Would a sliding breach Airsporter be worth the effort?

[look no hands]

Hi all, would converting my RB2 Airsporter to a sliding breach arrangement be worth all the effort and cost, the firing cycle of the RB2 needs work, I know from Shedders readings that the piston is far to heavy and other things (yes I know it's a BSA), I know converting my rifle would probably make it unique, but would it be much better over an intense tune up, also I'd be losing that great finger saving safety feature of the rotating breach and probably not having a anti bear trap either, so would you entertain it?

[Biker_Bob]

No.
The rotary breach is for me the ultimate loading mechanism for fixed barrel guns.
Yes the TP length is elongated as a result but I just cannot abide the idea of putting my fingers into a Guillotine on purpose.
If the the firing cycle is bad then surely basic tuning work (piston weight, guides, preload etc) will sort it out?
And if you did manage to do it, you've made your gun far less valuable / unsellable.

[TonyL]

Agree with Bob.

And, although I accept the TP would be even longer, the one on the LGV doesn't exactly wreck the rifle.

[look no hands]

Thank you for agreeing with what my mind is also thinking, I just have to question it sometimes but it's interesting to think what it would be like if BSA had gone down that route.

[greenwayjames]

Agree with Bob.

And, although I accept the TP would be even longer, the one on the LGV doesn't exactly wreck the rifle.

It isnt the length so much as the bends that are detrimental

[WILBA]

Thank you for agreeing with what my mind is also thinking, I just have to question it sometimes but it's interesting to think what it would be like if BSA had gone down that route.

If they had it would just be a hw77 clone though. Rotary breech made it stand out as different and a whole lot safer.

[Hsing-ee]

Thank you for agreeing with what my mind is also thinking, I just have to question it sometimes but it's interesting to think what it would be like if BSA had gone down that route.

Boiling things down to the very essence, the thing that is good about a BSA Airsporter is its barrel and it's sleek looks.

So going with your idea, get a good BSA barrel and graft it on to a Air Arms ProSport. This will make the metal parts of that rifle 100% British which I think you will appreciate.

Getting swoopy sleek styling out of a ProSport is beyond my imagination, but I am sure it can be done, reduce the depth of forward undercarriage and get a swoop on the back end.

Sliding Breech Conversion - a cautionary tale ..

I bought a Original Diana 50 sliding breech conversion from Protek once, there was also a Webley Mk III in the same homemade configuration. The engineer made the thing work but it used a kind of plug instead of a inner sliding compression chamber ... imagine a RB breech which pushes the spring back into the chamber when cocked. The person had engineering skill but no idea of airgun principles as the massively long TP and lack of breech seal as well as a weird radius on the breech meant the rifle made 2 fpe. I ended up breaking the rifle for parts as while it was a curiosity it was functionally useless and also dangerous as all that was holding the piston back was that three ball trigger mech. The tap had been removed, and the barrel breech end pushed through where the tap was and reseated where transfer port would normally have its opening into the compression chamber.

So I believe you COULD probably make this conversion, it is not likely to be much good, and it will cost you a lot to gain nothing.

What I have read about the Airsporter both the taploader and the RB2 is that there is no difference in accuracy with the RB2, why this is I cannot imagine. Several people say that if you get a 'good' Airsporter then they can give fine accuracy, so maybe it is a matter of either finding one of those or getting someone with the skill to fit the tap PERFECTLY. So if it was me on a quest for the 'perfect' Airsporter, I would buy one of the best models, which seem to be the Mk 2 or the Airsporter 'S' with the heavy barrel, and just keep buying and selling them until I found a good one, or get a nice one and get someone who knows their stuff to fit the tap perfectly, shimming or lapping as necessary. The RB series look like they should work but on here no one seems to think they are ever better than average, plus they have a huge compression chamber for 12 fpe use. I guess the SuperStar was the rifle that answered the question of the Ultimate BSA Fixed Barrel Springer.

Good luck.

[hmangphilly]

No.
The rotary breach is for me the ultimate loading mechanism for fixed barrel guns.
Yes the TP length is elongated as a result but I just cannot abide the idea of putting my fingers into a Guillotine on purpose.
If the the firing cycle is bad then surely basic tuning work (piston weight, guides, preload etc) will sort it out?
And if you did manage to do it, you've made your gun far less valuable / unsellable.

