Idiots guide to classic airgun strips (pt 1)

[ggggr]

Its worth noting that this hole in the cylinder can stretch when big springs have been fitted. Im sure there are people on here who can weld them up and redrill but just dont fit a powerful spring. Meteor springs seem a better fit in hawks than hawk spring Ive tried recently and the Diana 25 spring remains a soft plinkers option. Release pressure on cylinder and end cap and mainspring should come out. Ease piston out. These had a ptfe washer rivetted on (Nibbs sells them ) But I prefer a leather one held by a screw and nut. SEE THREAD "hawk mk 1 info" post 13 by DCL DAVE. Thats the sort of thing I did. Lube up and put back together. Piston in and then mainspring and push down on cylinder the same as in stripdown to replace end cap and pin. Place sear and searspring on safety catch and slide into housing,locate,put pin in and circlip on. Fit trigger spring onto trigger with long leg behind trigger and locate,pin and circlip. (if your cylinder pin hole is worn and cap is a little off the cylinder, you may have to use a piece of shim steel to cover the gap to stop trigger spring going into it whilst you are replacing it. Replace cam in breech and replace circlip. Replace barrel and secure. GO TO NEXT POST

[ggggr]

Place breech in jaws and locate pivot pin in right jaw and line up with pivot hole. Push it in just enough to locate and then put plunger spring and plunger into their hole and depress and then push pin right through. Replace cocking arm and roll pin. Fit action in stock and tighten screws.
The safety catch on Webleys are not great. The mk 1 and some mk2,s are automatic but if you cut the bit of the safety catch off at the front (the bit the cocking arm pushes) then they become manual. On the mk 1 there is a shelf on the side of the safety catch that stops the sear from moving. On the mk 2 its at the back an stops the trigger from moving but these (mk2) aseem more likely to break off. The Hawk mk3 has the "wrap around" catch where the rear of the trigger cant move upwards because it hits the wrap around. NEXT THE HAWK MK 2 AND HAWK MK 3.

[ggggr]

This strip also applies to the vulan except it has a different piston head set up, "a ptfe set up and a rubber buffer" according to Phil Bulmer, which may be changed for a stingray set up on some vulcans,again according to Phil Bulmer.
Read previous post about problems with fitting big mainsprings and the gun not cocking. A quick strip guide can be found on thread "Webley hawk disassembley" 7/o7/08, post 3.
Remove sights. Remove front two stock screws and one in front of trigger guard. Remove action from stock. Remove cocking arm pivot roll pin and then remove cocking arm. Break barrel and depress barrel plunger and remove pivot pin. Release pressure and remove plunger and spring. Remove breech block and barrel. IF YOU ARE GOING TO CHANGE BREECH SEAL WASHER ON CYLINDER IT IS ALWAYS EASIER TO DO IT WITH BARREL OFF---ALSO APPLIES TO PISTOLS. BREECH SEAL SHOULD HAVE ROUNDED SIDE FACING OUT. Undo trigger adjusting allen screw on top of cylinder end block to take pressure off trigger spring. GO TO NEXT POST

[ggggr]

Damn--lost a post. Anyhow,remove trigger pin circlips and remove the trigger pin and remove trigger and its spring. Remove other two trigger pins and pull out safety catch, sear and sear spring. Place cylinder, end cap down, on a block of wood, with the flat of the cap on the wood and the pointy bit overhanging. Push down and remove pin and release pressure. End cap, spring and piston can be withdrawn. The ptfe piston rings can be replaced with "o" rings but I dont know the size. I replaced 1 ring on a rough gun I had to get it going. clean and lube gun and put back together. Put piston, spring and endcap in cylinder (as with removal) and push on cylinder and replace pin. The breech block can be placed in jaws and located with pivot pin. Depress plunger and spring and push pin home. Replace cocking arm and pivot roll pin. Place sear spring onto sear and sear onto safety catch and put into trigger housing and line up with pins. Push the front two pins through and replace circlips. push trigger spring into end cap and push trigger up until it lines up and push that pin through and secure with circlip. Tighten the adjuster screw on the end cap. Go to next post.

[ggggr]

The back of the sear spring can be hooked over the top of the sear with a small screwdriver or two. Replace the action in the stock replace stock screws and replace sights.

