6 or 4.5, that's the question!

[RJVB]

As I mentioned elsewhere, I'm getting hooked on a nice bit of target shooting practice ... but apparently also on doing that with a realistic replica. I tested those particular waters with the cheapest BB springer that appealed to me (a Cybergun/KWC 1911A1 full metal slide), which is fun in my little apartment, but not entirely satisfying. So I find myself hesitating between a Tanfoglio Witness, and a KJW 1911 M.E.U GBB. The former needs no introduction here, the latter maybe a bit more (haven't seen any mention of KJW guns on here?!): http://www.kjworksusa.com/kjw_kp-07_k1911_meu.shtml .
I've been exchanging with an airsoft reseller, and they seem to consider that KJW builds better quality replicas than KWC - at least the KP series is in fact identical to a series by Marui (a top brand from what I gathered), but in mostly metal execution. That also means that Marui accessories fit, like the GDI precision barrels. The KJW also has an adjustable front sight.
However, I can't seem to decide. I can't shake the feeling that 4.5mm metal bbs shot at over 2J should be more precise than 6mm plastic bbs shot at about half the energy (initial speeds must be similar, but inertia and air friction are both in favour of the metal bbs). If of course the gun construction allows for that ... I also have this feeling that for the real precision, one should better use a good air gun that doesn't aim at being something else (like my good old Webley Premier, a HW40, a Crosman, whatever could also serve in a bit of pest control). To top it off, I'm not that enthusiastic about what I read of the Tanfoglio's CO2 "mileage" (or lack thereof) ... nor am I about the idea of buying cartridges I'll have to dispose off after emptying them of the greenhouse gaz they contain... Still, the KJW can also use CO2 chargers, should one want to.
Of course it would be nice if one could convert the 6mm gun into a 4.5mm metal bb gun through some kit ... or the TFW to use something else as a propellant.

Any thoughts to help me decide?

And btw, are there compressors or similar tools out there that allow to fill gaz chargers with ambient air instead of from a bottle of (green) gaz?

[magicniner]

And btw, are there compressors or similar tools out there that allow to fill gaz chargers with ambient air instead of from a bottle of (green) gaz?

Use Propane, that's what some of the serious airsoft shooters do, you can buy a fill nozzle to fit the plumber's blowlamp cylinders,
ATB,
Nick

[themorganator]

PROPANE!!! Will have to cut the fags out then when shooting several hundred shots in the garage.

[RJVB]

Luckily I don't smoke (But maybe one can think of an alternative way to make tracer bbs with this propellant? )

So yeah, propane. That's also what's used for refillable cig lighters and camping gaz, no?

But doesn't one have to do a conversion on the gun or charger to use it? Or is that unnecessary on a gun that can also use CO2 cartridges (with a different charger though)?

[RJVB]

Nick - is this the fill nozzle you were referring to? http://www.airsoft-innovations.com//...ne-adaptor-kit
Or is there something similar available in Europe?

[magicniner]

Nick - is this the fill nozzle you were referring to? http://www.airsoft-innovations.com//...ne-adaptor-kit
Or is there something similar available in Europe?

Yes,
That's for Airsoft pistols that run on Green Gas.
Works fine, outdoors only and stinks!

[magicniner]

Luckily I don't smoke (But maybe one can think of an alternative way to make tracer bbs with this propellant? )

So yeah, propane. That's also what's used for refillable cig lighters and camping gaz, no?

But doesn't one have to do a conversion on the gun or charger to use it? Or is that unnecessary on a gun that can also use CO2 cartridges (with a different charger though)?

The guns that also run on CO2 come wit two mags, on is Airsoft (green gas, sub 1 Joule energy) the other is Air Pistol (CO2, loads more power, banned on skirmish sites) and the reason these are available over ther counter from UK RFDs
ATB,
Nick

[RJVB]

Yes,
That's for Airsoft pistols that run on Green Gas.
Works fine, outdoors only and stinks!

There's another one from Madbull available on fleabay ... but of course if that makes the gun stink ... (themorganator thought about fa**s when he wrote fags? )

The KJW M.E.U I'm considering doesn't come with 2 magazines, though.

Something else - is the potential precision gain a PDI Raven 6.01 barrel can give on this kind of gun worth the cost (about 25€)?

[magicniner]

There's another one from Madbull available on fleabay ... but of course if that makes the gun stink ... (themorganator thought about fa**s when he wrote fags? )

The KJW M.E.U I'm considering doesn't come with 2 magazines, though.

Something else - is the potential precision gain a PDI Raven 6.01 barrel can give on this kind of gun worth the cost (about 25€)?

The upgrade barrels do improve power and accuracy, whether they're worth it is your decision, it's easy to spend the initial price of the pistol several times over in upgrades,
ATB,
Nick

[RJVB]

Thanks! Indeed, even for a newby like me it's quite easily evident that one can spend lots of money on this.
Any chance you could give an estimate of the improvement, say in percents? Are we talking less than 1%, around 5%, 10%?

To come back to the outdoor aspect of using propane: does that apply only to the filling or also the usage? Because from what I understand the typical green gaz sold is exactly the same thing, with maybe a bit of lubricant added. BTW, I can get a 1000ml bottle of Ultrair for 8.90€ (plus postage); the "real world" propane canisters I've seen 'till now are either smaller (and not less expensive) or much larger.
Guess it would really be neat to have an adapter for a simple airpump!

[RJVB]

Well, so I pulled the trigger on the KJWorks KP07 1911 M.E.U replica, last week. Received it last Thursday, and am not too unpleased On the 1st five or so of shots I managed a grouping of about an inch from 5.5m (max. distance I can get in my apartment). That must have been beginners luck, as I've since hardly been able to repeat that, and tend to shoot high despite aiming just under the target (as I've read one has to do?) and turning the hop-up all the way back/down. May need to break in? Or (more likely) it's me doing the wrong things trying to compensate for the recoil, which is considerable (for me anyways) on a fresh charge. Filling the mag isn't as straightforward as I'd have liked - it's too easy to misalign the bottle's nozzle and the mag's valve, and spray one's hand with a freezing substance. Also makes the number of shots from a single charge rather variable: I've seen between half a mag (13 BBs) to 30 or 31 shots. A CO2 cartridge gives about 2.5 mags autonomy.

What I'd have liked is a treaded barrel to be able to mount a silencer. I'd also like to grind (narrow) down the thumb safety switch a bit on the left but I have yet to figure out how to remove it (the exploded view suggests that the left and right bits are just clipsed into each other) - I find I'm activating the safety just a bit too easily when just gripping the gun securely...