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Thread: Air Arms market survey / consultation

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by averageplinker View Post
    For those that think sales of HW break barrels demonstrate a market for an AA version answer me this. When was the last time HW developed a Break barrel rifle pretty much from scratch??
    Weihrauchs last break barrel developed from scratch was in 1980, but the design was by Robert Beeman and Weihrauch.

  2. #17
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    Perhaps I’m too cynical, but I’m afraid I think that is more an effort to harvest customers’ email addresses than a genuine effort at market research to inform product development.

    It’s a well-known trick. Tell us what you think. But we don’t actually care what you think. We just want you to tick the box that lets us market stuff to you.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geezer View Post
    Perhaps I’m too cynical, but I’m afraid I think that is more an effort to harvest customers’ email addresses than a genuine effort at market research to inform product development.

    It’s a well-known trick. Tell us what you think. But we don’t actually care what you think. We just want you to tick the box that lets us market stuff to you.


    The link doesn't work for me, so they'll be harvesting bugger all from me.

  4. #19
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    Pointless exercise.

    Nowhere near as indepth as it would be if this was true market research.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by T 20 View Post
    Weihrauchs last break barrel developed from scratch was in 1980, but the design was by Robert Beeman and Weihrauch.
    Is the correct answer. So the "youngest" design is 40+ years old. They have had minimal development costs for at least 40 years on their youngest model. It is a very different matter to develop one from scratch now it would not make economic sense even if a hundred of you handed AA a grand each and said make me a break barrel pretty please!
    Rich.
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by averageplinker View Post
    Is the correct answer. So the "youngest" design is 40+ years old. They have had minimal development costs for at least 40 years on their youngest model. It is a very different matter to develop one from scratch now it would not make economic sense even if a hundred of you handed AA a grand each and said make me a break barrel pretty please!
    Rich.
    He’s right.

    AA are not making the “AA99S” that we all want.

    They have said they are not going to do that.

    And it would be a stupid move for them. The market does not exist to be viable and justify the development, tooling up, and effect on production of things that do sell like the TX family.

    If you want to introduce a genuinely new springer (rather old wine in new bottles), it needs to make 20-30 ft-lbs, preferably in .25” and even .30”, and to be as cheap as possible. Because that’s what Americans want, and they are the biggest market.

    The Turks (Hatsan) have sussed that. Maybe SIG have with the ASP.

    The Umarex LGV/LGU and “Mark 4” FWB Sport show that the Germans haven’t and still think it’s 1984 and people will pay in large numbers for a better 12-14 ft-lbs high-quality springer.

  7. #22
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    If the survey was a ploy to get e mail addresses to help marketing, why was the survey sent to me by e mail? A bit pointless really.

    But yes, I felt the questions were very shallow. Maybe they gave it to a newcomer as a work experience exercise.

    Cheers, Phil

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Russell View Post
    If the survey was a ploy to get e mail addresses to help marketing, why was the survey sent to me by e mail? A bit pointless really.

    But yes, I felt the questions were very shallow. Maybe they gave it to a newcomer as a work experience exercise.

    Cheers, Phil
    It may be a GDPR compliance issue, since the law changed last year.

  9. #24
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    No you can’t have a break barrel. Here is a shamal/300/400 with a new stock 🤣🤣
    "But we have our own dream and our own task. We are with Europe, but not of it. We are linked, but not comprised. We are interested and associated, but not absorbed."
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  10. #25
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    harvey_s is offline Lost love child of David Niven and Victoria Beckham
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    Given that a break barrel is only marginally more complicated than a knife & fork, it amazes me that so many of them are flawed in some way.
    Furthermore given that mass produced guns like the Hw98 laminate and AA Prosports are now £600...it does show the market is willing to pay high prices.
    I'd like to see them go the whole hog and make a real quality break barrel - by that I mean something ISP Spartan-like complete with fluted barrel and hand finished tuned internals - even if they were 4 times the price, if they were done properly I reckon they would sell enough of them to make it worthwhile.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by harvey_s View Post
    Given that a break barrel is only marginally more complicated than a knife & fork, it amazes me that so many of them are flawed in some way.
    Furthermore given that mass produced guns like the Hw98 laminate and AA Prosports are now £600...it does show the market is willing to pay high prices.
    I'd like to see them go the whole hog and make a real quality break barrel - by that I mean something ISP Spartan-like complete with fluted barrel and hand finished tuned internals - even if they were 4 times the price, if they were done properly I reckon they would sell enough of them to make it worthwhile.
    If it is so simple and a guaranteed money spinner why not have a crack at it yourself lol

    Seriously though, what you are describing will not make any/sufficient money for a manufacturer otherwise someone would be doing it.

    If this what I wanted I would get an HW customised, reblued, tuned and custom stocked to my liking/specification. To get it all done to a high standard would be well over a grand plus the cost of the base rifle.

    Ignore the reblue, get a nice enough but not special custom stock from CS Sheffield and a stage 1 or 2 tune and you could be looking at £400-450 plus the base rifle.

    And if it really must be British start with a Tommy or a longbow.

    Rich.
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  12. #27
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    I'm still trying to work out why AirArms would need telling to make a break barrel.

    Most of the Major Airgun manufacturers produce break barrel airguns which I expect form the highest percentage of new Airgun sales --- so why ask if folks want a break barrel from AirArms ?

    Surely asking what specification folks would like to see if AirArms produced a break barrel would be a better question to ask ?

    Anyway, AirArms I want a 25mm bore by 81mm stroke rotating piston gun --- just build it round a TX piston and CD trigger unit to save money and developement.




    All the best Mick

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by T 20 View Post
    Anyway, AirArms I want a 25mm bore by 81mm stroke rotating piston gun --- just build it round a TX piston and CD trigger unit to save money and developement
    Certainly, and how will sir be paying the £200k charge? Cash? Cheque? 3 live unicorns????
    WANTED: Next weeks winning lottery numbers :-)

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by averageplinker View Post
    Certainly, and how will sir be paying the £200k charge? Cash? Cheque? 3 live unicorns????
    I could make my own for less than £200 if I start with a secondhand HW80.

  15. #30
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    They are being... or have been overtaken by others... even Daystate is well ahead wit FX being the leader for the biggies. Lots of innovative, more competitive makees out there erroding market place.

    A break barrel is going to do nothing for them at all and they already have a big catch up mission on their hands.

    They follow. They dont innovate. Its cheaper and I still dont feel they listen. I see no benefit in talking to the deaf sorry to say
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