[ggggr]

I was hoping someone would put up the Webley sheets but they aint yet. The Osprey is more or less a sidelever Hawk mk3 and the trigger info above applies. Remove sights and the 2 stock screws, one at fore end of stock and one in front of trigger guard. Remove action and watch out for lump of metal in stock that helps locate rifle. Unscrew loading tap lever screw and remove spring and push out tap. You can change the seal if you want. Unscew trigger adjuster on top of endcap and remove circlips from trigger pins. Remove trigger pin and trigger and its spring. Remove other two pins and slide out safety, sear and sear spring.Take circlip off the ratchet and remove pin,ratchet and spacer (noting how it goes). Unscrew the pawl spring screw and remove spring and pawl. Knock out cocking arm pin and remove cocking arm. Knock out sidelever pin and remove sidelever and spring (noting how it goes) .Undo the allen screw in the end cap that secures the cylinder end pin. Push down on cylinder end plug and remove the cylinder pin. Release pressure and the end plug should come out, followed by mainspring and piston. (I had a problem with the endcap being really tight and it was a case of pointing it into some rap and waiting for iy to move and then knocking it out with a piece of wood) in this case ease it before you replace it. GO TO NEXT POST.

[ggggr]

You can replace the piston rings with "O" rings as in Hawk mk 2 and 3 posts. Clean, lube and put back together. Put piston, spring and end cap back and replace cylinder end pin. Locate sidelever spring and sidelever and replace its pin and tighten the small grub screw up in the trigger block that pushes onto the pin (have a look at the block from the back where the sidelever goes). Replace cocking arm in its slot and line up with hole on sidelever and replace its pin. Replace the pawl and its spring and then the ratchet (and spacer) and pin and circlip. Replace loading tap, spring and lever and make sure the lever is pressed fully home before tightening its screw. Replace the trigger as in the Hawk mk 2 and 3 posts above (to save me time). Locate action in stock, checking you haven,t dropped that little metal locating dowel. Tighten both stock screws and replace sights.

[Gareth W-B]

This thread is really looking good. Think you are doing a fantastic job there ggggr, and I and many others really appreciate it. In fact, this is such a useful thread that I am going to make it a Collectors Corner sticky . Keep up the 'sterling' work (little collectors play on words there ). Atvb: G.

[ggggr]

I have never done an early junior--Only the mk2 I bought off here a few months back that my nephew now owns. Remove grips and rearsight. Unscrew barrel catch screw and remove(watching for plunger + spring). There are only two trigger pins which require a 3/32 pin punch. Remove the rear one and the trigger should come out. Remove second and sear and its spring should come out. Unscrew the barrel pivot screw. I used the barrel pivot to unscrew the cylinder end plug----------but only do this if it comes easily---otherwise use something else! Remove mainspring. Cocking arm should lift out of the slot. Withdraw piston (sometimes on Webley pistols these are tight on the ptfe washer and you may need to drift it with a bit of dowel or similar). The one I saw had a screw on ptfe washer. Chances are if the piston was tight coming out then the washer is okay and wont need changing. With everything out of the way,its easiest to change breech washer now, with rounded side facing barrel. I usually wipe with grease and use side of small screw driver and then push barrel onto wsher to seat firmly. Clean and lube. Replace piston and mainspring and screw on endcap. Locate cocking link in slot and line up barrel and replace pivot pin. Replace sear and spring and line up and replace pin. Replace trigger and screw. Replace barrel catch (dont forget plunger + spring) and pin and then rear sight and grips. ONE OF THE BEST TO START ON. CHEERS GARETH---THIS IS ALMOST IDENTICAL TO THE EARLY JUNIOR APART FROM THE BARREL CATCH AND A LEATHER PISTON WASHER.


