer collects it.
The details are on the delivery note and guns number is usually scribbled on the side of the box!

I miss buying air rifles of JS Ramsbottom!

[ZAKDINGEL]

Yes and yes it was an insult, I braved a low risk area and ventured into a higher risk area.

As someone else stated on this post the first Kral Puncher Breakers had issues and changes have been made since. They kept calling it a mark one and also stated they were “in the know”.
Doing a little research it’s unclear if Kral have ever made or stated a MK1/2/3/4 designation for Puncher Breaker however that needs conformation from Kral.

There’s four airguns that I might be buying, one of which is no longer in the list (changed for a dearer rifle) and I might have walk out of there with two of them.

Just need to find a dealer to deal with and I get on with that’s in a low covid risk area, difficult times.

What annoys me is when you order an air rifle and collect your about 999th person to get your paws on it!

if your not happy with hat price the shop is offering you could always put it up for sale at your asking price see if sells that way -just a thought?? save you risking it and driving around looking to the best price

[averageplinker]

I would be interested to know what the insulting trade in price you are offered was. I can't see any dealer offering you more than £100-150 on it and only then if you are spending a big sum on something else at the time.

[norris]

I would be interested to know what the insulting trade in price you are offered was. I can't see any dealer offering you more than £100-150 on it and only then if you are spending a big sum on something else at the time.

Well as I said there were two air rifles that I was interested in the shop which would have total over a £1000, I guess there's not much profit in two budget guns costing over that sum?

[Vic Thompson]

In defence of gun shops. It's not always an easy life running a gun shop, for instance when a friend and I ran one together selling (from memory) an HW100 would give us a profit of £45, selling a Steyr LP10 Air Pistol would give us maybe £125 profit on a good day. It was the cheaper end of the market that kept us going. Generally our retail marks ups were + 10% over trade due to the competitive nature of the business (after discounting down from a higher price). I can't remember what our pricing structure for secondhand items but in this instance there can be risk involved due to lack of accredited history and the need to offer a warranty, along with buying in stock that you don't always want because you've got shelves full of guns anyway. Also as regards warranty repairs, the shop had to bear the cost of two way postage quite often.

After three months I gave up my share of the business as I realised that it was a mugs game working six hours a day and travelling 45 miles to sit in a shop and not get paid after spending an absolute fortune buying in new stock over that period.

Unfortunately if you don't like the shops buying in strategy all you can do is try elsewhere or look at selling privately. Lastly, there's only one valuation that you really want to know, that's the price that an interested buyer wants to actually pay you for the item.

Vic Thompson.

[bmp01]

Lastly, there's only one valuation that you really want to know, that's the price that an interested buyer wants to actually pay you for the item.

Vic Thompson.

And there's the crunch, wise words.

The only other factor I see - how do your advertise the gun to the widest audience and reach that interested buyer (or buyers, if you're lucky).

Good luck with what ever you choose to do.

[norris]

And there's the crunch, wise words.

The only other factor I see - how do your advertise the gun to the widest audience and reach that interested buyer (or buyers, if you're lucky).

Good luck with what ever you choose to do.

Something is only worth what someone else is prepared to pay for it.
Sometimes your lucky (not often enough)and sometimes your not!

[piggy589]

An air rifle that isn't stocked by many dealers, maybe there's a less than subliminal message in there?.
The last new rifle I bought was handed to me over the counter,no box or labels.
When I asked if I could have the box the dealer disappeared and returned with one clearly marked .22.
The gun I'd bought was a .177, oh well I'd done well enough trading in two guns.

[norris]

An air rifle that isn't stocked by many dealers, maybe there's a less than subliminal message in there?.
The last new rifle I bought was handed to me over the counter,no box or labels.
When I asked if I could have the box the dealer disappeared and returned with one clearly marked .22.
The gun I'd bought was a .177, oh well I'd done well enough trading in two guns.

I live within a few miles miles of the Daystate/Brocock factory yet I can't get one within a 30 mile area!

[norris]

In defence of gun shops. It's not always an easy life running a gun shop, for instance when a friend and I ran one together selling (from memory) an HW100 would give us a profit of £45, selling a Steyr LP10 Air Pistol would give us maybe £125 profit on a good day. It was the cheaper end of the market that kept us going. Generally our retail marks ups were + 10% over trade due to the competitive nature of the business (after discounting down from a higher price). I can't remember what our pricing structure for secondhand items but in this instance there can be risk involved due to lack of accredited history and the need to offer a warranty, along with buying in stock that you don't always want because you've got shelves full of guns anyway. Also as regards warranty repairs, the shop had to bear the cost of two way postage quite often.

After three months I gave up my share of the business as I realised that it was a mugs game working six hours a day and travelling 45 miles to sit in a shop and not get paid after spending an absolute fortune buying in new stock over that period.

Unfortunately if you don't like the shops buying in strategy all you can do is try elsewhere or look at selling privately. Lastly, there's only one valuation that you really want to know, that's the price that an interested buyer wants to actually pay you for the item.

Vic Thompson.

Interesting Vic, there are some businesses that operate on a 3% or even less, profit margin.

[angrybear]

Well as I said there were two air rifles that I was interested in the shop which would have total over a £1000, I guess there's not much profit in two budget guns costing over that sum?

The problem is that that your "trade in" would probably exceed his 'profit' on those two so he might well be out of pocket unless/until he sold yours,
Kral aren't exactly huge sellers when new, so I doubt he's thrilled at the idea of investing money in something used, that might sit there for weeks/months on end.

The situation would be different if you were trading a popular seller like an AA410 for a new £1500+ rifle.

[norris]

The problem is that that your "trade in" would probably exceed his 'profit' on those two so he might well be out of pocket unless/until he sold yours,
Kral aren't exactly huge sellers when new, so I doubt he's thrilled at the idea of investing money in something used, that might sit there for weeks/months on end.

The situation would be different if you were trading a popular seller like an AA410 for a new £1500+ rifle.

Quite a few dealers sell KRAL air rifles so I wouldn't personally say there were an unpopular make. Also there's the Webley Mastiff and I wouldn't have thought that the AA410 (as good as it is and with the excellent service AA provide) these days is that popular?

[Vic Thompson]

"Interesting Vic, there are some businesses that operate on a 3% or even less, profit margin."

Yes there are, but only those who can turn their investment over many times a week or so.

The business that I was involved with had a gross turnover of £3000 to £12000 pw with maybe a net return of around £800 + pw on average : not a great amount to pay three peoples wages on (or maybe it is in your estimation) ?

And that includes one person who didn't get paid, ie, me.

Vic Thompson.