My view is Completely the opposite of this .^^

there;s more to it than a long Tp . There's pellet seating and the transition from tap to barrel leade that cause concern . Can't think of a reason you wouldnt want to put the pellet directly into the leade

Not that I'm saying I'm right. But how many competition rifles use loading taps ?

[Hsing-ee]

My view is Completely the opposite of this .^^

there;s more to it than a long Tp . There's pellet seating and the transition from tap to barrel leade that cause concern . Can't think of a reason you wouldnt want to put the pellet directly into the leade

Not that I'm saying I'm right. But how many competition rifles use loading taps ?

The RB2 (roller breach Mk 2) IS a direct breech-loading system, Bob’s not talking about the tap-loader.

[tinbum]

No, it will still be an airsporter

[Hsing-ee]

No, it will still be an airsporter

Very true.

Probably the best thing is to get the Mk I and just enjoy its unscoped post War craftsmanship and early Jet Age styling. If it had been any good performance wise there’d be no need for the HWs or the TX..

[WILBA]

Boiling things down to the very essence, the thing that is good about a BSA Airsporter is its barrel and it's sleek looks.

So going with your idea, get a good BSA barrel and graft it on to a Air Arms ProSport. This will make the metal parts of that rifle 100% British which I think you will appreciate.

Getting swoopy sleek styling out of a ProSport is beyond my imagination, but I am sure it can be done, reduce the depth of forward undercarriage and get a swoop on the back end.

Sliding Breech Conversion - a cautionary tale ..

I bought a Original Diana 50 sliding breech conversion from Protek once, there was also a Webley Mk III in the same homemade configuration. The engineer made the thing work but it used a kind of plug instead of a inner sliding compression chamber ... imagine a RB breech which pushes the spring back into the chamber when cocked. The person had engineering skill but no idea of airgun principles as the massively long TP and lack of breech seal as well as a weird radius on the breech meant the rifle made 2 fpe. I ended up breaking the rifle for parts as while it was a curiosity it was functionally useless and also dangerous as all that was holding the piston back was that three ball trigger mech. The tap had been removed, and the barrel breech end pushed through where the tap was and reseated where transfer port would normally have its opening into the compression chamber.

So I believe you COULD probably make this conversion, it is not likely to be much good, and it will cost you a lot to gain nothing.

What I have read about the Airsporter both the taploader and the RB2 is that there is no difference in accuracy with the RB2, why this is I cannot imagine. Several people say that if you get a 'good' Airsporter then they can give fine accuracy, so maybe it is a matter of either finding one of those or getting someone with the skill to fit the tap PERFECTLY. So if it was me on a quest for the 'perfect' Airsporter, I would buy one of the best models, which seem to be the Mk 2 or the Airsporter 'S' with the heavy barrel, and just keep buying and selling them until I found a good one, or get a nice one and get someone who knows their stuff to fit the tap perfectly, shimming or lapping as necessary. The RB series look like they should work but on here no one seems to think they are ever better than average, plus they have a huge compression chamber for 12 fpe use. I guess the SuperStar was the rifle that answered the question of the Ultimate BSA Fixed Barrel Springer.

Good luck.

Does the airsporter S have a heavier barrel then? I have an airsporter S. Not sure the barrel looks any heavier than a normal airsporter to look at

[TonyL]

It isnt the length so much as the bends that are detrimental

Thank you. Accepted. I've not ever studied that rotary breech in detail.

As regards a possible conversion, and as others have suggested, still better to keep it with the original set-up. A good many users / owners will prefer the safety of this design and it gave these rifles a character and unique selling point. And how much of an engineering project would be entailed? And the result? A "butchered" rifle that still wouldn't hold a candle to the HW77/97 and TX, due to their far superior triggers and much better firing cycles due to their narrower bore and lighter internals.

Leave and enjoy as it is.

[look no hands]

Does the airsporter S have a heavier barrel then? I have an airsporter S. Not sure the barrel looks any heavier than a normal airsporter to look at

The standard barrel is 15.5mm thick and the S's have a 17mm barrel.

[MartynB]

On the RB, isn't transper port inline with centre of cylinder ? As others have said very safe to load and direct to breach