Just a bit of additional info. When someone was asking about being able to reface a worn sear ------------"Ref Webley Jnr sears; as far as I'm aware, they're high carbon and cyanide hardened; not sure how deep that penetrates but once they wear they seem to ''profile'' to the piston really quicky. They can be ground easily but I'm not sure how much hardness would be retained and so how long they'd last or even be safe.
For a gun that's going to be used I'd agree a new sear is the way to go. "

Additional information. Regards to the piston washer screw on a Junior "Junior piston washer screw only shows one size, R/H; 0.205" X 30tpi whit form. "

[ggggr]

This is a late model Senior. Remove grips and rear sight. Remove barrel catch stop screw,barrel catch pivot and barrel catch. Watch out for barrel catch plunger and small spring. You can get to the piston washer on these, premiers and junior mk 2 without stripping the trigger (Hurricane,Typhoon and Tempest) but go for the full strip. Remove both trigger guard pins and trigger guard with a 3/32 pin punch. Remove trigger pin and trigger,sear and leaf spring should come out (note positions and that trigger hooks into sear). Remove barrel pivot lock screw and then pivot screw.Slide cocking lever out of slot and then unscrew endcap (I usually use the barrel as the cap is not usually tight--If it is then use something else. Withdraw mainspring and piston. Piston washer is a phosphor bronze ring that could be changed for "O" ring. Change breech washer if required, These were leather with a little brass bush but the usual Webley one fits, round end to the barrel.Clean and lube. Replace piston, spring and endcap. Locate cocking link in slot and replace barrel. replace pivot screw and lock screw. Put leaf spring up into trigger housing,put trigger into the sear and slide up into housing. Put guard on and then locate and replace all 3 pins. Replace barrel catch plunger spring and plunger and then barrel catch and screw. Replace grips and rearsight.



None cocking Webley Senior-----taken form what I posted on a thread recently.

"Ok. Here is what to do.
You have removed the mainspring? Put the guide back in and leave the barrel and linkage off the gun. Slide the piston back with a screwdriver or similar. Hopeully the piston should engage.
If it doesnt, then remove the guide and slide the piston a bit further back and see if it engages. If it now engages, check to see if you have the right piston in it. A Senior one should have a bronze ring as a seal. Mk 1's have a leather seal and Premiers and later guns usually have a Ptfe seal. All the pistons will go in but they will not work.
IF a new sear has been fitted at some point they sometimes need bit of the holding face grinding away to allow the piston to engage.

Assuming that the piston engages while you have the guide in, then try to push it forward a bit against the sear and the sear should hold.

If the sear does not hold the piston then either your sear is worn or the holding ring face on the piston-- Or both.

If with the guide in the piston does engage then that would suggest worn linkages/ cocking shoe, or the fulcrum on the cylinder being worn.

Usually bent pins are not the cause of a gun not cocking, but rather a symptom of people using excessive force to try to get the gun to cock.

More often that not, the problems start with a worn cocking shoe.

I will assume you have got the sear in the right way round. with the high side to the front of the gun and the lower more rounded side to the breech."

[ggggr]

This is an early premier. As the premier has 5 pins in the trigger (including the guard) they can be more battered than other Webley pistols. It may be worthwhile filing any spread pins when you have the pistol apart. It is also worthwhile filing any burrs on inside of trigger housing and maybe stoning the sides of trigger and sear. I did this and used Gn paste on the sides.
Remove grips and rearsight (its up to you). Undo barrel catch screw and remove catch, plunger and spring. You can undo trigger adjuster lock screw and adjuster to make it easier to clean up housing. Remove front amd rear pins from trigger guard with 3/32 punch. Remove the trigger stop pin, then the trigger pin and withdraw trigger and its spring. Remove sear pin and withdraw sear and its spring. Undo barrel pivot lock screw and barrel pivot and lift barrel up and slide cocking arm out of its slot. Undo endcap (keeping pressure on ) and remove along with mainspring and piston. Do breech washer now if you want to (rounded side to barrel). Piston washer is ptfe screwed on. Clean and lube. Replace piston, mainspring and endcap. Locate cocking lever in slot and line up barrel with its pivot hole. GO TO NEXT POST

[ggggr]

Replace pivot screw and lock screw. Place sear spring in hole on top of sear and place it in housing and replace its pin. Then put trigger spring into trigger and push that into housing and replace its pin. Then replace the trigger stop pin. Replace the trigger guard and its two pins. If you have removed them, youcan now fit the trigger adjuster and lock screw. Replace barrel catch spring,plunger and barrel catch and replace its screw. Refit sight and grips.
Webley premier sears can wear and the gun wont cock. Thats part of the reason I suggested deburring triggr housing and stoning sides of trigger and sear. The burrs can stop the sear from moving freely and stops the sear from engaging with the piston. I used gn paste on the sear and trigger but WARNING--THIS STUFF IS SLIPPY AND I HAVE HAD GUNS THAT THE TRIGGER HAS GONE TOO LIGHT ON AND HAD TO CLEAN IT OFF AND USE MACHINE OIL. ---USEFUL TIP ON OLD GUNS!

[ggggr]

This strip will be easy for me to do. Remove sights and grips. Drift out barrel catch pivot if you want to grease it and the plunger. Remove pin at front of plastic cylinder sleeve and remove sleeve.Knock out pins at either end of triggr guard and remove it and the little sear spring. Remove the other pins one at a time to remove sear stop pin, sear,trigger and trigger spring. It then strips like the other Webley pistols. As the original link on this thread has been deleted, added a new one at the bottom. What I will say is this--follow the guide regarding the sear otherwise the thing wont cock (seen two with this problem). The easiest way Ive found to fit the safety catch is to just put it in with the cut out facing the back of the trigger and then fit the safety spring. The other thing is when you replace the endcap and guide, make sure the little plate the cocking arm pushes against is in place or the gun wont cock. I did that one Saturday night and then saw the bit in the tin put the bits in, DOH!
This guide should do the Hurricane and old Typhoon.
By the way--As these have the split ptfe washer, I have wound 1 turn of ptfe tape round the spiggot it goes on before replacing washer to save on getting new washer as the gun is just for plinking. Just trying this linky http://mediacdn.shopatron.com/media/.../131037909.pdf

If you fancy having a go at "tuning" the trigger then try this-

He is a bit about Tempest?Hurricane trigger fettling. Refer to these pics http://www.airgunspares.com/store/pr...t-Pistol-Sear/
http://www.airgunspares.com/store/pr...-Trigger-Wide/
I use 320 and 400 grit wet and dry paper to do them and they seem ok. With the sear, I polish both sides of the rounded bits on top, even though, the piston should not really touch them. I polish and try to take the angle back a touch more, the angled side of the cut out on the right of the picture. On the long leg I go the front face,the underside and the angled bit where it joins the back. (MORE ON THIS IN A BIT). On the trigger I do the flat face above the arc of the trigger blade, the face behind it and reduce the BUMP between that and the bit going up to the pin hole. This BUMP and the back bit of the leg of the sear are what "pauses" the trigger pull before releasing the piston. If you do a little work on the sear and the trigger, you can hold them in your fingers and rub one against another to get a good idea of this.Even with the BUMP on the trigger taken down a bit,I find slightly rounding the back edge of the sear helps. DO NOT GO MAD DOING THIS! Remember you can always have another go, but you cannot replace material.

A tuning link for the Tempest https://www.airgunnation.com/threads...r-tune.848192/


https://forum.vintageairgunsgallery....ebley-tempest/

[Vulcanator]

Here are a couple of links for the Tempest/Hurricane trigger group, I rotated the images.



Photobucket won't let me load these as images for some reason but the links should be good.

[ggggr]

The two guns are similar although the major is larger,has different sights, a longer cylinder and barrel and an adjustable trigger. Early versions had a small stock screw in front of the trigger guard and later ones the large bolt through the stock into the trigger block (5/16 BSF by the way). The front ones are 7/32 Bsf and you will have to get them from Nibbs if you need them unless somebody could make a batch up? The barrel and the trigger housing are interchangable on the guns but if you fitted the major barrel to a cadet you would need to retain the cadet cocking arm.
Remove stock screws and remove action from stock. remove cocking arm pin and cocking arm. Knock out barrel pivot arm remove barrel and watch out for plunger and spring which are just pushed into the cylinder and not retained. If you have to change the breech washer its a bugger to fit a new leather one (your on your own with that) but in AGW the bloke used a bit of plastic with 12mm OD and 8MM ID and habd finished it. I have heard of people using two "O" rings. If its a Major you can undo sear adjuster screw a bit then knock out sear pin and remove sear spring and sear. GO TO NEXT POST